Tomasz Nidecki

Hi all...

Due to the constantly declining economical situation in Poland and the sight of a war
probably coming to the western countries in the future years I'm thinking deeply
about moving to New Zealand. For good.

New Zealand was always my number one choice in the world as a place to live in, for
many many years. I've spent 4 years in Canada, but didn't really like it that much
there. From what I know about NZ, I like everything about it. But I know that I don't
know everything, so I might be mistaken in my judgement.

I don't know if anyone here wants to indulge in a discussion about the sense of
moving to NZ from now eastern, but soon to be "western" (if Poland joins EU) Europe.
I don't really see many perspectives of living here in the future. People who make
money in Poland are, unfortunately, in majority those who know how to make
"contacts", go around various laws and in general conduct businesses. People who are
professionals in a certain field, like me, tend to work away their living earning a
wage that in many cases isn't enough to buy one's own home... And those lucky few who
do earn more money, work so hard they have no time for themselves, for their family
and who generally pass away early due to stress... I don't want to be in either of
those groups, and I'm too straightforward and honest to conduct a business here in
Poland (I'm sorry if it seems unfair to other Poles, but this is my view formed by
observation through many years of living here...).

What's it like in NZ in this matter? Can one live normally, just working a normal day
job, not under heavy stress, not being afraid every day of the company going bankrupt
or something like that?... Can one afford a normal, average house, a car and, in
general, good living conditions from average salaries? What's the job market like in
NZ, not statistics, your feelings, your views are what's important to me...

If I were to migrate to NZ with my spouse I'd have to leave everything behind and
sell probably even my small 2-room apartment (I was lucky, I inherited it from my
grandparents, if I didn't I don't know where I'd be living! From my "professional"
salaries I'd barely afford to rent a 1-room apartment!). The costs of the whole
process are high for our standards. If I were to summarize all the costs of just
risking to apply for residence in NZ, it'd be twice the worth of my good old car. I
don't even know now where to get that kind of money, but I could work 2 jobs at a
time for a year or so to try to get it.

The funny thing is that in the past I thought that my future in Poland looks bright.
My command of English is quite good, well you should be the judge based on what I'm
writing here. I'm educated - finished tertiary education in Information Technology
(but never got a degree, I had to start working full-time and I had no time to
concentrate on a degree...) and have some tertiary education (1,5 years) in
journalism as well. I've been working for something like 8-9 years full time - mainly
in various computer magazines as an editor, but also in IT work: programming and
designing complex web sites (with scripting and databases), administering a linux
server for the past year or more, etc. (usually in parallel with working as an
editor). Do you think I stand a chance of finding a job in NZ with such skills? It'd
probably be hard in journalism, since English is not my mother tongue and I
definitely make mistakes, but perhaps in IT? What's the market like for Internet/Web
specialists in NZ?

Generally I'd appreciate all kind souls in sharing your views or perhaps anyone could
give me some directions as to where to try to find work. I'm constantly looking
through classifieds, but I realize that being here in Poland it's a small chance
anyone'd be willing not only to hire me, not really knowing me or ever seeing me, and
if I decided to go to NZ for 6 months looking for a job, I'd be risking everything
here: my current job and a lot of money compared to NZ standards...

--
tomasz 'tonid' nidecki, zoliborz, warszawa, poland [email protected]
http://tonid.net
http://endemic.org 'nie przejmuj sie, przytul
glonojada' (c)hubertus

James West

Wow! Erm Where can I start! I'm English and wanting to migrate to Australia even
though we have a good standard of living in UK. Why? Because the weather stinks here
and my wife is diagnosed with SAD (Seasonally Affected Disorder) and Australia offers
similar opportunities (See my earlier post to this ng "We really want to migrate to
australia - ...". What I can say is there are a lot of poles in the UK and having a
good life doing everything from running polish supermarkets / corner shops to heading
multi million pound accountancy firms! There are a lot of opportunities in the UK but
NO ONE wherever you go in this world is guaranteed a job for life and there is a
world recession (Even if it hasn't been admitted in the media) re - September 11th!
The company I work for made redundancies 6 months ago and everyone who was made
redundant is back in work and there is a reasonable welfare system that makes sure
tou have somewhere to live and alittle money if you are out of work and a "free" /
heavily subsidised National Health system which is having a MASSIVE injection of cash
plus a faulty but improving educational system. Nowaday's you are pretty unlucky if
you can't get work and a very few unfortunates live on the streets but there is some
help even for them. Steer clear of london and south of if you want to own your own
home though! Really unaffordable! I have lived all over the UK which is very densely
populated and never had a problem working (I'm 38 and in I.T.). I wish you luck and
hope this is of any use to you! Surprised you didn't like Canada.

