British Expats

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-   -   Living in Hungary - why? (https://britishexpats.com/forum/hungary-140/living-hungary-why-925517/)

Assanah Jun 6th 2019 12:43 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Susan Delgado (Post 12693693)
thank you, that at least gives an explanation. Hungarians (me included) are fleeing Orban's regime by the ten thousands, and honestly it surprises me that there is any traffic at all in the opposite direction

Shouldn't you be staying in Hungary and fight for change? I always wonder what will happen in the long run to countries if people run away instead of trying to better things.

Moses2013 Jun 6th 2019 12:51 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Expatrick (Post 12694060)
Slightly bizarre attempt at finding something that simply isn't there!

"Avoiding Brits" usually means avoiding groups / enclaves / communities of ex pat Brits, not shunning individual Brits on sight, sound or contact. We have Brits living in our street (including the Ambassador & his Wife) who we pass the time of day with - if we happen to see them, we don't cross the road to avoid them!

Your last sentence doesn't make sense - how would they know what?

No sense of humour today? Now you say Avoiding Brits" usually means avoiding groups / enclaves / communities of ex pat Brits, not shunning individual Brits on sight, sound or contact.
How would you know if a person is British?

Expatrick Jun 6th 2019 1:00 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Moses2013 (Post 12694076)
No sense of humour today? Now you say Avoiding Brits" usually means avoiding groups / enclaves / communities of ex pat Brits, not shunning individual Brits on sight, sound or contact.
How would you know if a person is British?

You say "now you say", seemingly implying that I have changed my tune - which I haven't.

If a group (or other) has the word "British" in its title that's usually a pretty good indicator.

Brits are often easy to spot - Hungarians spot us a mile off!

Moses2013 Jun 6th 2019 1:06 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Expatrick (Post 12694086)
You say "now you say", seemingly implying that I have changed my tune - which I haven't.

If a group (or other) has the word "British" in its title that's usually a pretty good indicator.

Brits are often easy to spot - Hungarians spot us a mile off!

Well first you said you managed to avoid all British expats, so that sounded like you avoided anyone with a British passport.
Of course you can also recognize a German, as they wear Jack Wolfskin:-) but how would a Hungarian spot if someone is from the Isle of Man or is actually from Dublin?

Peter_in_Hungary Jun 6th 2019 1:19 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
People migrate for lot of reasons with lifestyle and economic being close to the top of the list. Sometimes people are invited by the host country, think the Windrush generation, the 10 pound pomms to Australia, the Sváb invited to Hungary to repopulate after the wars (1700s) and more recently Angela Merkel open invitation to migrate to Germany.

We came to Hungary in 1994/5 for lifestyle and economic reasons, we wanted to farm and could not afford to do this in the UK. We looked at several options and the fact that SWMBO was Hungarian and had family here featured heavily in the choice. IMO those who move for only economic reasons will be the most likely to go back, I suspect pensioners who move to get a better (cheaper) lifestyle feature high on the list of migration failures.

Integration doesn’t happen! Every city had (has) its china town, Italian quarter, Jewish quarter etc. Here villages are still known as ‘Sváb villages’ that have their own characteristics and where some still speak German today. My mother-in-Law only spoke German until she was 3 years old. The UK is no different, I remember in my youth Brixton (South London) being almost a no go area for white people. So I am not surprised that expats congregate together. IMO Merkel’s open invitation to migrants is going to cause trouble. They won’t integrate any more than other migrants have in the past and as far as I can see there is a majority of young men 25 – 35 which is going to cause a demographic imbalance that sooner or later will bite back. Also having spoken to a couple of people teaching the migrants a number are illiterate in their own language so when will they be ‘useful to Germany’?

