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BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

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Old Jan 25th 2013, 12:39 pm
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by dreadsoc
....the Indian giovt who made assurances to the BHC that for those under investigation of the DoE who had heard nothing for one year could consider themselves no longer being investigated.
The latest activity shows this was nothing but false promise.

Dread - x
Dread - fwiw my recollection is that BHCI said people who'd heard nothing for a year should contact them???

AndyD 8-)#
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Old Jan 25th 2013, 1:04 pm
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Final(ish) List of Q's for Meeting on 28/1/13
VISAS
The visa fees just announced for British Passport holders bear a remarkable similarity to the fees charged to Indians for British visas.
6 months 7050 @ 87.25 £81 ~ £82
2 years 24300 @ 87.25 £278 ~£277
5 years 44650 @ 87.25 £510 ~£507

In view of this de facto reciprocity will BHCI pursue the possibility of e.g. settlement, investment or other long-term visas for India. Also
will BHC update on: a) Use of Tourist Visas -Indian nationals can purchase cars, property etc. in UK , but this is not being reciprocated by India. b) The use of Portuguese passports to gain entry into UK and hence UK state benefits. Goans pay a high price for this documentation and some openly claim it is forged.
In the past HCI/VFS have refused refunds when the visa issued is shorter than was requested – can anything be done to ensure this doesn’t happen when applying for the more expensive visas (>£500 for a 5-year T visa).
Re. X visas – see ‘Points for BHCI’ below. – Also with 5-year visas now apparently available will BHCI ask MHA to (once again) allow 5-year X visas for property owners who are not technically allowed a T visa?

Linkage of visas and FEMA
The recent FO advisory specifically warns against buying property on a Tourist visa. It might be good advice but it appears to endorse the statement ‘you can’t buy on a T visa’ (repeated in the latest RBI FAQ) – a position which BHCI should be opposing.

REGISTRARS
Will you please ask the CM to justify closure of the Registry to FN's when The Registration Act does not give the Registrar any such authority and indeed limits it to matters actually specified in the Act (from Jan ’10)

re: ’General Guidelines’ to Registrars, Collectors and the Home Dept. which clearly states not to register Foreigners property, or Foreign Directors of Indian Companies properties - have BHCI pursued this? (from Jan ’10) [and what was the authority of the author (Anupam Kishore) when oversight of Registrars is the responsibility of the Inspector-General of Registration? ]

BHC have advised that some registrations were going forward on business visas; did they take place - what criteria was applied to registration in those cases? If/when the Register is reopened can BHC obtain an unambiguous statement of registration criteria?

DofE
# At least three people/ groups from the UK have now been threatened with confiscation of their property despite having apparently complied with all legal requirements. What assistance have BHCI offered these people so far? ### Q (cont’d) In view of HMG’s assurance that such confiscations would be considered ‘unacceptable’ what positive steps do you propose to take? ### will BHCI obtain legal advice on DoE procedures e.g. 12 month rule; penalties; the qualifications required for membership of an Investigation tribunal and guidance on what to do at DoE investigations, and how these are/should be run? Including the question of denying attendance of a professional advisor at Hearings.Will BHC clarify that accompanied attendance will be allowed at Hearings, ensure that all attendees have access to information outlining procedures, and that reasonable notice will be given same, likewise for Compounding hearings?
# Can the BHCI report on even a single case of foreign property ownership which has been reviewed by Anupam Kishore (subsequent to interview and/or response to Show Cause Notice) whereby any property has been declared legitimately bought or endorsed as a legal purchase?

# June 2012
- "A FCO representative will always be present when the Government of Goa reviews cases. "
How many of these reviews took place and with what outcomes?

