diegohandofgod

All

I'm new to this site, so hello. I've been reading through various threads and this looks like a valuable site for ideas, info & recommendations. I know how difficult it is to network with people when you're moving abroad.

I was obviously dozing when I hadn't realised that citizenship requirements had changed in 2007, and only found out 3 months ago. I was granted permanent residency in July 2005 and entered Oz in Oct 2007. To date I've only stayed in Oz for 11 months (I returned to the UK 2 years ago for family reasons), but I'm desperate to apply for citizenship prior to 30/6/2010, when the new 4-year rule comes into force. Cue hurried arrangements to return to Oz quickly. However, I'm sailing VERY close to the wind for residency requirements, and even though my own calcs of no. of days residency is fine (I'll have stayed for 733 nights by 29 June 2010 (1 day before the statutory application deadline), the online calculator says nope. Under the citizenship test, pre-2007 applicants only need to have been resident for ‘2 years’ ... that’s 730 nights by my reckoning. I’ve even tested the calculator’s ‘accuracy’ by extending my projected residency to 745 days – still, computer says ‘no’.

Now, I know that:
a) my entry & departure dates have been correctly entered in the calculator, and I know that departure dates don’t count as residency days,
b) my intended application lodgement date is correct (29 June 2010),
c) I’m definitely eligible for the old 2-year residence rule,

So, my question is: why is the online calculator so blatantly inaccurate, has anybody found the same thing, or – far more concerning – have I missed something??

Many thanks
Andy

welshtony

Hi Andy

the first requirement for coming under the old rules is that you must have validated your visa prior to 01 July 2007. I presume you validated some time in July 2005 so you must enter the information of that trip into your application - even if it was for only one day - this should then show you to be eligible.

Regards

diegohandofgod

Thanks Tony

As far as I can see all my input details are fine i.e. perm residence date (first entry date) is 27 Oct 05, intended lodgment date is 29 Jun 2010, lawful residence date (which I had to input in order to get a result from the online calculator) is the same as first entry date i.e. 27 Oct 05.

Entry & departure dates are as follows (I've even used this coming Monday's date as my next entry date, just to demonstrate that I'd still be well over my 730 days in total):

27/10/05 - 5/11/05
4/5/06 - 2/6/06
8/6/06 - 22/12/06
2/1/07 - 21/1/07
28/2/07 - 16/5/07
11/5/09 - 29/6/10

If someone can make the online calculator work with the above dates then I'd be happy to admit something's wrong with me or my computer!

Also, I will have satisfied the other major residence condition by the time I apply i.e. "resident....for a total of two years in the five years before applying, including one year in the two years before applying". On the first condition I'd be applying before my 5 years are up, and on the second condition I'd have been in Oz for 415 days using the dates above.... computer still says no.

Maybe I'm being thick but I just don't get it.

louie

Well my trusty calculator says you are fine so I had a play on the citizenship website and put in the dates you quote to see what happened - and it said you were eligible. I didn't put in a lawful residence date because it said you didn't need to as you are under the old rules, maybe that makes a difference?

diegohandofgod

Cheers Louie.

Are you using the calculator at https://www.ecom.immi.gov.au/citz/startIntervalCalc.do
or are you using another one?

I still get the same result as before, AND the calculator won't let me proceed without the Lawful Residence Date. I can only think we're using different residence calculators.

This sounds like a pedantic problem, but when you're dealing with 1 day making or breaking your eligibility for the old 2-year rule it becomes a big issue!

diegohandofgod

Hi there

I'll be submitting a citizenship application under the old 2-year residency rule in June 2010, but I'm wondering about the statutory deadline day quoted in the relevant legislation.

Guidance on the citizenship website states "If people became permanent residents before 1 July 2007 and apply before 30 June 2010 they must have been physically present in Australia as a permanent resident for a total of two years...." etc etc.

As I'm running very tight on time with my qualifying residency days I'm keen to find out whether the submission deadline is actually 29 June 2010, as the guidance states "before 30 June 2010", not "on or before 30 June 2010". I know there are no test cases because we haven't reached 30/10/2010 yet, but can any migration consultants who've worked with deadline dates in the past (and who therefore know how the immigration department applies its dates) be able to advise please?

Many thanks
Andy

Dorothy

If you want specific advice from a migration agent you will need to contact one directly. The people who post here do so as volunteers and are for the most part simply people who have gone through the process themselves.

louie

No, I was using the same calculator as you. Wish I'd printed off the results now, because I went back in to do it again and I got the same as you, which is clearly wrong because you don't need a lawful residence date under the old rules. I think that there is a glitch in the system somewhere because even if you put your dates of residence as being from 27 October 2005 to 29 June 2010 it still says you are ineligible, which is clearly wrong. Maybe try again from scratch, I'll do the same later to see if I can replicate the original result.

If I were you I'd write to DIAC and ask them to confirm when you'd be eligible, you've got nothing to lose by doing so.

diegohandofgod

Thanks Louie. Yes, I've fired off an email to the London contact office (it was late Fri and I couldn't ring anybody at any worldwide embassy / office to ask.

welshtony

Hi Andy

I just tried it with the following dates and the computer says - YES - like it should:


Permanent Residence Date: 27 October 2005
Intended Lodgement Date: 25 June 2010
Lawful Residence Date: *** Date not entered ***


From Date To Date Action
5 November 2005 4 May 2006 Edit Delete
2 June 2006 8 June 2006 Edit Delete
22 December 2006 2 January 2007 Edit Delete
21 January 2007 28 February 2007 Edit Delete
16 May 2007 11 May 2009 Edit Delete
16 May 2007 11 May 2009 Edit Delete

You must put the periods of absence from Australia not the periods of residence - maybe that is what you did wrong or maybe the system plays up - anyway, it will be a fact whether you will have spent 2 years prior to 01 July 2010 and what the computer says will not matter

Regards

Veronika

I'd say that before 30 June, in this case, actually includes that date. Reason being that the new Citizenship act commenced on 1 July 2007 and the arrangement was that:

if:
(a) a person is a permanent resident (worked out under the old Act) immediately before the commencement day; and
(b) the person makes an application under subsection 21(1) of the new Act within the period of 3 years beginning on the commencement day.

So I would take that to mean that 30 June 2010 falls within the period of 3 years beginning on 1 July 2007 and you have until midnight 30 June 2010 to lodge your application.

However, there is also the Acts Interpretation Act which applies, and so to avoid any confusion and to have something from the DIAC to rely on, if I were you, I really would get written confirmation from the DIAC about this, if you are planning to cut it that close.

Do you not also need to have sat and passed the Citizenship test before you can apply?

Cheers,
Veronika

BrightYellowGun

Sorry to hijack your thread - what's the new 4-year rule? I had a look at citizenship a couple of months ago and it said you needed 4 years of residency (3 years temporary, 1 year permanent) to apply for citizenship - is this what you mean?

diegohandofgod

Yep, that's what I mean.

discobay

I have the same problem for my other half. I have telephoned DIAC twice and each time the 'consultant' backed up the calculator saying that the calculation is 'very complicated' and 'not everyone understands it' and 'we had to go on a special training course'. Well good for you but maybe you numb skulls had to. Problem is the switchboards are manned by less-than-well-informed personnel. I am going to have to write to get any sense out of them. They use a different calculator because one operator said it told her the number of days of residence accumulated.

louie

It's working fine for me now. It's calculating that the OP can apply on 9 June 2010. Remember you put in the dates of absence from Oz NOT the dates present in Oz.