What lawyer can do me?
Jan 26th 2004, 2:20 am
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
> > It clearly, states that Crown decides based on
> > the circumstances is it summary or indictable.
> You will notice that it says 'CROWN'. Not 'Cicero'. Shoplifting is
> theft. Theft is an indictable offence. There is no such thing as a
> 'hybrid' charge. It is either indictable or it is not. It MAY be reduced to
> a lesser form of charge (which is what 'hybrid' means), but is unlikely.
Please read my note on the nature of Summary prosecution and indictable
and also Hybrid. These are the terms for the mechanism for prosecution,
not the terms for the severity of the crime (although there is a
relationship). Sometimes the choice of Summary prosecution or
indictment depends on the penalty that the Crown is seeking for the
crime, since there are limits on the penalties that can be given on a
summary prosecution. Again, the terms are NOT a necessarily a measure
of the severity of the crime.
As has been mentioned before ... Any criminal charges which have yet to
be dealt with by the court will stop someone from applying for
citizenship until the charges have been dealt with, or if there is an
application for citizenship in the works, it will suspend the
application until the charges are dealt with. After the charges are
dealt with, then if acquitted, pending applications can be resumed, or
new applications can be made. If not acquitted, then it is up to CIC to
make a determination on the matter.
> > the circumstances is it summary or indictable.
> You will notice that it says 'CROWN'. Not 'Cicero'. Shoplifting is
> theft. Theft is an indictable offence. There is no such thing as a
> 'hybrid' charge. It is either indictable or it is not. It MAY be reduced to
> a lesser form of charge (which is what 'hybrid' means), but is unlikely.
Please read my note on the nature of Summary prosecution and indictable
and also Hybrid. These are the terms for the mechanism for prosecution,
not the terms for the severity of the crime (although there is a
relationship). Sometimes the choice of Summary prosecution or
indictment depends on the penalty that the Crown is seeking for the
crime, since there are limits on the penalties that can be given on a
summary prosecution. Again, the terms are NOT a necessarily a measure
of the severity of the crime.
As has been mentioned before ... Any criminal charges which have yet to
be dealt with by the court will stop someone from applying for
citizenship until the charges have been dealt with, or if there is an
application for citizenship in the works, it will suspend the
application until the charges are dealt with. After the charges are
dealt with, then if acquitted, pending applications can be resumed, or
new applications can be made. If not acquitted, then it is up to CIC to
make a determination on the matter.
Jan 26th 2004, 3:26 am
#47
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
First of all, I would like to think you guys very much for any
information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
mentioned.
I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
judge.
I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
do, so do I.
I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
again. I beg for forgiveness
I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
to get some help
from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
people advice on how to defense their case.
I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
stealing a camera.
I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
But I did, it is true I can not change.
As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
followings:
1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
necessary, I will go to the court myself.
2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
court to defense myself?
I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
possibilities to reduce punishments.
3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
my criminal code when he/her hire me?
Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
5. is there any trouble when I travel to other countries if I have
criminial record.
Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
For instance, I want to travel to Japan
6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
police officer ?
I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
Canada law, police station...
Can some advice me something?
Great appreciation for any help
JOHN
"http://www.iamnotamerican.com" <newsgroup@iam_not_american.com> wrote in message news:<BC393A9C.24506%newsgroup@iam_not_american.co m>...
> in a recent article, Singh ([email protected]) said:
> > I will give it to him that he know immigration,,,anything
> > more thatn that he tries hard at and thinks he can shoot anything from the
> > lip and that will be the law.
>
> And you're a qualified lawyer, are you? Where did you study? Where do
> you practice? What was your score on the admission exam?
>
> You admit that Andrew knows immigration. It goes without saying then,
> Andrew would have a solid understanding on how the LAW relates to
> immigration. Immigration and citizenship are in the same class, ergo the
> laws would essentially be the same.
>
> Andrew has been correct all along. Shoplifting is an indictable offence
> that MAY be prosecuted as a 'hybrid' offence at a later date. However in
> this case ("I stole the camera to make my wife happy") is not quite going to
> qualify as compassionate grounds.
>
> Furthermore, retailers have lobbied to have shoplifting classified as a
> more serious offence. That is why they prosecute thieves when they are
> caught, and the criminal record DOES stay on the person's record. I am not
> a lawyer, but a very good friend of mine is a crown prosecutor in B.C. We
> were actually discussing shoplifting about a month ago (among other
> offences).
>
> If you're so concerned about the welfare of the original poster, why
> don't you give him your address so he can steal from you? After all, his
> wife still wants a digital camera...
information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
mentioned.
I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
judge.
I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
do, so do I.
I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
again. I beg for forgiveness
I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
to get some help
from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
people advice on how to defense their case.
I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
stealing a camera.
I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
But I did, it is true I can not change.
As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
followings:
1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
necessary, I will go to the court myself.
2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
court to defense myself?
I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
possibilities to reduce punishments.
3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
my criminal code when he/her hire me?
Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
5. is there any trouble when I travel to other countries if I have
criminial record.
Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
For instance, I want to travel to Japan
6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
police officer ?
I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
Canada law, police station...
Can some advice me something?
Great appreciation for any help
JOHN
"http://www.iamnotamerican.com" <newsgroup@iam_not_american.com> wrote in message news:<BC393A9C.24506%newsgroup@iam_not_american.co m>...
> in a recent article, Singh ([email protected]) said:
> > I will give it to him that he know immigration,,,anything
> > more thatn that he tries hard at and thinks he can shoot anything from the
> > lip and that will be the law.
>
> And you're a qualified lawyer, are you? Where did you study? Where do
> you practice? What was your score on the admission exam?
>
> You admit that Andrew knows immigration. It goes without saying then,
> Andrew would have a solid understanding on how the LAW relates to
> immigration. Immigration and citizenship are in the same class, ergo the
> laws would essentially be the same.
