child's crime
Sep 12th 2003, 7:32 am
#1
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7
child's crime
I have a 14 year old who has commited a crime (not been to court yet). As police checks not needed at that age do I then need to mention it on the visa application form. I feel the crime is such that it would affect the visa if committed by an over 16. Advice please.
Sep 12th 2003, 8:32 am
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
dont think you have to declare it, but im sure somebody here will give a more definitive answer, im pretty sure that unless you have served 2 years in prison or been involved in sexual or violent crime you are ok.
Sep 12th 2003, 10:34 am
#3
Home and Happy
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Keep true friends and puppets close, trust no-one else...
Posts: 93,816
Depending on the questions on that particular form you may well have to declare it. If there is a question that asks for criminal convictions/court appearances etc in relation to ALL members of the family, then you had better put it down. Better to be honest because it may come to light later and then it casts doubt on the honesty of the parent/form-filler.
There is nothing to stop you attaching a note with details of what happened, showing the 14 year old in as good a light as possible, and mentioning all extenuating circumstances.
There is nothing to stop you attaching a note with details of what happened, showing the 14 year old in as good a light as possible, and mentioning all extenuating circumstances.
Sep 13th 2003, 11:44 pm
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: child's crime
The questions on form 47SK should be answered very preceisely. The
character questions do refer to ALL members of the family.
You should contact a competent migration agent familiar with character
issues to examine your son's case to ensure it won't have any effect
on your application.
If you do get accepted to migrate to Australia, and your son commits
further crimes there, there is a chance he could be deported back to
the UK.
Jeremy
>On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 10:34:06 +0000, Pollyana <[email protected]> wrote:
>Depending on the questions on that particular form you may well have to
>declare it. If there is a question that asks for criminal
>convictions/court appearances etc in relation to ALL members of the
>family, then you had better put it down. Better to be honest because it
>may come to light later and then it casts doubt on the honesty of the
>parent/form-filler.
>There is nothing to stop you attaching a note with details of what
>happened, showing the 14 year old in as good a light as possible, and
>mentioning all extenuating circumstances.
>--
>Posted via http://britishexpats.com
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
character questions do refer to ALL members of the family.
You should contact a competent migration agent familiar with character
issues to examine your son's case to ensure it won't have any effect
on your application.
If you do get accepted to migrate to Australia, and your son commits
further crimes there, there is a chance he could be deported back to
the UK.
Jeremy
>On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 10:34:06 +0000, Pollyana <[email protected]> wrote:
>Depending on the questions on that particular form you may well have to
>declare it. If there is a question that asks for criminal
>convictions/court appearances etc in relation to ALL members of the
>family, then you had better put it down. Better to be honest because it
>may come to light later and then it casts doubt on the honesty of the
>parent/form-filler.
>There is nothing to stop you attaching a note with details of what
>happened, showing the 14 year old in as good a light as possible, and
>mentioning all extenuating circumstances.
>--
>Posted via http://britishexpats.com
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
Sep 14th 2003, 5:51 am
#5
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by Jaj
The questions on form 47SK should be answered very preceisely. The
character questions do refer to ALL members of the family.
You should contact a competent migration agent familiar with character
issues to examine your son's case to ensure it won't have any effect
on your application.
If you do get accepted to migrate to Australia, and your son commits
further crimes there, there is a chance he could be deported back to
the UK.
Jeremy
The questions on form 47SK should be answered very preceisely. The
character questions do refer to ALL members of the family.
You should contact a competent migration agent familiar with character
issues to examine your son's case to ensure it won't have any effect
on your application.
If you do get accepted to migrate to Australia, and your son commits
further crimes there, there is a chance he could be deported back to
the UK.
Jeremy
The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
Many Thanks for your advice
Sep 14th 2003, 12:54 pm
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: child's crime
If you don't declare it then you will have the knowledge that there is
a timebomb ticking under your visas and that you have broken the law.
I strongly suggest you use a competent migration agent who understands
thoroughly the DIMIA regulations and policies on character issues.
Jeremy
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
>> Many Thanks for your advice
>--
>Posted via http://britishexpats.com
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
a timebomb ticking under your visas and that you have broken the law.
I strongly suggest you use a competent migration agent who understands
thoroughly the DIMIA regulations and policies on character issues.
Jeremy
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
>> Many Thanks for your advice
>--
>Posted via http://britishexpats.com
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
Sep 15th 2003, 2:30 am
#7
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 248
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by suejane
Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not declare would I be 'found out'?
The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
Many Thanks for your advice
Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not declare would I be 'found out'?
The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
Many Thanks for your advice
From that, I would assume you must delare it. Hopefully the judge will see the innocent nature of what happened. I somehow doubt this would affect your application, but not declaring it would.