Regards James West

[email protected]


"Tomasz Nidecki" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi all...
    > Due to the constantly declining economical situation in Poland and the sight of a
    > war probably coming to the western countries in the future years I'm thinking
    > deeply about moving to New Zealand. For good.
    > New Zealand was always my number one choice in the world as a place to live in, for
    > many many years. I've spent 4 years in Canada, but didn't really like it that much
    > there. From what I know about NZ, I like everything about it. But I know that I
    > don't know everything, so I might be mistaken in my judgement.
    > I don't know if anyone here wants to indulge in a discussion about the sense of
    > moving to NZ from now eastern, but soon to be "western" (if Poland joins EU)
    > Europe. I don't really see many perspectives of living here in the future. People
    > who make money in Poland are, unfortunately, in majority those who know how to make
    > "contacts", go around various laws and in general conduct businesses. People who
    > are professionals in a certain field, like me, tend to work away their living
    > earning a wage that in many cases isn't enough to buy one's own home... And those
    > lucky few who do earn more money, work so hard they have no time for themselves,
    > for their family and who generally pass away early due to stress... I don't want to
    > be in either of those groups, and I'm too straightforward and honest to conduct a
    > business here in Poland (I'm sorry if it seems unfair to other Poles, but this is
    > my view formed by observation through many years of living here...).
    > What's it like in NZ in this matter? Can one live normally, just working a normal
    > day job, not under heavy stress, not being afraid every day of the company going
    > bankrupt or something like that?... Can one afford a normal, average house, a car
    > and, in general, good living conditions from average salaries? What's the job
    > market like in NZ, not statistics, your feelings, your views are what's important
    > to me...
    > If I were to migrate to NZ with my spouse I'd have to leave everything behind and
    > sell probably even my small 2-room apartment (I was lucky, I inherited it from my
    > grandparents, if I didn't I don't know where I'd be living! From my "professional"
    > salaries I'd barely afford to rent a 1-room apartment!). The costs of the whole
    > process are high for our standards. If I were to summarize all the costs of just
    > risking to apply for residence in NZ, it'd be twice the worth of my good old car. I
    > don't even know now where to get that kind of money, but I could work 2 jobs at a
    > time for a year or so to try to get it.
    > The funny thing is that in the past I thought that my future in Poland looks
    > bright. My command of English is quite good, well you should be the judge based on
    > what I'm writing here. I'm educated - finished tertiary education in Information
    > Technology (but never got a degree, I had to start working full-time and I had no
    > time to concentrate on a degree...) and have some tertiary education (1,5 years) in
    > journalism as well. I've been working for something like 8-9 years full time -
    > mainly in various computer magazines as an editor, but also in IT work: programming
    > and designing complex web sites (with scripting and databases), administering a
    > linux server for the past year or more, etc. (usually in parallel with working as
    > an editor). Do you think I stand a chance of finding a job in NZ with such skills?
    > It'd probably be hard in journalism, since English is not my mother tongue and I
    > definitely make mistakes, but perhaps in IT? What's the market like for
    > Internet/Web specialists in NZ?
    > Generally I'd appreciate all kind souls in sharing your views or perhaps anyone
    > could give me some directions as to where to try to find work. I'm constantly
    > looking through classifieds, but I realize that being here in Poland it's a small
    > chance anyone'd be willing not only to hire me, not really knowing me or ever
    > seeing me, and if I decided to go to NZ for 6 months looking for a job, I'd be
    > risking everything here: my current job and a lot of money compared to NZ
    > standards...
    > --
    > tomasz 'tonid' nidecki, zoliborz, warszawa, poland [email protected]
    > http://tonid.net
    > http://endemic.org 'nie przejmuj sie, przytul
    > glonojada' (c)hubertus

iancurtis

Tomasz,

My father left Poland as a young man during the war, via Siberia & Iran - if you know your Polish history you'll know the story. Throughout the 70's, 80's & 90's he has set up trade with his homeland and, sadly, his view of Polish commerce & it's prospects is rather similar to your own.

I can't give you any advice but both myself & my wife are planning on quitting the UK for Australia to improve our quality of life so, what I know of Poland, a move to NZ would seem to enhance your chances of finding the sort of life you're looking for.