>
> Andrew has been correct all along. Shoplifting is an indictable offence
> that MAY be prosecuted as a 'hybrid' offence at a later date. However in
> this case ("I stole the camera to make my wife happy") is not quite going to
> qualify as compassionate grounds.
>
> Furthermore, retailers have lobbied to have shoplifting classified as a
> more serious offence. That is why they prosecute thieves when they are
> caught, and the criminal record DOES stay on the person's record. I am not
> a lawyer, but a very good friend of mine is a crown prosecutor in B.C. We
> were actually discussing shoplifting about a month ago (among other
> offences).
>
> If you're so concerned about the welfare of the original poster, why
> don't you give him your address so he can steal from you? After all, his
> wife still wants a digital camera...
Jan 26th 2004, 3:54 am
#48
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
How absurd would be a case if an immigrant charged for any small offense in the whole world is precluded for getting the citizenship while the charge lasts? So, following that logic, if you have a process that is dragging for years for frivolous thing - you won't be able to get the citizenship. Also, someone charges you for looking him badly on the street, your child “stealing� lollipop in school, cause disturbance, all other minor offenses or frivolous cases --- you are prevented to get the citizenship.
That’s for some “consultants� imply with their reading of the law; however, the article 22 is clearly not stating that. It clearly there are should be preventions against applicants with serious crimes but law makes clear distinction about type of offenses. If the person is charged for an indictable offense that he would be prevented for getting the citizenship although there are number of possibilities even if the charge, sentence has been made. This is not the case in this situation as many time said and John will be fine.
Again, it is much better for this type to go with adequate and reputable lawyer than to listen advices of wanna-be self-proclaimed experts here.
That’s for some “consultants� imply with their reading of the law; however, the article 22 is clearly not stating that. It clearly there are should be preventions against applicants with serious crimes but law makes clear distinction about type of offenses. If the person is charged for an indictable offense that he would be prevented for getting the citizenship although there are number of possibilities even if the charge, sentence has been made. This is not the case in this situation as many time said and John will be fine.
Again, it is much better for this type to go with adequate and reputable lawyer than to listen advices of wanna-be self-proclaimed experts here.
Jan 26th 2004, 4:03 am
#49
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
See under several "Answer:" below are my 2c's.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
First of all, I would like to think you guys very much for any
information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
mentioned.
Answer: You are welcome! Don't pay too much attention to arogant stupid bozos self-proclaimed experts that are trying to put you down.
I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
judge.
I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
do, so do I.
I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
again. I beg for forgiveness
I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
to get some help
from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
people advice on how to defense their case.
I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
stealing a camera.
I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
But I did, it is true I can not change.
As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
followings:
1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
necessary, I will go to the court myself.
Answer: It is not necessary but in your case at least consultation is highly advisable.
2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
court to defense myself?
I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
possibilities to reduce punishments.
Answer: Be trutfull and talk to your lawyer.
3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
my criminal code when he/her hire me?
Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
Answer: Yes, off course. Some do - some don't. If you don't tell he can have a cause for firing.
4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
Answer:Talk to the lawyer.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
First of all, I would like to think you guys very much for any
information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
mentioned.
Answer: You are welcome! Don't pay too much attention to arogant stupid bozos self-proclaimed experts that are trying to put you down.
I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
judge.
I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
do, so do I.
I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
again. I beg for forgiveness
I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
to get some help
from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
people advice on how to defense their case.
I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
stealing a camera.
I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
But I did, it is true I can not change.
As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
followings:
1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
necessary, I will go to the court myself.
Answer: It is not necessary but in your case at least consultation is highly advisable.
2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
court to defense myself?
I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
possibilities to reduce punishments.
Answer: Be trutfull and talk to your lawyer.
3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
my criminal code when he/her hire me?
Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
Answer: Yes, off course. Some do - some don't. If you don't tell he can have a cause for firing.
4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
Answer:Talk to the lawyer.
Jan 26th 2004, 4:04 am
#50
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
See under several "Answer:" below are my 2c's.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
5. is there any trouble when I <a href="http://go-acct.com?go=travel" onmouseover="window.status = 'goto: travel';return 1" onmouseout="window.status=''">travel</a> to other countries if I have
criminial record.
Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
For instance, I want to <a href="http://go-all.com?go=travel" onmouseover="window.status = 'goto: travel';return 1" onmouseout="window.status=''">travel</a> to Japan
Answer: Not likley.
6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
police officer ?
Answer: Yes. Talk to your lawyer about differnt ways.
I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
Canada law, police station...
Can some advice me something?
Great appreciation for any help
JOHN
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
5. is there any trouble when I <a href="http://go-acct.com?go=travel" onmouseover="window.status = 'goto: travel';return 1" onmouseout="window.status=''">travel</a> to other countries if I have
criminial record.
Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
For instance, I want to <a href="http://go-all.com?go=travel" onmouseover="window.status = 'goto: travel';return 1" onmouseout="window.status=''">travel</a> to Japan
Answer: Not likley.
6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
police officer ?
Answer: Yes. Talk to your lawyer about differnt ways.
I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
Canada law, police station...
Can some advice me something?
Great appreciation for any help
JOHN
Jan 26th 2004, 4:12 am
#51
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
in a recent article, S B
([email protected]. invalid) said:
> Please read my note on the nature of Summary prosecution and indictable
> and also Hybrid. These are the terms for the mechanism for prosecution,
> not the terms for the severity of the crime (although there is a
> relationship). Sometimes the choice of Summary prosecution or
> indictment depends on the penalty that the Crown is seeking for the
> crime, since there are limits on the penalties that can be given on a
> summary prosecution. Again, the terms are NOT a necessarily a measure
> of the severity of the crime.