# Have any British or European owned properties actually been confiscated [... ? Nick & Mick... Swiss couple ?]

On 14th August 2012 you said We met with the new Chief Minister, Mr Manohar Parrikar, in June this year and raised, amongst others, the issue of property, which continues to understandably cause you a considerable amount of uncertainty and distress. The meeting was extremely encouraging. Mr Parrikar was fully aware of the issue, and during the course of the discussion, commented that he saw no reason why a large number of the cases should not be processed more expeditiously, recognising that the Enforcement Directorate and the Government of Goa had a duty to carry out their investigations within the timeline mandated by the rules and to keep those being investigated informed of progress made.
Mr Parrikar also offered to make a recommendation on cases where you have clearly bought small apartments as holiday or retirement homes, using funds acquired legally. This does not for now, include properties involving agricultural land or business.

Has anything actually happened as a result?

The DofE are now reported to be claiming that it is illegal to even sign an Agreement for Sale on a Tourist visa* - this is a further example of their unscrupulous behaviour (see 1st para).
* The Supreme Court recently clarified that no transfer takes place on an AforS – so FEMA is not involved at all.

Will BHCI seek legal opinion on the general point of confiscation of immovable property under FEMA - a careful reading of the Act suggests that confiscation only applies to Foreign Exchange offences. This view is endorsed by at least two local lawyers.

“We would like to reiterate that if you have not heard from the Enforcement Directorate (ED) by now, it is unlikely you are subject to investigation.”
- Is this still the case?

COMPANY PROBLEMS
# What is technically & legally wrong about these private limited companies..... and if there are technical infringements is this not a matter under Company law, not FEMA?
# Q) Why is it that those who have bought businesses and intended to run them have been denied all permissions to run the business despite attempting to fulfil all the rules with guidance from accountants and advocates.
A) If you have problems that prevent you doing business tell BHCI and / or contact the British Business Group in Goa.
Has there been any progress
DoE CAs in Mumbai and Goa have drawn RBI's attention to
a) FDI - innocent contraventions of FEMA Given that a large number of these relate to delayed reporting and are due to Authorised Dealers (Banks) not producing FIRC certificates and their non submission of documentation to RBI, will BHC seek assurances that no British National will be held responsible in these cases.

POINTS FOR CM
If the CM sees nothing wrong with FN’s owning a (small) property why is the Registry still closed, and why are the Govt pursuing appeals against people who took the Registrar to Court and won their case?

Is the CM aware that the closure of the Registry is unlawful?

POINTS FOR BHCI

Follow-up Questions

# BHCI were to have a meeting with RBI on 22/3/11 to raise a number of specific points (e.g. why did the Indian Government accept our Stamp duty) and to seek a clear statement of FEMA rules on a ‘Person Resident in India’ as applied to FN’s of non-Indian origin.
What was the result of the meeting?

# BHCI were also to have a meeting with MHA to clarify the rules on X visas for FN property owners and in particular a) documents to be provided (N.B. ‘RBI Permission’ is n/a and Registrar is closed); b) position of people with Leases, Agreements for Sale.
More recently you said On the issue of x-visas, we continue to lobby both the Foreign and Home Ministries, but to no avail. Most recently I sat down with the Additional Secretary for Consular Affairs at the MEA who understood the problem and invited me to flesh out the issue in a letter. We’re now chasing for a response.
What was the result?

# At the last meeting it was reported that BHCI have consulted lawyers on the actual meaning of FEMA and Goa's interpretation of it.
SPECIFICALLY what did the lawyers say, and has this been communicated to RBI/ DoE / Goa Govt?

# On 24th August 2012 you said If your purchase falls within the Chief Minister’s criteria, we encourage you to fill in the following proforma and email to Diana Joseph ([email protected]), thereby giving us permission to share the details of your case with the Chief Minister.
We have been asked for these proformas on at least three occasions – do BHCI have them available in a location accessible to its staff, and are new joiners informed of their existence?
Have any individual cases been taken up with the CM?


# Will the British High Commission India be more responsive in the media (by press release or interview), by letter and meeting with Goan authorities, in the efficient manner of the Russian Consul (from Jan ’10)....[note that the Russian Mission retains a lawyer]

Other

Goan Develoers/Sales Agents/Role of some Licenced Professional Advisors
Reported separately to BHC over the years – can Local and National Governments be made aware of these issues which have caused problems for many?