To get to the point of this thread, why Hungary, well, apart from SWMBOs family connections which eased the decision about Hungary, once we got here there was / is lots that keeps us here, climate, the people, the opportunity we found to build our dream, the fact that our kids (2) could go to the school on the bus safely on their own, (and the public transport is affordable and works, try saying that about the UK). The education system is better than the UK, (my son got into the top 30 in the national physics competition at the age of 14 err...not sure they even have such things in the UK), both got to Uni and tipped out with engineering degrees (one with honours) and without debt, I doubt that would happened in the UK. The health service, we have never needed to hand over ‘brown envelops’, and have always been seen properly with acceptable wait times for specialists and a walk in GP service. And yes we have integrated, admittedly easier because SWMBO in Hungarian but both kids (now 30+) have married Hungarians with no thought of leaving but have taken the decision to bring up their children bilingual. I also find that people, including the young, are more respectful here, in fact respect is built into the grammar of the language.

The politics of Hungary is IMO often misrepresented. It is family centred and orientated, which reflects the views of much of the population. Orban is not (IMO) a racist as often portrayed rather he is pro-Hungarian. This annoys several in Brussels who don’t like his stand on migration. Merkel opened the gates to Germany, Hungary has kept her gates shut, well not shut, refugees are still allowed in if they follow the rules but few want to stay, they just want to get to Western Europe. And whilst on the subject of letting people in, Hungary gets criticised but we don’t here too much criticism of the UK about the migrant camps at Calais.

Many of the recent policies of the government have been aimed at encouraging Hungarians abroad to return to reverse the brain drain, (when was the brain drain news in the UK 60s/70s??) and to encourage young families. Hungary has had a falling population recently, but then if you take away the migrant population of W. Europe then you will see the same there.

All in all I like it here with no plans to move!

Brain dump over!

Moses2013 Jun 6th 2019 1:48 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Peter_in_Hungary (Post 12694102)
People migrate for lot of reasons with lifestyle and economic being close to the top of the list. Sometimes people are invited by the host country, think the Windrush generation, the 10 pound pomms to Australia, the Sváb invited to Hungary to repopulate after the wars (1700s) and more recently Angela Merkel open invitation to migrate to Germany.

We came to Hungary in 1994/5 for lifestyle and economic reasons, we wanted to farm and could not afford to do this in the UK. We looked at several options and the fact that SWMBO was Hungarian and had family here featured heavily in the choice. IMO those who move for only economic reasons will be the most likely to go back, I suspect pensioners who move to get a better (cheaper) lifestyle feature high on the list of migration failures.

Integration doesn’t happen! Every city had (has) its china town, Italian quarter, Jewish quarter etc. Here villages are still known as ‘Sváb villages’ that have their own characteristics and where some still speak German today. My mother-in-Law only spoke German until she was 3 years old. The UK is no different, I remember in my youth Brixton (South London) being almost a no go area for white people. So I am not surprised that expats congregate together. IMO Merkel’s open invitation to migrants is going to cause trouble. They won’t integrate any more than other migrants have in the past and as far as I can see there is a majority of young men 25 – 35 which is going to cause a demographic imbalance that sooner or later will bite back. Also having spoken to a couple of people teaching the migrants a number are illiterate in their own language so when will they be ‘useful to Germany’?

To get to the point of this thread, why Hungary, well, apart from SWMBOs family connections which eased the decision about Hungary, once we got here there was / is lots that keeps us here, climate, the people, the opportunity we found to build our dream, the fact that our kids (2) could go to the school on the bus safely on their own, (and the public transport is affordable and works, try saying that about the UK). The education system is better than the UK, (my son got into the top 30 in the national physics competition at the age of 14 err...not sure they even have such things in the UK), both got to Uni and tipped out with engineering degrees (one with honours) and without debt, I doubt that would happened in the UK. The health service, we have never needed to hand over ‘brown envelops’, and have always been seen properly with acceptable wait times for specialists and a walk in GP service. And yes we have integrated, admittedly easier because SWMBO in Hungarian but both kids (now 30+) have married Hungarians with no thought of leaving but have taken the decision to bring up their children bilingual. I also find that people, including the young, are more respectful here, in fact respect is built into the grammar of the language.

The politics of Hungary is IMO often misrepresented. It is family centred and orientated, which reflects the views of much of the population. Orban is not (IMO) a racist as often portrayed rather he is pro-Hungarian. This annoys several in Brussels who don’t like his stand on migration. Merkel opened the gates to Germany, Hungary has kept her gates shut, well not shut, refugees are still allowed in if they follow the rules but few want to stay, they just want to get to Western Europe. And whilst on the subject of letting people in, Hungary gets criticised but we don’t here too much criticism of the UK about the migrant camps at Calais.