Hey, SB! How ya doin'? You don't have to explain the differences to
me. I understand them clearly. Indeed, I have been trying to explain this
to 'Cicero'.
([email protected]. invalid) said:
> Please read my note on the nature of Summary prosecution and indictable
> and also Hybrid. These are the terms for the mechanism for prosecution,
> not the terms for the severity of the crime (although there is a
> relationship). Sometimes the choice of Summary prosecution or
> indictment depends on the penalty that the Crown is seeking for the
> crime, since there are limits on the penalties that can be given on a
> summary prosecution. Again, the terms are NOT a necessarily a measure
> of the severity of the crime.
Hey, SB! How ya doin'? You don't have to explain the differences to
me. I understand them clearly. Indeed, I have been trying to explain this
to 'Cicero'.
Jan 26th 2004, 4:15 am
#52
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
1. You cannot afford not having a lawyer representing you in the court in
criminal case.
2. See above
3. See above
4. If you committed offence and have been charged before filing citizenship
application then by not disclosing this fact you already committed an
offence of omission and/or misrepresentation. Whatever happens with your
current problem won't make you illegible for future application. But please
keep in mind that if you are convicted and face punishment of jail of 2
years or more then such conviction may be the reason for removal from Canada
(deportation) if you are a PR. So, again - you cannot afford not having a
lawyer.
5. Yes, you may be inadmissible to many countries, including US.
6. No, you can't.
Again - look in phone book for Legal Aid - if you qualify you will be able
to be represented without paying the lawyer.
--
../..
Andrew Miller
Immigration Consultant
Vancouver, British Columbia
email: [email protected]
(delete REMOVE from the above address before sending email)
________________________________
"JOHN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> First of all, I would like to think you guys very much for any
> information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
> think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
> represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
> assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
> mentioned.
> I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
> I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
> for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
> judge.
> I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
> am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
> reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
> do, so do I.
> I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
> lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
> I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
> saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
> again. I beg for forgiveness
> I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
> judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
> to get some help
> from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
> people advice on how to defense their case.
> I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
> live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
> stealing a camera.
> I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
> But I did, it is true I can not change.
> As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
> is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
> I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
> some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
> Any help will be greatly appreciated.
> I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
> followings:
> 1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
> necessary, I will go to the court myself.
> 2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
> court to defense myself?
> I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
> possibilities to reduce punishments.
> 3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
> my criminal code when he/her hire me?
> Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
> 4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
> need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
> If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
> mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
> 5. is there any trouble when I travel to other countries if I have
> criminial record.
> Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
> For instance, I want to travel to Japan
> 6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
> police officer ?
> I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
> since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
> I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
> appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
> I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
> Canada law, police station...
> Can some advice me something?
> Great appreciation for any help
> JOHN
> "http://www.iamnotamerican.com" <newsgroup@iam_not_american.com> wrote in
message news:<BC393A9C.24506%newsgroup@iam_not_american.co m>...
> > in a recent article, Singh ([email protected]) said:
> > > I will give it to him that he know immigration,,,anything
> > > more thatn that he tries hard at and thinks he can shoot anything from
the
> > > lip and that will be the law.
> >
> > And you're a qualified lawyer, are you? Where did you study? Where
do
> > you practice? What was your score on the admission exam?
> >
> > You admit that Andrew knows immigration. It goes without saying
then,
> > Andrew would have a solid understanding on how the LAW relates to
> > immigration. Immigration and citizenship are in the same class, ergo
the
> > laws would essentially be the same.
> >
> > Andrew has been correct all along. Shoplifting is an indictable
offence
> > that MAY be prosecuted as a 'hybrid' offence at a later date. However
in
> > this case ("I stole the camera to make my wife happy") is not quite
going to
> > qualify as compassionate grounds.
> >
> > Furthermore, retailers have lobbied to have shoplifting classified
as a
> > more serious offence. That is why they prosecute thieves when they are
> > caught, and the criminal record DOES stay on the person's record. I am
not
> > a lawyer, but a very good friend of mine is a crown prosecutor in B.C.
We
> > were actually discussing shoplifting about a month ago (among other
> > offences).
> >
> > If you're so concerned about the welfare of the original poster, why
> > don't you give him your address so he can steal from you? After all,
his
> > wife still wants a digital camera...
criminal case.
2. See above
3. See above
4. If you committed offence and have been charged before filing citizenship
application then by not disclosing this fact you already committed an
offence of omission and/or misrepresentation. Whatever happens with your
current problem won't make you illegible for future application. But please
keep in mind that if you are convicted and face punishment of jail of 2
years or more then such conviction may be the reason for removal from Canada
(deportation) if you are a PR. So, again - you cannot afford not having a
lawyer.
5. Yes, you may be inadmissible to many countries, including US.
6. No, you can't.
Again - look in phone book for Legal Aid - if you qualify you will be able
to be represented without paying the lawyer.
--
../..
Andrew Miller
Immigration Consultant
Vancouver, British Columbia
email: [email protected]
(delete REMOVE from the above address before sending email)
________________________________
"JOHN" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> First of all, I would like to think you guys very much for any
> information posted here about my case. Whatever useful or uselness, I
> think I could get some points which would be helpful for me to
> represent myself on the law court. But I strongly disgree that you
> assume the case that I will steal something from other people whom you
> mentioned.
> I admit I made a stupid misitake, stealing a camera from sears store.
> I know it not only mistake but also severe crime. I have to prepare
> for facing any sentence/punishment that would be issued by Crown or
> judge.
> I regret what I did. I do not want to fight on court because I know I
> am guilty. I just like to know is there a possible way I can do for
> reducing my punishment. That is normal behavior people always try to
> do, so do I.
> I donot know anything about canada laws. I do not want to conceal or
> lie anything to judge with assistance of a good lawyer.