GENERAL
This Town Hall will very understandably have focus on the immediate issue of SCNs. Will the BHC agree to hold a further TH before the end of February re outstanding issues and update on progress?


Sorry for another long post but I have no other way to edit the final list at the moment. Will veritas / jcbrum / someone please see if this can be emailled to a warm blooded entity @ BHCI?
I'll bring some copies to the meeting AndyD
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Old Jan 26th 2013, 3:39 am
  #363  
 
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
Dread - fwiw my recollection is that BHCI said people who'd heard nothing for a year should contact them???

AndyD 8-)#
Maybe needs clarification as to exactly what the promise was because my understanding was that the BHC said that if you had heard nothing from the DoE for a year then consider the investigation halted

Dread - x
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Old Jan 26th 2013, 7:14 am
  #364  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

With apologies all round - I have decided it's time to SHOUT!

I propose the following Statement for adoption at the BHCI meeting on Monday:

WE HAVE ATTENDED NUMEROUS MEETINGS WITH BHCI
WE HAVE CONSULTED LAWYERS
WE HAVE GONE TO COURT
WE HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATED BY THE DoE AND HAVE RESPONDED TO THEM
WE HAVE PETITIONED HMG
WE JOINED IN THE GERMAN/EU PETITION TO GoI
BBG HAVE MET WITH THE CHIEF MINISTER

THERE HAS NOW BEEN SOME RELAXATION OF VISA RESTRICTIONS (WITH SWINGEING PRICE INCREASES FOR 'T' VISAS AND A LIST OF IMPOSSIBLE DEMANDS FOR 'X' VISAS) BUT ON FEMA RULES AND REGISTRATION WE HAVE HIT A BRICK WALL.

WE CAN DO NO MORE AS INDIVIDUALS – IT IS NOW UP TO HMG AS OUR ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES AND BHCI AS PUBLIC SERVANTS – PAID OUT OF OUR TAXES – TO TAKE A PRO-ACTIVE ROLE:
DEMAND A CLEAR STATEMENT FROM GoI ON THE FEMA DEFINITION OF 'PERSON RESIDENT IN INDIA'
DEMAND THE RE-OPENING OF REGISTRATION IN GOA AS PER THE LAW OF INDIA


AndyD
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Old Jan 26th 2013, 4:44 pm
  #365  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
With apologies all round - I have decided it's time to SHOUT!

I propose the following Statement for adoption at the BHCI meeting on Monday:

WE HAVE ATTENDED NUMEROUS MEETINGS WITH BHCI
WE HAVE CONSULTED LAWYERS
WE HAVE GONE TO COURT
WE HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATED BY THE DoE AND HAVE RESPONDED TO THEM
WE HAVE PETITIONED HMG
WE JOINED IN THE GERMAN/EU PETITION TO GoI
BBG HAVE MET WITH THE CHIEF MINISTER

THERE HAS NOW BEEN SOME RELAXATION OF VISA RESTRICTIONS (WITH SWINGEING PRICE INCREASES FOR 'T' VISAS AND A LIST OF IMPOSSIBLE DEMANDS FOR 'X' VISAS) BUT ON FEMA RULES AND REGISTRATION WE HAVE HIT A BRICK WALL.

WE CAN DO NO MORE AS INDIVIDUALS – IT IS NOW UP TO HMG AS OUR ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES AND BHCI AS PUBLIC SERVANTS – PAID OUT OF OUR TAXES – TO TAKE A PRO-ACTIVE ROLE:
DEMAND A CLEAR STATEMENT FROM GoI ON THE FEMA DEFINITION OF 'PERSON RESIDENT IN INDIA'
DEMAND THE RE-OPENING OF REGISTRATION IN GOA AS PER THE LAW OF INDIA


AndyD


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Old Jan 26th 2013, 5:31 pm
  #366  
 
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
With apologies all round - I have decided it's time to SHOUT!