Many of the recent policies of the government have been aimed at encouraging Hungarians abroad to return to reverse the brain drain, (when was the brain drain news in the UK 60s/70s??) and to encourage young families. Hungary has had a falling population recently, but then if you take away the migrant population of W. Europe then you will see the same there.

All in all I like it here with no plans to move!

Brain dump over!

As you say, there are many reasons why people move but you had the big advantage of coming from a wealthier country, so many things seemed more affordable. It's all about location too and even I can remember that in Jersey (Channel Islands) kids went to school safely. Merkel let people in because of Germany's history and she thought that letting more people in would solve the pension crisis (That's another problem). People from wealthier countries are now looking for less crowded places and the people from less crowded places just want to go to the city where they can find work.

Expatrick Jun 6th 2019 1:50 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Assanah (Post 12694072)
Shouldn't you be staying in Hungary and fight for change? I always wonder what will happen in the long run to countries if people run away instead of trying to better things.

I think the OP​​​'s point "thousands of Hungarians are fleeing Orban's regime" is rather overdramatic, though in fairness if she has been watching the BBC (for example) in the last few years I can understand why she might think this! Indeed even DW, usually
​​​​​​very balanced in its reporting, was waxing almost hysterical about Hungary very recently.
​​​​​
Many Hungarians I know of only leave for a year or 3 for reasons of personal advancement or experience, returning in due course. More importantly the National Statistical Office has reported a recent upsurge in long term Hungarian expats returning to Hungary as well as a reduction in net emigration to the positive (for Hungary).So long as the economy continues to progress (> 5% growth in Q1 2019) then Orbán will continue to retain significant support, aided further by his "Hungary & Hungarians first policies".

It is interesting (& encouraging) to note that Momentum polled 50% more votes in the recent election than Jobbik.


Originally Posted by Moses2013 (Post 12694092)
Well first you said you managed to avoid all British expats, so that sounded like you avoided anyone with a British passport.
Of course you can also recognize a German, as they wear Jack Wolfskin:-) but how would a Hungarian spot if someone is from the Isle of Man or is actually from Dublin?

No, I said I avoided Brit expats, not people with British passports - not the same thing, as well you know. I shall ignore your last sentence as it is pointless!


Originally Posted by Peter_in_Hungary (Post 12694102)
People migrate for lot of reasons with lifestyle and economic being close to the top of the list. Sometimes people are invited by the host country, think the Windrush generation, the 10 pound pomms to Australia, the Sváb invited to Hungary to repopulate after the wars (1700s) and more recently Angela Merkel open invitation to migrate to Germany.

We came to Hungary in 1994/5 for lifestyle and economic reasons, we wanted to farm and could not afford to do this in the UK. We looked at several options and the fact that SWMBO was Hungarian and had family here featured heavily in the choice. IMO those who move for only economic reasons will be the most likely to go back, I suspect pensioners who move to get a better (cheaper) lifestyle feature high on the list of migration failures.

Integration doesn’t happen! Every city had (has) its china town, Italian quarter, Jewish quarter etc. Here villages are still known as ‘Sváb villages’ that have their own characteristics and where some still speak German today. My mother-in-Law only spoke German until she was 3 years old. The UK is no different, I remember in my youth Brixton (South London) being almost a no go area for white people. So I am not surprised that expats congregate together. IMO Merkel’s open invitation to migrants is going to cause trouble. They won’t integrate any more than other migrants have in the past and as far as I can see there is a majority of young men 25 – 35 which is going to cause a demographic imbalance that sooner or later will bite back. Also having spoken to a couple of people teaching the migrants a number are illiterate in their own language so when will they be ‘useful to Germany’?