> I just like to know how can I represent myself on the court except
> saying that I promise I never, ever do it again, never commit offence
> again. I beg for forgiveness
> I think there might be some skills that can result postive impace to
> judge or whoever in charge of sentence. That is also why people want
> to get some help
> from lawyers because lawyer know very well about laws and can give
> people advice on how to defense their case.
> I donot have money, my wife is in school, I am looking for job. We
> live under poor situation. I know not having money is not reason for
> stealing a camera.
> I donot know even why I commited such stupid offence when i recall.
> But I did, it is true I can not change.
> As a new immigrant in Canada, my english is not good as you guys. it
> is very hard to express exactly what I want to say here
> I expect someone who is familisr with this case or willing to offer
> some positive advice for me do me a favior to answer my questions
> Any help will be greatly appreciated.
> I apologize for such lengthy message. My questions are summarized as
> followings:
> 1. Is the lawyer mandate to be appeared with me on court?. If not
> necessary, I will go to the court myself.
> 2. are there some representation skills or any tips that I can use on
> court to defense myself?
> I am sure I will admit my crime on court. But I still expect any
> possibilities to reduce punishments.
> 3. Can I find job if I have criminal record? Does the employer check
> my criminal code when he/her hire me?
> Does the employer fire me if he/she found my criminal record?
> 4. I commited shoplifting prior to citizenship application, so do I
> need to notify the citizenship office for reporting my crime?
> If immigration office deny my citizenship application. Does that
> mean I will lose the chance to apply for citizenship forever?
> 5. is there any trouble when I travel to other countries if I have
> criminial record.
> Does the border officer prohibite me from entering or leaving Canada.
> For instance, I want to travel to Japan
> 6. Is there a way I can legally remove my criminal record from the
> police officer ?
> I am grateful to have you guys answered above questions very soon,
> since I will go to the police station 3 days later.
> I donot know exactly what to do. They just said you have to be
> appeared twice, one on police station, other one on the court
> I am afraid of what I will face to. I do not know anything about
> Canada law, police station...
> Can some advice me something?
> Great appreciation for any help
> JOHN
> "http://www.iamnotamerican.com" <newsgroup@iam_not_american.com> wrote in
message news:<BC393A9C.24506%newsgroup@iam_not_american.co m>...
> > in a recent article, Singh ([email protected]) said:
> > > I will give it to him that he know immigration,,,anything
> > > more thatn that he tries hard at and thinks he can shoot anything from
the
> > > lip and that will be the law.
> >
> > And you're a qualified lawyer, are you? Where did you study? Where
do
> > you practice? What was your score on the admission exam?
> >
> > You admit that Andrew knows immigration. It goes without saying
then,
> > Andrew would have a solid understanding on how the LAW relates to
> > immigration. Immigration and citizenship are in the same class, ergo
the
> > laws would essentially be the same.
> >
> > Andrew has been correct all along. Shoplifting is an indictable
offence
> > that MAY be prosecuted as a 'hybrid' offence at a later date. However
in
> > this case ("I stole the camera to make my wife happy") is not quite
going to
> > qualify as compassionate grounds.
> >
> > Furthermore, retailers have lobbied to have shoplifting classified
as a
> > more serious offence. That is why they prosecute thieves when they are
> > caught, and the criminal record DOES stay on the person's record. I am
not
> > a lawyer, but a very good friend of mine is a crown prosecutor in B.C.
We
> > were actually discussing shoplifting about a month ago (among other
> > offences).
> >
> > If you're so concerned about the welfare of the original poster, why
> > don't you give him your address so he can steal from you? After all,
his
> > wife still wants a digital camera...
Jan 26th 2004, 9:56 am
#53
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
Hello Cicero,
I am John. I have read all your postings including your opnions and
arguments with others about my case.
Regardless of what consequences I will face to, I'd like to say thank
you very much. You gave me confidence that make me and my wife out of
despair. My wife and I both donot know anything about canada laws.
Also we do not have some friends here. That is why I post messages
here. Since we want to get some advises from someone who are willing
to give me a hand so I can prepare myself well when I go to the law
court. But it is not meaning I want to conceal or lie something to the
judge for escaping my crime. No, that is what I mean
I am educated student. I got my B.Sc degree in my previous country and
received Master degree last Sept in Canada. I never did any crime in
my country. it is first time I committed offence. i know this is
guilty.
As a man, I am not afraid of any consequence I am about to undergo
Whatever put in prison or severe punlishments to me, I just worry
about my wife. I love her very much, I just think if I will be in
jail. How I take care of my wife. Her father always mentioned that
"you need to look after her, she is very young". I said "do not worry,
she will be fine with me"
When I recall this I feel very very bad.
So I just want to ask " is there a way or possibility to prevent me
from being in jail?", "is there a way I can do to result in light
punlishments?"
"Is it possible to get my Citizenship approval even I have crime
record?"
Now I've got basic understanding of my case and possible consequences
Whatever your oponion is correct or not, I do appreciate very much you
because you warm my heart and give me a little confidence to face the
reality.
I also thank someone else arguments about my case regardless of very
frustrating to me. But I want to point out that do not always assume
that I will steal something from people who is posting message here,
especially when claiming yourself as a law expert. I just want to ask
"Do you think it is correct to say "why don't you give him your
address so he can steal from you? After all, hiswife still wants a
digital camera..."
Remember this is forum that people post questions and get help from
forum
Not blaiming or attacking something.
If you donot have good suggestions, you do not need to say that
it is vey rude manner and i guess nobody will agree you not only I am
a criminial but also others!
Thank u again Cicero.
JOHN
I also welcome any advice on my case
Cicero <member18614@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Fist, we are not mates mr. iamnotamerican.com, I try to choose my
> company carefully. People who have a rude, know-it-all, arrogant
> attitude to immigrants and unable to admit when they are wrong ? like
> Miller and you - are not my company of interest or mates. Sorry.