Powodzenia !

Max

Dear Tomasz, I have been in Poland for few years and I am surprised reading your
letter. Beautiful country, great people and lots of lovely girls. Stop complaining,
start doing something useful. You got your flat from your grandma...You should've
earned money to buy one.I know many people who have done big money in Poland just
working hard. Think about getting degree. You write you are professional. What in?
Journalism? IT? If you are say why you have not stayed in Canada if you find Poland
such a nasty country? In Canada IT specialist ( also without grades) could have done
big money as well. So why have you come back? I doubt you'll be happy in NZ. Wherever
you are you will be unhappy. Think positive and do something Tomasz Nidecki. max
"Tomasz Nidecki" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
    > Hi all...
    > Due to the constantly declining economical situation in Poland and the sight of a
    > war probably coming to the western countries in the future years I'm thinking
    > deeply about moving to New Zealand. For good.
    > New Zealand was always my number one choice in the world as a place to live in, for
    > many many years. I've spent 4 years in Canada, but didn't really like it that much
    > there. From what I know about NZ, I like everything about it. But I know that I
    > don't know everything, so I might be mistaken in my judgement.
    > I don't know if anyone here wants to indulge in a discussion about the sense of
    > moving to NZ from now eastern, but soon to be "western" (if Poland joins EU)
    > Europe. I don't really see many perspectives of living here in the future. People
    > who make money in Poland are, unfortunately, in majority those who know how to make
    > "contacts", go around various laws and in general conduct businesses. People who
    > are professionals in a certain field, like me, tend to work away their living
    > earning a wage that in many cases isn't enough to buy one's own home... And those
    > lucky few who do earn more money, work so hard they have no time for themselves,
    > for their family and who generally pass away early due to stress... I don't want to
    > be in either of those groups, and I'm too straightforward and honest to conduct a
    > business here in Poland (I'm sorry if it seems unfair to other Poles, but this is
    > my view formed by observation through many years of living here...).
    > What's it like in NZ in this matter? Can one live normally, just working a normal
    > day job, not under heavy stress, not being afraid every day of the company going
    > bankrupt or something like that?... Can one afford a normal, average house, a car
    > and, in general, good living conditions from average salaries? What's the job
    > market like in NZ, not statistics, your feelings, your views are what's important
    > to me...
    > If I were to migrate to NZ with my spouse I'd have to leave everything behind and
    > sell probably even my small 2-room apartment (I was lucky, I inherited it from my
    > grandparents, if I didn't I don't know where I'd be living! From my "professional"
    > salaries I'd barely afford to rent a 1-room apartment!). The costs of the whole
    > process are high for our standards. If I were to summarize all the costs of just
    > risking to apply for residence in NZ, it'd be twice the worth of my good old car. I
    > don't even know now where to get that kind of money, but I could work 2 jobs at a
    > time for a year or so to try to get it.
    > The funny thing is that in the past I thought that my future in Poland looks
    > bright. My command of English is quite good, well you should be the judge based on
    > what I'm writing here. I'm educated - finished tertiary education in Information
    > Technology (but never got a degree, I had to start working full-time and I had no
    > time to concentrate on a degree...) and have some tertiary education (1,5 years) in
    > journalism as well. I've been working for something like 8-9 years full time -
    > mainly in various computer magazines as an editor, but also in IT work: programming
    > and designing complex web sites (with scripting and databases), administering a
    > linux server for the past year or more, etc. (usually in parallel with working as
    > an editor). Do you think I stand a chance of finding a job in NZ with such skills?
    > It'd probably be hard in journalism, since English is not my mother tongue and I
    > definitely make mistakes, but perhaps in IT? What's the market like for
    > Internet/Web specialists in NZ?
    > Generally I'd appreciate all kind souls in sharing your views or perhaps anyone
    > could give me some directions as to where to try to find work. I'm constantly
    > looking through classifieds, but I realize that being here in Poland it's a small
    > chance anyone'd be willing not only to hire me, not really knowing me or ever
    > seeing me, and if I decided to go to NZ for 6 months looking for a job, I'd be
    > risking everything here: my current job and a lot of money compared to NZ
    > standards...
    > --
    > tomasz 'tonid' nidecki, zoliborz, warszawa, poland [email protected]
    > http://tonid.net
    > http://endemic.org 'nie przejmuj sie, przytul
    > glonojada' (c)hubertus

Tomasz Nidecki

"Max" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

    > I have been in Poland for few years and I am surprised reading your letter.
    > Beautiful country, great people and lots of lovely girls. Stop complaining, start
    > doing something useful. You got your flat

I'm doing many useful things for 10 years that I've been on my own. All I got for
these 10 years of hard work (sometimes even 3 jobs at the same time! - I've worked
like that for a year) is a debit on my bank account and nothing more. That's
Poland. My father has been working hard for 40 years and he's a specialist in
aeronautical fields, and what do my parents have? Nothing more than they had 40
years ago. That's Poland.

