millsi

My husband has been asked to work in the South of France by his existing employer. With two young children this isn't an easy decision to make - don't scoff! We are fortunate we already live in a wonderful part of Southern England, we are both working, the children and us have a network of friends and my daughter only started school this September! We're very keen to make the right choice for the family based on good information rather than our (wonderful as they have been) experiences whilst visiting on holiday.

Can anyone help on a 'few' issues? There's only so much you can gain from books and websites, can you share some of your experiences with... With this knowledge info in hand we're hoping to make a more 'informed' decision of whether to take up this opportunity - and we are tempted.

Schools - In the UK we have league tables (however controversial), are there less official sources of information for deciding what is and isn't a good school in France? Does anyone have experience or going through 'choosing' a school for their children? Anyone in or around Nice?

Schools - In the UK we have the 'playground' culture, where parents can on occasions at least pass the time of day with 'Johnny's best mates, dad' etc. Is this also the norm (particularly for the younger children), so that I could attempt to be polite and get to know other mums?

Playgroups & childrens clubs - Is this as common in French communities as in the UK? Are there equivalents of the NCT or Parent network? Will my daughter be able to continue dancing, and son with gymtots etc?

Anyone with a young family that have made the move (whether successful or not) will have experiences that could help us choose? can you share?

need2no

Hi Millsi
Yes you have a lot of decisions to make but you don't say what age your children are.

Our daughter was 8 when we moved here, she is 12 now and absolutely loves France. She speaks fluent French and has fitted in with the culture here very well.

She now goes to College and it seems to be pretty much what an English secondary school is like, same sort of subjects, play times etc. although they usually take longer for lunch which is part of the culture here.

As for things outside of school/education, you will find that most bigger villages have a salle polyvalente (like a sports centre) where they can join clubs such as tennis, badminton, dancing etc. However, our daughter did miss going to brownies at first, but that soon passed.

Life seems quieter here than it was/is in England, and that takes some getting used to, maybe for you it will be harder than for your children.

I have found that other parents are very welcoming, you will find some that speak and like to speak English, although I suppose it depends on where you will be going.

I don't regret moving to France, but I do miss lots of things about England - including Sunday opening!

Feel free to PM if you would like more information on a more personal level, and welcome to this site.

val50

Hi there and welcome
It is never easy making the decision to move to another country, and even though you can do lots of research and try and cover every eventuality, nothing can really prepare you. The one thing we have found that has helped us with the many moves we've made, is that we all really wanted to make the move. The only time we made a move and the whole family weren't for it, it turned into a real disaster.
Our children were older than yours when we moved to France in 2001 but none of them regretted it, and realise it has given them so many opportunities. You don't have league tables in France, the only way to really discover the reputation of a school is to ask around.
In Nice you do have the option of international schools, but I think most of us who have moved to France with children will agree that if you are going to be here long term, then it is better to send the children to local schools.
Even though ours were older, I still found other mom's were keen to chat when I used to go collect them from school, so you will have no problems there. I think that is something that is the same all over the world.
You wont get the same sort of clubs here as you do get in UK, music is very popular as a extra curriculum activity, as is ballet, swimming etc.
Nice is a lovely place and I think you will also find there is a large British expat community there, which might help you settle in.
Not sure what part of Hampshire you live in, but Flybe do have a flight from Southampton (Eastleigh) to Nice, which is also handy if you do have bouts of homesickness. Always nice to know you have an escape route
I agree with Need2No that you will probably find the move more difficult than your children (and husband) will. Personally we have no regrets and I would hate to live anywhere else. I love the values many french families still have and find the children happier and relaxed compared to those we know in UK. I think at the end of the day, they are generally more confident too.
Good luck with your decision, and don't forget there are lots of people here who can help if you have more queries.
Val

elaines

Hi Millsi

We moved here 5 years ago with our three children, then aged 3, 6 and 8.

None of us spoke any French, but the children were all immediately enrolled into the local village school - the youngest had only ever been to playgroup in the UK for a few months so full-time education in a foreign country was a huge leap for him. Being the most reticent of the three, it took him the longest to adapt, but they all started to speak in French after about 6 months.