>
>
> There is a huge difference between being direct and - being direct but
> also arrogant and rude.
>
> You for example called a guy to be a thief.
> Most likely, everyone ? excluding probably saint like you - never have
> had stolen something, sometime in their life (maybe not knowingly or as
> kid). So, I can?t label a person to be a thief for this and I am
> bothered when someone does it right of the bat. It is not a personal
> characteristics; if a person does that on recurring basis that could be
> a different case. No mater how you do think about it - it is extremly
> rude to call a person in first e-mail that he sends that way. However, I
> would rather that know-it-all-wanna-be?s look first in themselves rather
> than to label and chastise here immigrants that are patiently and
> painfully waiting for number of years to come in the country and get the
> citizenship that deserve. John seems to be one of those people who made
> a mistake that he is aware but have a good chances going to lawyer and
> be successful and not to listen arrogant- wanna-be?s like Miller and a
> bizarre guy like Iamnotamerican.com.
>
> Back to the case at hand....
>
> The
> point of difference is around the statement of the experts summarized by
> one: ??"pending criminal charges prohibit him from getting citizenship."
> That is absolutely incorrect.
>
> His chances look extremely good even
> with this option and there are number additional ways that John should
> be exploring with attorney not listening to non-lawyers and / or self-
> proclaimed experts like iamnotamerican.com and Miller; I am nether
> advcating that he needs to listens me word-for-word but at least to
> throw away prvennly wrong negative and arogant advice.
>
> The question
> that everything boils down to: Is the charge or trail be for indictable
> offense or not per Article 22 (Miller earlier cited whole article).
> Next, I cited definition for hybrid offense (summary conviction and
> indictable substitute) which this situation comes upon as per
> definition:
>
> ?Hybrid offences include impaired driving, assault and
> theft under $5,000.?
>
> It clearly, states that Crown decides based on
> the circumstances is it summary or indictable. According to all listed
> circumstances ? I wrote that more elaborately in the previous post ?
> this is clearly would be under the most minor offences ? summary. So,
> John would be in all reasonable likelihood fine in getting citizenship
> and should avoid negative and wrong advices of prolific self-proclaimed
> experts.
>
> I advise also to use attorney for this case and to fight it
> not to accept opinion of self-proclaimed experts to give up. The
> chances are excellent for success at the end! There are number of
> possibilities with this case that any knowledgeable attorney would be
> able to pursue it.
>
>
> Originally posted by
> Http://Www.Iamnotamerican.Com
I am John. I have read all your postings including your opnions and
arguments with others about my case.
Regardless of what consequences I will face to, I'd like to say thank
you very much. You gave me confidence that make me and my wife out of
despair. My wife and I both donot know anything about canada laws.
Also we do not have some friends here. That is why I post messages
here. Since we want to get some advises from someone who are willing
to give me a hand so I can prepare myself well when I go to the law
court. But it is not meaning I want to conceal or lie something to the
judge for escaping my crime. No, that is what I mean
I am educated student. I got my B.Sc degree in my previous country and
received Master degree last Sept in Canada. I never did any crime in
my country. it is first time I committed offence. i know this is
guilty.
As a man, I am not afraid of any consequence I am about to undergo
Whatever put in prison or severe punlishments to me, I just worry
about my wife. I love her very much, I just think if I will be in
jail. How I take care of my wife. Her father always mentioned that
"you need to look after her, she is very young". I said "do not worry,
she will be fine with me"
When I recall this I feel very very bad.
So I just want to ask " is there a way or possibility to prevent me
from being in jail?", "is there a way I can do to result in light
punlishments?"
"Is it possible to get my Citizenship approval even I have crime
record?"
Now I've got basic understanding of my case and possible consequences
Whatever your oponion is correct or not, I do appreciate very much you
because you warm my heart and give me a little confidence to face the
reality.
I also thank someone else arguments about my case regardless of very
frustrating to me. But I want to point out that do not always assume
that I will steal something from people who is posting message here,
especially when claiming yourself as a law expert. I just want to ask
"Do you think it is correct to say "why don't you give him your
address so he can steal from you? After all, hiswife still wants a
digital camera..."
Remember this is forum that people post questions and get help from
forum
Not blaiming or attacking something.
If you donot have good suggestions, you do not need to say that
it is vey rude manner and i guess nobody will agree you not only I am
a criminial but also others!
Thank u again Cicero.
JOHN
I also welcome any advice on my case
Cicero <member18614@british_expats.com> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Fist, we are not mates mr. iamnotamerican.com, I try to choose my
> company carefully. People who have a rude, know-it-all, arrogant
> attitude to immigrants and unable to admit when they are wrong ? like
> Miller and you - are not my company of interest or mates. Sorry.
>
>
> There is a huge difference between being direct and - being direct but
> also arrogant and rude.
>
> You for example called a guy to be a thief.
> Most likely, everyone ? excluding probably saint like you - never have
> had stolen something, sometime in their life (maybe not knowingly or as
> kid). So, I can?t label a person to be a thief for this and I am
> bothered when someone does it right of the bat. It is not a personal
> characteristics; if a person does that on recurring basis that could be
> a different case. No mater how you do think about it - it is extremly
> rude to call a person in first e-mail that he sends that way. However, I
> would rather that know-it-all-wanna-be?s look first in themselves rather
> than to label and chastise here immigrants that are patiently and
> painfully waiting for number of years to come in the country and get the
> citizenship that deserve. John seems to be one of those people who made
> a mistake that he is aware but have a good chances going to lawyer and
> be successful and not to listen arrogant- wanna-be?s like Miller and a
> bizarre guy like Iamnotamerican.com.
>
> Back to the case at hand....
