camngnp223

Hi everyone,

Firstly, I wanted to write with an update. Thanks in no small part to all your advice, my wife has now been granted a spouse permanent residence visa (subclass 100) for Australia. (I should highlight that JAJ was especially helpful, giving hugely knowledgeable advice.)

I have just one small further query that I hope you might be able to help with. On the visa in my wife's passport, it says "visa granted 30 January 2009". We'll be going to Australia (for a visit only) on 15 Jul 2009. We currently live in the UK and don't have any imminent plans to immigrate to Australia but we would like to apply for Australian citizenship after my wife has been an Australian permanent resident for four years. My question is this: from when do we start counting down the four years (30 Jan 2009 or 15 Jul 2009)? Do we count from when the visa was granted or do we have to wait until the date on which we first enter Australia on the visa?

I'd be hugely grateful for your advice.

Many thanks and all the best!

Cameron

cookiestar

I think it's 4 years from the date she becomes resident of Australia (i.e. once she is actually living there)

camngnp223

Cookiestar, thanks for your response but I don't think that's it's quite right. Once you have the permanent residence visa (which you must validate by entering Australia within 12 months of your medical certification), time spent outside Australia with an Australian spouse (i.e. me) can be counted as Australian residence.

My question is as follows: For the purposes of applying for Australian citizenship after four years, does the permanent residence start from the date that the visa was awarded or from the date that you first entered Australia? (There could be up to a year's difference between these two dates.)

Huge thanks,

Cameron

cookiestar

In that case, read here: http://www.citizenship.gov.au/automa...ip/spouses.htm, and apologies for not being much more help. I'm sure someone else who knows will be along soon.

jenny79

permanent residency kicks off when you validate your visa... meaning that you enter australia by the date stipulated on the grant letter.

however, for citizenship purposes, if not mistaken, one has to live IN australia... as such the four years have to be IN australia not any other country.

but wait for others' reply. this is how i understood it to be by reading DIAC's site.

Pollyana

She MIGHT be able to count time outside Australia, as spouse of an Aussie, but that is really a question that is too specific for a forum like this. If you are going to aim to get citizenship for her on those grounds I suggest you speak to an agent or to the citizenship part of DIAC itself. I would imagijne that she would have to explain why you are living outside Australia - is it for ADF or diplomatic reasons for example?

And have you taken heed of JAJ's advice here -
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showp...70&postcount=5

camngnp223

Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to reply thus far.

We actually authored this thread in the hope that someone might be able to provide a definitive answer (perhaps with links to the DIAC site or some appropriate legislation?) about when permanent residency for the purposes of citizenship would commence in our case. Is it definitely set by the date on which we first entered on the visa rather than the date that the permanent residency visa was granted?

(As for the eligibility questions, JAJ was especially instrumental in clarifying the these in an earlier thread.)

Again huge thanks and we look forward to any further advice you might be able to give,

Cam

Pollyana

Jeremy gave you the link to the relevant DIAC provisions in his previous answer. Your case would be looked at under the citizenship proivisions that he linked to. No-one on here is going to be able to give you a more definitive answer than that I'm afraid.

camngnp223

I'm sorry, I really mustn't have been sufficiently clear in my previous posts.

We're not looking for any comment on eligibility for citizenship. We just looking for a clear stipulation on when permanent residency commences.

I believe that it's the date on which my wife first enters Australia using the visa, but I'm not sure. (The other option is that the residency commences on the date that the permanent residency visa was granted.)

Huge thanks,

Cam

cookiestar

I added a government link - did you have a look at that?

camngnp223

Cookiestar, yep! I could find no stipulation of when residency officially commences. (Could you?)

Huge thanks,

Cam

cookiestar

Didn't read it all, I must confess. Guess the first place to start getting an answer would be to email the contact point on the Government's Citizenship site. You'll get a definitive answer from them rather than a possibly correct one from an internet discussion board.

welshtony

Hi Cameron

JAJ is your expert on Citizenship but I think teh answer to your question, in terms of counting periods of permanent residence outside Australia, as inside Australia lies in the definition of "permanent resident" in tghe Citizenship Act:

5 Permanent resident


(1) For the purposes of this Act, a person is a permanent resident at a particular time if and only if:
(a) the person is present in Australia at that time and holds a permanent visa at that time; or

(b) both:

(i) the person is not present in Australia at that time and holds a permanent visa at that time; and

(ii) the person has previously been present in Australia and held a permanent visa immediately before last leaving Australia; or

(c) the person is covered by a determination in force under subsection (2) at that time.

(2) The Minister may, by legislative instrument, determine that:
(a) persons who hold a special category visa or a special purpose visa; or

(b) persons who have held a special category visa; or

(c) persons who are present in Norfolk Island or the Territory of Cocos (Keeling) Islands;

and who satisfy specified requirements are, or are during a specified period, persons to whom this subsection applies.


So, assuming your wife was not a previous permanen tresident of Australia, she needs to validate visa before having any chance of counting periods outside, as periods inside.

Regards


Tony Coates
MARN 0635896

SunnyMD

Forgive me if this is a personal question, but why would you want to apply for permanent residency with no plans to move to Australia, and even more puzzling, why would you then want to apply for Australian citizenship without having lived here ?

I thought the whole point of gaining residency privileges was so that applicants could live in Australia ?