We were told that initially, they just absorb the language like a sponge, and eventually, it just pops out - which it did. Kids know how to join in much more than adults do; my 8 year took a pile of Pokeman cards in on his first day and he made friends on the playground straight away. The other thing they all did was to join local activity groups which take place on Wednesdays and Saturdays and this helped them enormously.

Where we are, (Fleury d'Aude on the Languedoc coast, near Narbonne), we are lucky enough to have a wide variety of activities for children. My children do judo, swimming, art class, theatre club, gym, dance and my eldest plays for the local football club - this, in particular, has been hugely instrumental in getting him accepted in the local community and he has a great number of friends outside of school, as a consequence.

One thing that we did notice when our children first started in French school was that the playground behaviour seemed more robust than we had been used to in the UK; not bullying as such, but a lot more rough and tumble whereby the kids were left to sort it out amongst themselves, without too much interference of supervising staff (although they did keep a watchful eye). In my opinion, this teaches them to be assertive and consequently, as Val has remarked, they grow up with a lot more well-placed confidence (some might call it 'arrogance'!!) than British kids seem to.

With regards to parents being involved in children's school life, yes, there are PTAs but, of course, you do need to understand the language if you're going to want to take part.

Our experience has been that we (so far) have had no need to "interfere" with the education our children have been receiving and we're quite happy to let the teachers do their job - they do follow a very strict curriculum and their standards are high. There are always those teachers less favoured by the children but that's the same everywhere, in fact, my eldest's history teacher last year was an absolute joke (and a major bully), and the college got rid of him pretty quickly, so those in charge are on top of it all, it seems.

All children are taught to be polite and respectful and as a result, their general behaviour is wonderful - for example, my son and his friend have just come in from football and have come to find me at the other end of the house so that his friend can greet me properly with the French 'bisou". This is the norm, and even if I see them in the street, they cross over to me to say 'bonjour'.

You definitely don't find that behaviour in the UK!

I wouldn't worry about the life your children are going to experience should you decide to make the move - they are young enough to adapt quickly. I do believe that it will be harder for you and your husband, especially if you don't speak the language (however, now my children are all fluent, I take them with me whenever I need help with anything "official" like the tax office - knowing that I can ask them to translate for me if I run into difficulties!). The only way to feel part of any community is to totally immerse youself in it, however difficult and strange it may seem at first. Having children does help immensely!

My advice would be not to base your decision on what you, as a family, might be missing out on in leaving the UK, but rather on what you would be gaining on being here.

Family ties are probably the most difficult ones to let go of, but don't forget, there are numerous airports in the South of France (Languedoc in particular) and frequent, cheap flights to the UK. You may, like us, find that you end up seeing more of some family members than you did when you were in the UK!

Providing you have an income, (and of course, you obviously do with your husband's new job offer), there should be no reason why you cannot live as happily (or more so) here than you currently do in England.

My one other piece of advice, it it's worth anything, is to try to keep a foothold on a small property in the UK, because is all goes belly-up over here, you will at least have a home to go back to. Property over here does not increase in value by any stretch of the imagination in the same way as it does in England so you cannot rely on it being an investment.

That all having been said, I hope you make the right choice for you all as a family, whatever that may be, and to be practical and realistic in your decision.

Lots of luck

Elaines

millsi

Thank you all for your support. And I have to admit I think any concerns we may have revolve around 'our' ability to adapt to such a change of life / culture at the ripe old age of 31! My children are 2 and 4, and I gather from what I've read in this forum and from your replies, these are good years for such a transition. As for the language side of things hubby and I have discussed the need for tuition or one of these 'immersion' courses - my husbands french is basic mine is a little better (I studied to A Level - although failed the actual exam we've always managed to get by including trips to doctors, hospitals and the Gendarme Nationale whilst on visits!).

I'm glad to hear such positive praise of the education system and your children's experiences - it certainly puts my mind at rest on that front. At the moment we are in negotiations with his firm over the details of such a move, which will be a big part of the decision. We will then be in a better position to work out if and how we achieve it. I'll keep in touch, I'm sure I'll have more questions yet....!

millsi

Well I thought I'd update you on our progress... we are feeling a lot more positive about this potential move to the South of France. We're now in negotiations over a relocation package that will mean we can live as comfortable a life in La France as we do here in England at present. I've got all the bugs out of my system about being a kept woman - at present I earn a good salary myself - but am now looking forward to the possibility of spending more time with the kids helping them with settling in, meeting friends, learning the lingo.