>
> The
> point of difference is around the statement of the experts summarized by
> one: ??"pending criminal charges prohibit him from getting citizenship."
> That is absolutely incorrect.
>
> His chances look extremely good even
> with this option and there are number additional ways that John should
> be exploring with attorney not listening to non-lawyers and / or self-
> proclaimed experts like iamnotamerican.com and Miller; I am nether
> advcating that he needs to listens me word-for-word but at least to
> throw away prvennly wrong negative and arogant advice.
>
> The question
> that everything boils down to: Is the charge or trail be for indictable
> offense or not per Article 22 (Miller earlier cited whole article).
> Next, I cited definition for hybrid offense (summary conviction and
> indictable substitute) which this situation comes upon as per
> definition:
>
> ?Hybrid offences include impaired driving, assault and
> theft under $5,000.?
>
> It clearly, states that Crown decides based on
> the circumstances is it summary or indictable. According to all listed
> circumstances ? I wrote that more elaborately in the previous post ?
> this is clearly would be under the most minor offences ? summary. So,
> John would be in all reasonable likelihood fine in getting citizenship
> and should avoid negative and wrong advices of prolific self-proclaimed
> experts.
>
> I advise also to use attorney for this case and to fight it
> not to accept opinion of self-proclaimed experts to give up. The
> chances are excellent for success at the end! There are number of
> possibilities with this case that any knowledgeable attorney would be
> able to pursue it.
>
>
> Originally posted by
> Http://Www.Iamnotamerican.Com
Jan 26th 2004, 6:32 pm
#54
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
John,
You are welcome. You seem to be a nice guy, that made a mistake. Everyone does to different degree (we are all humans), draws serious conclusions not to repeat those things, take appropriate actions, pays appropriate price (not over from what it deserves) and move happily forward.
It clearly there are should be preventions against applicants with serious crimes but law makes clear distinction about type of offenses. If the person is charged / sentenced for an indictable offense that he would be prevented for getting the citizenship although there are number of possibilities even if the charge, sentence has been made. This is not the case in your situation as many time said and you will be absolutly fine in all reasonable likelhood with citizenship application.
Although, you seem reluctant to take the lawyer - my advices from the begging was to take one. There are many aspects that need to be looked at (like citizenship) although his seem to be a standard case.
To answer these of your questions directly:
"So I just want to ask " is there a way or possibility to prevent me
from being in jail?", "is there a way I can do to result in light
punishments?"
For this type of theft under the circumstances, in all reasonable likelihood, you would pay fine but there would be no jail time.
"Is it possible to get my Citizenship approval even I have crime
record?"
In your case, as I mentioned earlier several times, you have absolutely excellent chances of getting the citizenship despite the circumstance. Talk with the lawyer, explore possibilities and you would be absolutely fine. Mean-spirtied arogant people - that you had wrote here - are better to be avioded.
Good luck and no need for despair at all.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
You are welcome. You seem to be a nice guy, that made a mistake. Everyone does to different degree (we are all humans), draws serious conclusions not to repeat those things, take appropriate actions, pays appropriate price (not over from what it deserves) and move happily forward.
It clearly there are should be preventions against applicants with serious crimes but law makes clear distinction about type of offenses. If the person is charged / sentenced for an indictable offense that he would be prevented for getting the citizenship although there are number of possibilities even if the charge, sentence has been made. This is not the case in your situation as many time said and you will be absolutly fine in all reasonable likelhood with citizenship application.
Although, you seem reluctant to take the lawyer - my advices from the begging was to take one. There are many aspects that need to be looked at (like citizenship) although his seem to be a standard case.
To answer these of your questions directly:
"So I just want to ask " is there a way or possibility to prevent me
from being in jail?", "is there a way I can do to result in light
punishments?"
For this type of theft under the circumstances, in all reasonable likelihood, you would pay fine but there would be no jail time.
"Is it possible to get my Citizenship approval even I have crime
record?"
In your case, as I mentioned earlier several times, you have absolutely excellent chances of getting the citizenship despite the circumstance. Talk with the lawyer, explore possibilities and you would be absolutely fine. Mean-spirtied arogant people - that you had wrote here - are better to be avioded.
Good luck and no need for despair at all.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by John
Jan 26th 2004, 10:16 pm
#55
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
Cicero wrote:
>
> How absurd would be a case if an immigrant charged for any small offense
> in the whole world is precluded for getting the citizenship while the
> charge lasts? So, following that logic, if you have a process that is
> dragging for years for frivolous thing - you won't be able to get the
> citizenship.
It might be absurd, you idiot, but that's the law.
>
> How absurd would be a case if an immigrant charged for any small offense
> in the whole world is precluded for getting the citizenship while the
> charge lasts? So, following that logic, if you have a process that is
> dragging for years for frivolous thing - you won't be able to get the
> citizenship.
It might be absurd, you idiot, but that's the law.
Jan 26th 2004, 11:08 pm
#56
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
Another proof how low these "experts" can go - when there are no argument than the insult for anyone that can think with his own head and looks only to the facts and plain arguments!
A great way to show, how you are treating your prospective clients! Something to learn for anyone that is looking to your services!
Your interpretation is clearly wrong, and I have been explained this over and over again. There were so many posts on this and if you can't comprehend -sorry. Look to the earlier elaborations that I did, it is clear that John has extremely good chances of being succsfull. You are reading wongly that anyone who is charged is forbiden to get a citizenship which is not correct - there is another part of sentance that you are missreading - it is qualified for certain types of ofenses)
All you can is to attack in hoard and groups - you can't win any one-one with me - so try to compensate with ton of writing, personal attacks. Tons of your posts would not change a thing and the immigrant here will be successful without listening your mean-spirited, moronic personas here.
Another proof how arrogant, insulting these group of stupid creatures are and how better is to avoid them since they clearly can't get.