-Kevin.
Sep 15th 2003, 1:57 pm
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: child's crime
SentApril2002 <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Originally posted by suejane
>
> > Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
> > declare would I be 'found out'?
>
> > The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
> > girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
> > behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
> > assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
>
> > By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
> > have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
>
> >
>
> > Many Thanks for your advice
>
>
>
> On the 47SK form, one of the questions under Part G - Health and
> Character states "Have you, or any other person included in this
> application, ever: been charged with any offence that is currently
> awaiting legal action?"
>
>
>
> From that, I would assume you must delare it. Hopefully the judge will
> see the innocent nature of what happened. I somehow doubt this would
> affect your application, but not declaring it would.
Well, non-disclosure is risky but how will they ever find out? The
standard argument seems to be "You never know, they might find out,
and if they do you're in trouble". However, this is a bit weak, I
can't see how they will ever find out if it's not on a police check.
I'm not advocating that you lie, but it's always there as a option.
Thunder Ace
>
>
>
> -Kevin.
> Originally posted by suejane
>
> > Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
> > declare would I be 'found out'?
>
> > The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
> > girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
> > behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
> > assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
>
> > By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
> > have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
>
> >
>
> > Many Thanks for your advice
>
>
>
> On the 47SK form, one of the questions under Part G - Health and
> Character states "Have you, or any other person included in this
> application, ever: been charged with any offence that is currently
> awaiting legal action?"
>
>
>
> From that, I would assume you must delare it. Hopefully the judge will
> see the innocent nature of what happened. I somehow doubt this would
> affect your application, but not declaring it would.
Well, non-disclosure is risky but how will they ever find out? The
standard argument seems to be "You never know, they might find out,
and if they do you're in trouble". However, this is a bit weak, I
can't see how they will ever find out if it's not on a police check.
I'm not advocating that you lie, but it's always there as a option.
Thunder Ace
>
>
>
> -Kevin.
Sep 15th 2003, 6:44 pm
#9
Home and Happy
Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Keep true friends and puppets close, trust no-one else...
Posts: 93,816
Hi Suejane,
Sent you a pm.......
Pollyana
Sent you a pm.......
Pollyana
Sep 15th 2003, 7:34 pm
#10
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: child's crime
>On Mon, 15 Sep 2003 02:30:14 +0000, SentApril2002 <[email protected]> wrote:
>Originally posted by suejane
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
It sounds like you need a good lawyer in the UK too.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
If your son does end up with a conviction of some sort, the sentence
imposed by the judge will be taken as an indicator of how seriously
the incident is viewed. If it really was just a 'prank', then the
comments made and sentence should reflect this. All this would need
to be presented to the DIMIA case officer to minimise the chances of a
character based refusal.
Jeremy
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
>Originally posted by suejane
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
It sounds like you need a good lawyer in the UK too.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
If your son does end up with a conviction of some sort, the sentence
imposed by the judge will be taken as an indicator of how seriously
the incident is viewed. If it really was just a 'prank', then the
comments made and sentence should reflect this. All this would need
to be presented to the DIMIA case officer to minimise the chances of a
character based refusal.
Jeremy
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
Nov 14th 2003, 5:22 pm
#11
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by Jaj
>On Mon, 15 Sep 2003 02:30:14 +0000, SentApril2002 <[email protected]> wrote:
>Originally posted by suejane
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
It sounds like you need a good lawyer in the UK too.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
If your son does end up with a conviction of some sort, the sentence
imposed by the judge will be taken as an indicator of how seriously
the incident is viewed. If it really was just a 'prank', then the
comments made and sentence should reflect this. All this would need
to be presented to the DIMIA case officer to minimise the chances of a
character based refusal.
Jeremy
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
>On Mon, 15 Sep 2003 02:30:14 +0000, SentApril2002 <[email protected]> wrote:
>Originally posted by suejane
>> Are the full details of childrens crimes looked into. If I did not
>> declare would I be 'found out'?
>> The offence was a boyish prank of my son running past a couple of
>> girls and smacking their bums. I understand that it is unacceptable
>> behaviour and do not condone it but the resulting charge was sexual
>> assualt as even the police said their is no flexibility in the UK law.
It sounds like you need a good lawyer in the UK too.
>> By the time we leave the UK to take up PR his childhood record will
>> have been wiped clean (although not at the time of validation).
If your son does end up with a conviction of some sort, the sentence
imposed by the judge will be taken as an indicator of how seriously
the incident is viewed. If it really was just a 'prank', then the
comments made and sentence should reflect this. All this would need
to be presented to the DIMIA case officer to minimise the chances of a
character based refusal.