In fact I suppose that leads me to my next round of questions. My children are quite young - 4yrs and 2yrs - did anyone find their kids English skills suffer? My youngest is only just learning to talk in any language!!!

Also on a slightly different thread... husbands office is actually going to be west of Nice (and west of the airport), so would be looking for 'nice' communities / towns with good schools somewhere between Antibes and Vence. Has anyone experience of this area and between? Has anyone got experience of schools in this region? (i realise it could be a long shot!)

treskillard

Yes, their skills in the short term may appear to suffer in comparison with children monolingual in the UK - but this is normal and short lived - in the longer term they will do nothing but benefit from this - linguistically at least.

There is so much pressure for children to achieve and keep up at such a young age. It is a pity.

onlyonebrenda

My children fled the nest a long time ago. I can only say I lived in Britain in Bristol, a lovely part of England, and I feel my quality of life has increased tenfold since being here. I can't believe how much I would have missed out on if I'd listened to my fears. Bon chance.

frenchie0005

I think with respect as an elder citizen you are in a better position as generally you have a pension for an income at least and perhaps maybe some savings to assist. The quality of life here at your age therefore has many benefits as e.g at least you know you will recieve a better standard of health care if you get ill and your unlikely to face muggers in the street. You have the sunshine, a better sense of security and more peace of mind.

Its the younger of us that find difficulties gaining employment or realising that the idea of starting a business is quite risky.When you have reserves thats fine but when they run out its a big problem.

Many ex pats have realised that 2-3 years down the line, they get stuck and the economy is so, that passing trade will not be enough of an income to sustain a retail business unless you live in a city. Tradesman have to re train and be fluent to generate custom.

Socially theres very little support apart from forums like this and ex pat associations that with respect again, are mainly full of retirees.

Teenage children will not necessarilly find jobs or gain friends and the smaller children in families will probably do best learning french at the right age, and mix fine in school, adapting far more easilly than any of the rest of us...

just thinking out loud here BTW

millsi

Thank you for joining the discussion and adding your thoughts.

onlyonebrenda

Thank you Frenchie. Gosh I don't think of myself as old but all the points you make are relevant. A good level of French is so critical to success and then you find there are systems in place to help and support. It would be wrong of me to say that I haven't heard of people in the dire circumstances you describe although I've never met any nor so far as I know has anyone lese locally. I do look at a couple of people I know and think that a couple of them might not make it because they do not have key factors in place. I also know couples here with children who are making a success. Only you can add up the risk factors and what your personal sustainable level of risk is. As I said Bon Chance.

millsi

UPDATE:

Decided - and if I say it often enough I might actually believe it and it may sink in! We're going / coming depending on your point of view!

Although there is MUCH to sort out we are going to take up our opportunity and re-locate to the Alpes-Maritime (06). We're going to enjoy the Christmas holidays but in the new year will knuckle down to some sorting, seeking and fixing. I've already made an appointment with a local letting agent to discuss the market and what we are (likely) going to be able to achieve in rental on our property here and of course request info on their fees etc (probably frightening). In January my mum (who's coming too) has asked (oh yes she is that keen) to look after the children for a few days so that hubby and I can fly to Nice to seek out and explore the local area. Our priority is to find out if we can actually afford the type/size of property we need to accommodate us (the biggest hurdle). We will be looking for a final move to France around May or June.

So firstly thank you to everyone on this forum - your information and experiences have been invaluable in realising that this will be possible. Secondly (and I've probably asked this before) is anyone in or has been looking at the same area that we are looking at Alpes-Maritimes, specifically west of Nice and north of Antibes?

val50

That's great news and I'm sure you and your OH will feel much better after you spend some time in Nice and have chance to look around. We took a client of my OH's out to supper during the week, he's from Nice. I will see if I can contact him and get more info for you. He has a hard life - lives in Nice and works in Monacco

jdr

It`s lovely there, spent a few holidays in St Tropez 30 years ago and toured around there, I bet it has changed a lot though since then.

themoose

Menton is very nice worth a look if you are out that way.