P.S. Another reason to go with a reputable lawyer - if you really want to go at all with someone for your immigration case. CIC is statign that consultants are not needed, per my previous known posts and CIC's web site.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by S B
A great way to show, how you are treating your prospective clients! Something to learn for anyone that is looking to your services!
Your interpretation is clearly wrong, and I have been explained this over and over again. There were so many posts on this and if you can't comprehend -sorry. Look to the earlier elaborations that I did, it is clear that John has extremely good chances of being succsfull. You are reading wongly that anyone who is charged is forbiden to get a citizenship which is not correct - there is another part of sentance that you are missreading - it is qualified for certain types of ofenses)
All you can is to attack in hoard and groups - you can't win any one-one with me - so try to compensate with ton of writing, personal attacks. Tons of your posts would not change a thing and the immigrant here will be successful without listening your mean-spirited, moronic personas here.
Another proof how arrogant, insulting these group of stupid creatures are and how better is to avoid them since they clearly can't get.
P.S. Another reason to go with a reputable lawyer - if you really want to go at all with someone for your immigration case. CIC is statign that consultants are not needed, per my previous known posts and CIC's web site.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by S B
Jan 27th 2004, 4:01 am
#57
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
Cicero (member18614@british_expats.com) wrote:
>
> Another proof how low these "experts" can go - when there are no
> argument than the insult for anyone that can think with his own head and
> looks only to the facts and plain arguments!
...and, in the same article:
> Another proof how arrogant, insulting
> these group of stupid creatures are and how better is to avoid them
> since they clearly can't get.
>
> Another proof how low these "experts" can go - when there are no
> argument than the insult for anyone that can think with his own head and
> looks only to the facts and plain arguments!
...and, in the same article:
> Another proof how arrogant, insulting
> these group of stupid creatures are and how better is to avoid them
> since they clearly can't get.
Jan 27th 2004, 6:49 am
#58
Forum Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 73
Re: What lawyer can do me?
When someone is rude that he will get an adequate treatment from me back (sometimes by ignore ,or kill file, or sometimes by a bit harsher response).
By the way….
When iamnotamerican.com posted reply to me message, I responded here – in essence - that I would be ignoring him. Then, he changed to his other Tricky alias trying unsuccessfully to hide his identity. As several posts were done in the same sequence of time it was easy to spot who is actually posting. If you bother to look just briefly to history, there is so much filth in his previous quarrels on the Net that just a casual look to the e-mail and link would make you not to have any contact with this argumentative and bizarre person.
Someone (DonP) posted in this newsgroup earlier bio background and the links about him. So be aware of www.iamnotamerican.com – an “expert� wanna-be.
Wrom: SKVFVWRKJVZCMHVIBGDADRZ
Subject: Re: deportation
View: Complete Thread (34 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: misc.immigration.canada
Date: 2004-01-06 11:31:33 PST
Cicero,
If you didn't know, this Aussie wacko, Trevor L. Wilson, that posts here
under iamnotamerican.com, is a real dick. He is a real rebel in the Usenet
community for his useless responses with personal attack. He posts under
various nick including Trikky T. Google around to find out some of his
history and his previous flamewars with literally thousands of people:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...-1&q=Trikky+T.
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=tr...&start=10&sa=N
He is, in fact, not here to help anybody out. He is here solely to promote
his nonsense website and generate some revenue out of it. He will often jump
on any thread with one or two liner response definitely with some sort of
personal attack. But, whenever somebody disagree with him, he'll write a
full page of nonsense garbage and continue on and on. He never gets bored,
no matter how much clear message you send that he is unwanted.
While he tries to preach netiquette to others, he doesn't himself care about
that... look at his sig and nick to get an idea. In my long time larking in
misc.immigration.canada I have hardly met such a rude and short tempered
person. He is a real jerk:
http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame34.html
I really hope that he has friends in his real life and doesn't behave with
them in the same manner. Or, does he really have a life? Oh, well...
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Trikky
By the way….
When iamnotamerican.com posted reply to me message, I responded here – in essence - that I would be ignoring him. Then, he changed to his other Tricky alias trying unsuccessfully to hide his identity. As several posts were done in the same sequence of time it was easy to spot who is actually posting. If you bother to look just briefly to history, there is so much filth in his previous quarrels on the Net that just a casual look to the e-mail and link would make you not to have any contact with this argumentative and bizarre person.
Someone (DonP) posted in this newsgroup earlier bio background and the links about him. So be aware of www.iamnotamerican.com – an “expert� wanna-be.
Wrom: SKVFVWRKJVZCMHVIBGDADRZ
Subject: Re: deportation
View: Complete Thread (34 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: misc.immigration.canada
Date: 2004-01-06 11:31:33 PST
Cicero,
If you didn't know, this Aussie wacko, Trevor L. Wilson, that posts here
under iamnotamerican.com, is a real dick. He is a real rebel in the Usenet
community for his useless responses with personal attack. He posts under
various nick including Trikky T. Google around to find out some of his
history and his previous flamewars with literally thousands of people:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e...-1&q=Trikky+T.
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=tr...&start=10&sa=N
He is, in fact, not here to help anybody out. He is here solely to promote
his nonsense website and generate some revenue out of it. He will often jump
on any thread with one or two liner response definitely with some sort of
personal attack. But, whenever somebody disagree with him, he'll write a
full page of nonsense garbage and continue on and on. He never gets bored,
no matter how much clear message you send that he is unwanted.
While he tries to preach netiquette to others, he doesn't himself care about
that... look at his sig and nick to get an idea. In my long time larking in
misc.immigration.canada I have hardly met such a rude and short tempered
person. He is a real jerk:
http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame34.html
I really hope that he has friends in his real life and doesn't behave with
them in the same manner. Or, does he really have a life? Oh, well...