I propose the following Statement for adoption at the BHCI meeting on Monday:

WE HAVE ATTENDED NUMEROUS MEETINGS WITH BHCI
WE HAVE CONSULTED LAWYERS
WE HAVE GONE TO COURT
WE HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATED BY THE DoE AND HAVE RESPONDED TO THEM
WE HAVE PETITIONED HMG
WE JOINED IN THE GERMAN/EU PETITION TO GoI
BBG HAVE MET WITH THE CHIEF MINISTER

THERE HAS NOW BEEN SOME RELAXATION OF VISA RESTRICTIONS (WITH SWINGEING PRICE INCREASES FOR 'T' VISAS AND A LIST OF IMPOSSIBLE DEMANDS FOR 'X' VISAS) BUT ON FEMA RULES AND REGISTRATION WE HAVE HIT A BRICK WALL.

WE CAN DO NO MORE AS INDIVIDUALS – IT IS NOW UP TO HMG AS OUR ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES AND BHCI AS PUBLIC SERVANTS – PAID OUT OF OUR TAXES – TO TAKE A PRO-ACTIVE ROLE:
DEMAND A CLEAR STATEMENT FROM GoI ON THE FEMA DEFINITION OF 'PERSON RESIDENT IN INDIA'
DEMAND THE RE-OPENING OF REGISTRATION IN GOA AS PER THE LAW OF INDIA


AndyD
COULD NOT AGREE MORE !!!!!

I do think the time has come to play hard ball !!

Dread - x
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 7:57 am
  #367  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Let's hope this does the trick well put.
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 8:00 am
  #368  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by dreadsoc
Maybe needs clarification as to exactly what the promise was because my understanding was that the BHC said that if you had heard nothing from the DoE for a year then consider the investigation halted

Dread - x
I wish this were the case...... Ms Shipla said that they cannot look into individual cases when I told her whats happening with me. Looks like we are on our own.
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 8:16 am
  #369  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by Jacksie
I wish this were the case...... Ms Shipla said that they cannot look into individual cases when I told her whats happening with me. Looks like we are on our own.

Time to take the gloves off - looking forward to the report of the meeting.
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 2:48 pm
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by noni
Time to take the gloves off - looking forward to the report of the meeting.
I'll file a fuller report tomorrow, but for those who can't wait - here is a summary:
nothing, zero, nil points, a dead parrot.

AndyD 8-)
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 4:09 pm
  #371  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
I'll file a fuller report tomorrow, but for those who can't wait - here is a summary:
nothing, zero, nil points, a dead parrot.

AndyD 8-)
As excepted then Andy!
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Old Jan 28th 2013, 6:53 pm
  #372  
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Thumbs down Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
here is a summary:
nothing, zero, nil points, a dead parrot.

AndyD 8-)
I'd like to be able to say I'm surprised but I'm not so I can't. . . . . . . . . .

H.
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Old Jan 29th 2013, 1:20 pm
  #373  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by a_f_d
I'll file a fuller report tomorrow, but for those who can't wait - here is a summary:
nothing, zero, nil points, a dead parrot.

AndyD 8-)
OMG What are our taxes paying for, all darn useless. Thank God I didn't waste time and money flying over early for the meeting. I have my court case coming up soon and expect no help whatsoever from our BHC. Ms Shipla basically said that they will not help individual cases..... meaning I am on my own!! Our BHC must be treating the time in Goa as a great holiday as they have done nothing for us over the last few years.
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Old Jan 30th 2013, 6:13 am
  #374  
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Any update on Mondays meeting. just wondering how BHC responded to the questions.

thanks r
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Old Jan 30th 2013, 8:34 am
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Default Re: BULLET POINT QUESTIONS FOR FCO- Comments/ and Correspondence from BHC

Originally Posted by ruskin
Any update on Mondays meeting. just wondering how BHC responded to the questions.

thanks r
Agree Ruskin, first time you and I have not been there. I did used to give a rambling report as soon as I returned to Apartment, and then let Andy give the "intelligent" one.
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