To get to the point of this thread, why Hungary, well, apart from SWMBOs family connections which eased the decision about Hungary, once we got here there was / is lots that keeps us here, climate, the people, the opportunity we found to build our dream, the fact that our kids (2) could go to the school on the bus safely on their own, (and the public transport is affordable and works, try saying that about the UK). The education system is better than the UK, (my son got into the top 30 in the national physics competition at the age of 14 err...not sure they even have such things in the UK), both got to Uni and tipped out with engineering degrees (one with honours) and without debt, I doubt that would happened in the UK. The health service, we have never needed to hand over ‘brown envelops’, and have always been seen properly with acceptable wait times for specialists and a walk in GP service. And yes we have integrated, admittedly easier because SWMBO in Hungarian but both kids (now 30+) have married Hungarians with no thought of leaving but have taken the decision to bring up their children bilingual. I also find that people, including the young, are more respectful here, in fact respect is built into the grammar of the language.

The politics of Hungary is IMO often misrepresented. It is family centred and orientated, which reflects the views of much of the population. Orban is not (IMO) a racist as often portrayed rather he is pro-Hungarian. This annoys several in Brussels who don’t like his stand on migration. Merkel opened the gates to Germany, Hungary has kept her gates shut, well not shut, refugees are still allowed in if they follow the rules but few want to stay, they just want to get to Western Europe. And whilst on the subject of letting people in, Hungary gets criticised but we don’t here too much criticism of the UK about the migrant camps at Calais.

Many of the recent policies of the government have been aimed at encouraging Hungarians abroad to return to reverse the brain drain, (when was the brain drain news in the UK 60s/70s??) and to encourage young families. Hungary has had a falling population recently, but then if you take away the migrant population of W. Europe then you will see the same there.

All in all I like it here with no plans to move!

Brain dump over!

:goodpost: as always!

Moses2013 Jun 6th 2019 2:34 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by Expatrick (Post 12694124)
No, I said I avoided Brit expats, not people with British passports - not the same thing, as well you know. I shall ignore your last sentence as it is pointless!

Well then everything is pointless. What is a British Expat? A person who lives outside their native country like yourself:confused:.
If you'd say you don't go to British pubs and rather go to a local that's fine.

Expatrick Jun 6th 2019 3:56 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
The trees, all the wonderful trees!

enter Jun 6th 2019 4:35 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
I forgot to add on my post that I have, over the few years, found "certain" peoples response to questions I have asked very factual and helpful. Also some folk add relevant information to help others to live here, others text posts with no substance just waffle probably to get their post numbers up :).
By the way we have been notified that a new law is in place that you cannot cut your grass with machines from 9pm to 8am any day, and cutting grass on a Sunday is banned, also on a Sunday using any noisy machinery such as saws/angle grinders that may upset the neighbours, any factual confirmation/views on that, other views, pointless!.:)

Expatrick Jun 6th 2019 4:39 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by enter (Post 12694255)
By the way we have been notified that a new law is in place that you cannot cut your grass with machines from 9pm to 8am any day, and cutting grass on a Sunday is banned, also on a Sunday using any noisy machinery such as saws/angle grinders that may upset the neighbours, any factual confirmation/views on that, other views, pointless!.:)

Good! - this issue was debated in this forum a while ago with very mixed responses.

scot47 Jun 6th 2019 7:55 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
"Family-centred" ? That was what General Franco claimed.

Peter_in_Hungary Jun 6th 2019 8:12 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
And another good thing here...and how could I forget living in the Balaton Felvidék...The Wine.........however having misspent part of my youth in Belgium I won't mention Hungarian beer!!!!.

Expatrick Jun 6th 2019 8:21 pm

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 
And another - avoiding the constant whining that has become so prevalent in British society!

PaulinEger Jun 7th 2019 5:49 am

Re: Living in Hungary - why?
 

Originally Posted by enter (Post 12694255)
By the way we have been notified that a new law is in place that you cannot cut your grass with machines from 9pm to 8am any day, and cutting grass on a Sunday is banned, also on a Sunday using any noisy machinery such as saws/angle grinders that may upset the neighbours, any factual confirmation/views on that, other views, pointless!.:)

Is that a national law or just local to your area?
I hope it's not national as the weekends are the only time I get to do any outdoor work. And that's been more difficult this year due to the amount of rain that we've had.


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