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Trikky
Jan 27th 2004, 1:42 pm
#59
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
Cicero wrote:
>
> Another proof how low these "experts" can go - when there are no
> argument than the insult for anyone that can think with his own head and
> looks only to the facts and plain arguments!
>
> A great way to show, how
> you are treating your prospective clients! Something to learn for anyone
> that is looking to your services!
>
> Your interpretation is clearly wrong,
> and I have been explained this over and over again. There were so many
> posts on this and if you can't comprehend -sorry. Look to the earlier
> elaborations that I did, it is clear that John has extremely good
> chances of being succsfull. You are reading wongly that anyone who is
> charged is forbiden to get a citizenship which is not correct - there is
> another part of sentance that you are missreading - it is qualified for
> certain types of ofenses)
What kind of bloody idiot are you? First, I am not an immigration
professional but you assume that I am.
I wouldn't say that John has an extremely good chance of being
succesful.
What part of "His citizenship cannot be *processed* until the charges
against him have been resolved" don't you understand? That doesn't say
that he can't get citizenship ... just not until either he is cleared,
or convicted (and if convicted, CIC still must make the determination
based on the evidence before them that he is permitted citizenship).
What has stating facts got to do with being mean spirited?
Clearly you have a gripe with anyone who contradicts you and you
especially have a hate on for professionals.
Your advice, just like Singh's advice, must be looked at with a lot of
scrutiny, because the chances of it being wrong are high; misleading -
extremely high; bigoted - ridiculously high. Moreover it's not
particularly moral to set people's expectations unrealistically high,
like you want to.
The facts ...
>
> Another proof how low these "experts" can go - when there are no
> argument than the insult for anyone that can think with his own head and
> looks only to the facts and plain arguments!
>
> A great way to show, how
> you are treating your prospective clients! Something to learn for anyone
> that is looking to your services!
>
> Your interpretation is clearly wrong,
> and I have been explained this over and over again. There were so many
> posts on this and if you can't comprehend -sorry. Look to the earlier
> elaborations that I did, it is clear that John has extremely good
> chances of being succsfull. You are reading wongly that anyone who is
> charged is forbiden to get a citizenship which is not correct - there is
> another part of sentance that you are missreading - it is qualified for
> certain types of ofenses)
What kind of bloody idiot are you? First, I am not an immigration
professional but you assume that I am.
I wouldn't say that John has an extremely good chance of being
succesful.
What part of "His citizenship cannot be *processed* until the charges
against him have been resolved" don't you understand? That doesn't say
that he can't get citizenship ... just not until either he is cleared,
or convicted (and if convicted, CIC still must make the determination
based on the evidence before them that he is permitted citizenship).
What has stating facts got to do with being mean spirited?
Clearly you have a gripe with anyone who contradicts you and you
especially have a hate on for professionals.
Your advice, just like Singh's advice, must be looked at with a lot of
scrutiny, because the chances of it being wrong are high; misleading -
extremely high; bigoted - ridiculously high. Moreover it's not
particularly moral to set people's expectations unrealistically high,
like you want to.
The facts ...
Jan 27th 2004, 3:17 pm
#60
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: What lawyer can do me?
in a recent article, Cicero (member18614@british_expats.com) said:
>
> When someone is rude that he will get an adequate treatment from me back
> (sometimes by ignore ,or kill file, or sometimes by a bit harsher
> response).
Please...oh please...killfile me. Sorry, mate...if your best 'response'
is to quote someone else's slander about me, than you don't really have any
response now, do you.
I notice you don't like the way I pointed out your hypocrisy.
Criticising people for allegedly using insults, then proceeding to insult
people in exactly the same posts. I notice also you didn't respond to my
pointing out your hypocrisy. Perhaps I was right?
You give terrible 'advice' "Cicero". You give hope where there is
little to none, and you find that more right than people actually ANSWERING
THE QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED?
I have been helping in this newsgroup for a much longer time than you.
I will be helping in this newsgroup for a much longer time than you. I
will also keep your responses in check.
I just feel sorry for those who actually fall victim to your falsely
positive responses. Hope springs eternal. Hope is good. False hope,
however, is not.
Oh...one more thing...as for supposedly 'hiding' my identity: Sorry
again, didn't happen. Was a matter of selecting the wrong profile out of
about 15. But I know you're desperate, so that's fine.
--
Say "I am not American" in TWELVE languages.
The original "I am not American" T-shirts - as seen on CNN
http://www.iamnotamerican.com
Remove underscores (_) from Email address to reply.
>
> When someone is rude that he will get an adequate treatment from me back
> (sometimes by ignore ,or kill file, or sometimes by a bit harsher
> response).
Please...oh please...killfile me. Sorry, mate...if your best 'response'
is to quote someone else's slander about me, than you don't really have any
response now, do you.
I notice you don't like the way I pointed out your hypocrisy.
Criticising people for allegedly using insults, then proceeding to insult
people in exactly the same posts. I notice also you didn't respond to my
pointing out your hypocrisy. Perhaps I was right?
You give terrible 'advice' "Cicero". You give hope where there is
little to none, and you find that more right than people actually ANSWERING
THE QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED?
I have been helping in this newsgroup for a much longer time than you.
I will be helping in this newsgroup for a much longer time than you. I
will also keep your responses in check.
I just feel sorry for those who actually fall victim to your falsely
positive responses. Hope springs eternal. Hope is good. False hope,
however, is not.
Oh...one more thing...as for supposedly 'hiding' my identity: Sorry
again, didn't happen. Was a matter of selecting the wrong profile out of
about 15. But I know you're desperate, so that's fine.
--
Say "I am not American" in TWELVE languages.
The original "I am not American" T-shirts - as seen on CNN
http://www.iamnotamerican.com
Remove underscores (_) from Email address to reply.