Jeremy
This is not intended to be legal advice in any jurisdiction
My Son has now been to court. He pleaded guilty of a charge of indecent assualt. 1 offence plus 4 taken into account. All involve smaking girls on their bums (same age as him). He was fined £50 and £55 costs. 12 month referral order and placed on the sex offenders register for 30 months.
Help - can any agents give advice. If I don't mention it on the form would they find out. He is 14 and does not require police check. If I disclosed would I be wasting my application fee.
Just got skills assessment back!!
Nov 14th 2003, 8:35 pm
#12
Banned
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,467
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by suejane
My Son has now been to court. He pleaded guilty of a charge of indecent assualt. 1 offence plus 4 taken into account. All involve smaking girls on their bums (same age as him). He was fined £50 and £55 costs. 12 month referral order and placed on the sex offenders register for 30 months.
Help - can any agents give advice. If I don't mention it on the form would they find out. He is 14 and does not require police check. If I disclosed would I be wasting my application fee.
Just got skills assessment back!!
My Son has now been to court. He pleaded guilty of a charge of indecent assualt. 1 offence plus 4 taken into account. All involve smaking girls on their bums (same age as him). He was fined £50 and £55 costs. 12 month referral order and placed on the sex offenders register for 30 months.
Help - can any agents give advice. If I don't mention it on the form would they find out. He is 14 and does not require police check. If I disclosed would I be wasting my application fee.
Just got skills assessment back!!
I feel for you, boys are so much trouble ... I am always saying to my 16yr old be careful and dont break the law cos we could be deported in the future
Nov 14th 2003, 9:14 pm
#13
Forum Regular
Joined: Feb 2003
Location: Sunshine Coast Queensland
Posts: 242
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by suejane
My Son has now been to court. He pleaded guilty of a charge of indecent assualt. 1 offence plus 4 taken into account. All involve smaking girls on their bums (same age as him). He was fined £50 and £55 costs. 12 month referral order and placed on the sex offenders register for 30 months.
Help - can any agents give advice. If I don't mention it on the form would they find out. He is 14 and does not require police check. If I disclosed would I be wasting my application fee.
Just got skills assessment back!!
My Son has now been to court. He pleaded guilty of a charge of indecent assualt. 1 offence plus 4 taken into account. All involve smaking girls on their bums (same age as him). He was fined £50 and £55 costs. 12 month referral order and placed on the sex offenders register for 30 months.
Help - can any agents give advice. If I don't mention it on the form would they find out. He is 14 and does not require police check. If I disclosed would I be wasting my application fee.
Just got skills assessment back!!
Disgusting behaviour, from the girls parents.
my advice would be to not say anything, there is no way dimia would find out (unless they read this forum, but your ID is not linked to your real details is it?).
Please dont hold me liable for my advice, the real world (law issues) is stupid.
Phil.
Nov 14th 2003, 9:42 pm
#14
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7
Re: child's crime
Originally posted by philj6969
The law in this country is s**t, what a waste of time and money, and ending up with a 14 year old boy having to sign the sex offenders register! I hope the girls parents have a good long think about what they have supported their children in doing to this young lad.
Disgusting behaviour, from the girls parents.
my advice would be to not say anything, there is no way dimia would find out (unless they read this forum, but your ID is not linked to your real details is it?).
Please dont hold me liable for my advice, the real world (law issues) is stupid.
Phil.
The law in this country is s**t, what a waste of time and money, and ending up with a 14 year old boy having to sign the sex offenders register! I hope the girls parents have a good long think about what they have supported their children in doing to this young lad.
Disgusting behaviour, from the girls parents.
my advice would be to not say anything, there is no way dimia would find out (unless they read this forum, but your ID is not linked to your real details is it?).
Please dont hold me liable for my advice, the real world (law issues) is stupid.
Phil.
Nov 14th 2003, 11:39 pm
#15
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2002
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 368
Re: child's crime
I would definitely declare it on the application form. The chances are that the officer would refer it to health and character policy area for an opinion given the nature of the offence. The actual sentence is no problem, but the nature of the offence is.
Given the chances of a refusal and the fact that you would likely not know for around 12-15 months, it may be worth approaching the High Commission in London. Lodging a visitor visa application directly with them for your son, and explaining that you are doing it to test this issue in their assessment of his character. Chances are that if they approve it after doing similar checks that is likely okay for a migration application.
Regards
Steven O'Neil
Iscah Migration, Perth
www.iscah.com
Given the chances of a refusal and the fact that you would likely not know for around 12-15 months, it may be worth approaching the High Commission in London. Lodging a visitor visa application directly with them for your son, and explaining that you are doing it to test this issue in their assessment of his character. Chances are that if they approve it after doing similar checks that is likely okay for a migration application.
Regards
Steven O'Neil
Iscah Migration, Perth
www.iscah.com