I don't know where and how in Poland did/do you live, but this is the general thing
I'm observing everywhere. The only ones who got something more than the necessary
minimum are either cheating or working so hard they die at 40 or something like that.
No exceptions as far as I've noticed during those 10 years.

Besides, it doesn't take a genius to realize, that if the average prices of
everything necessary for living are the same as in the west, and the average net
income is about 400 EURO per month (that's what it is, net, at the moment!), it's
hard to make a decent living. Anyone from the west imagine earning 400 EURO a month?
(800 NZD, around 400 USD). And that's _average_ pay. Imagine what the minimum is.

    > from your grandma...You should've earned money to buy one.I know many

You must be joking, if I had to earn money to buy a flat, I might have had one when
I'd be 50 or 60. So I'm lucky I have a place to stay. Some of my family isn't so
lucky, and they don't have a chance (even though they're one of the best in the
country in their specialisation!) to get one out of their regular pay.

    > people who have done big money in Poland just working hard. Think about getting
    > degree. You write you are professional. What in?

What would I need a degree for? For the 10 years I've been working, nobody, NOBODY
ever asked me about my degree, only about what I know and what my experiences are. So
what would it help me with?

    > Journalism? IT? If you are say why you have not stayed in Canada if

I'm one of the more popular journalists specializing in Internet. I've worked for 5
years for magazines related to Internet and I've been a guest in many radio and TV
shows. You might have seen me or heard me sometimes on some of them. I'm also
well-known in the aquarium fish field, I've just wrote and released a book on
aquarium fish health. I've been working in parallel in this field as well for a
couple of years.

    > you find Poland such a nasty country? In Canada IT specialist ( also without
    > grades) could have done big money as well. So why have you

In Canada, I can believe you. The standard of living is much higher there. In Poland?
No. I've believed that for 10 years, but I don't believe it any more.

    > come back? I doubt you'll be happy in NZ. Wherever you are you will

I've come back because my parents were there on a 4-year contract, and I was 19 at
the time we came back and not yet ready to make a decision about immigration.

    > be unhappy. Think positive and do something Tomasz Nidecki.

I'm tired of thinking positive and having problems paying off my bank account and
seeing second company in a row that I've been working for going bankrupt.

--
tomasz 'tonid' nidecki, zoliborz, warszawa, poland [email protected]
http://tonid.net
http://endemic.org 'nie przejmuj sie, przytul
glonojada' (c)hubertus

Tomasz Nidecki

iancurtis <[email protected]> wrote in news:[email protected]:

    > My father left Poland as a young man during the war, via Siberia & Iran - if you
    > know your Polish history you'll know the story. Throughout the 70's, 80's & 90's he
    > has set up trade with his homeland and, sadly, his view of Polish commerce & it's
    > prospects is rather similar to your own.

Yes, we've all been hoping it'll change for the better, but for the last 12 years of
so-called "independence" it's only getting worse and worse...

    > I can't give you any advice but both myself & my wife are planning on quitting the
    > UK for Australia to improve our quality of life so, what I know of Poland, a move
    > to NZ would seem to enhance your chances of finding the sort of life you're
    > looking for.

It's a great risk to take, but what is life without risks...

    > Powodzenia !

Thanks!

--
tomasz 'tonid' nidecki, zoliborz, warszawa, poland [email protected]
http://tonid.net
http://endemic.org 'nie przejmuj sie, przytul
glonojada' (c)hubertus

lizzie

Err.. Max, when I last looked the intention of this forum is to help and advise people going through or thinking of undertaking the emigration process to Oz or NZ. I believe Tomasz has every right to ask about a possible future in NZ if he's not happy in Poland. I'm not happy living in UK (for many reasons but with a better standard of living than Tomasz in Poland) and I'm off to NZ. I don't share James West's views on the state of the UK but I wouldn't attack him for it, he has obviously had different experiences to me.

One thing does puzzle me, if you are so happy living in Poland why are you browsing this forum?

Lizzie