SesameBun

I've been living in the south of France for a while now and I've noticed that this particular area is... well... quite racist! Here are some examples of what I mean.

I met a French lady one day and she seemed nice and was willing to help me out (my husband and I had more or less just moved here). The first day I spent with her we came across some Chinese people speaking Cantonese. She immediately pulled a disgusted face and wobbled her head from side to side going, 'Nyeh, nyeh, nyeh, nyeh!' which, I suppose, was her idea of an imitation of the Cantonese language. She looked at me and asked, 'You speak Chinese?' with a tone of voice and a look on her face as if to say, 'No one should speak such a ridiculous language.' I said, 'I am half Chinese.' No apology, just, 'Oh.' as if disappointed to find out I was not 100% English as she thought I was. She even showed disappointment in my hair being brown instead of blonde...

I brushed it off and tried to forget about it since she was kind enough to be helping me when no one else would, but more offensive comments started popping up and every time a non-white person walked by speaking a non-European language she would be doing her loud, rude imitations. I felt embarrassed and ashamed to be with her.

I was grateful that not many people here were that way, until I went to various places with her and found the entire shop or cafe of random French people would join in with her racist comments, talking about black people looking like monkeys and joking about how ugly and stupid Middle Eastern people are and how the lot of them need to go back to their countries. Needless to say, I do not spend time with her any more.

I told myself it was only her and the type of people she spends time with, but both our northern French and non-French friends agree that this area is incredibly racist.

Most of the things I have heard are racist towards North Africans and Middle Eastern people. However, I wonder if there is also some racism towards East Asians and that this, along with other factors (e.g. recession), has been working against me in regards to finding work? When I apply to British companies I am more likely to get at least a reply, whereas French companies either completely ignore me or immediately reject me without giving me an interview (e.g. even for only a simple receptionist job). I wrote to them all in French, even when I first arrived and hardly knew enough.

Can anyone answer my question or share personal experiences so I have an idea of where I stand and what I should do?

dmu

[QUOTE=SesameBun;8

However, I wonder if there is also some racism towards East Asians and that this, along with other factors (e.g. recession), has been working against me in regards to finding work? When I apply to British companies I am more likely to get at least a reply, whereas French companies either completely ignore me or immediately reject me without giving me an interview (e.g. even for only a simple receptionist job). I wrote to them all in French, even when I first arrived and hardly knew enough.
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Hi,
Whereabouts in the south of France? I've never noticed any racism in my part of the Hérault, but then it's a rural area.
As regards work, don't be surprized that you don't even get an acknowledgement of your applications. Very impolite, I agree, but that's France. If a French company considers your profile is interesting enough, then they'll call you for an interview - it's a question of "don't ring us, we'll ring you". Unfortunately for you, they tend to give any jobs going to French nationals who speak English, rather than to an English-mother-tongue who speaks French. But, despite the high unemployment figures in France and the Recession, don't give up, register at your nearest Pôle-Emploi and they may come up with something.

G-J-B

Sounds like you've strolled across an unfortunate bubble. Racism can exist anywhere. I've found the attitudes of the French more liberal than those of the English. Even a few of my relatives and friends have preconceived xenophobic ideas about the French, and I haven't come across any French person yet who has shown xenophobic proclivities (my parent in-laws are an exception - they like the English in England, but not when they're in France! As the mother-in-law has stated several times - "The English are filthy" )

There are dark periods in Frances history that should probably be kept in the past (e.g. treatment of Algerians - in 1961, up to 200 Algerians were murdered by police in Paris; many thrown into the Seine). I suppose by comparison a little xenophobia doesn't seem nearly as bad (that's not to say it should be condoned!)

It only takes a few bad eggs to change the dynamics of a place. You'd probably find in a neighbouring town or village, the attitudes appear quite different.

Sorry to hear you're finding it difficult to get an interview. As dmu says, the French companies will not keep you informed about your application. Keep persisting - I'm sure you'll get there!

cjm

Sad thing is racism is all around us, be it city or country town. Skin colour can be the trigger. North Africa, Algeria - these can be targets. Blanche signs can be found, even in my part.

I am sorry, it will not change today, tomorrow or in the future that I can see.

There are some contradictions. Some mixed race I see in the bars appear, note the word, are treated as the white population.

Being white and English can cause resentment and reaction. But, is this not the same for all nationalities everywhere, in England especially?

In England and here, 'incomers', be they Asian, East European can be and often are the target for the ills of the country. They take the jobs - jobs perhaps locals don't want. Easy, but condemning words. Racism will always find a reason why it is 'right'.

As a first post, it is a cracker. Respect.

I look forward to reading other threads contributed.

le plumber

The majority of the time its poking fun expecting a reaction but at heart I don't think the French are racist. What you call 'racism' in France is all over the place, although nowadays I only encounter racism against the arabs. The phrase "travail d'arab" can be heard frequently meaning work badly done. However one of my lot is an algerian, and he's probably the best of the lot and in whom I have the most confidence. He just takes it all in his stride, (racism that is). If ever there is a theft on a work site then all the others point at us saying it must be you lot because you have the arab. It meant to be a joke and as long as Momo takes it as that then I don't step in. Actually he gives as good as he gets.....!!!

Nibbler

this is not england and i would agree with GJB the french are more tolerant in excepting foreigners than us in some ways...
i know personally
Tunisans,Algerians,Morocans,Armienian,Russians,Rom anians,Guedeloupens,Comons,Turkish,Corsicans,Senag alese,Congonese,Italians,Bulgariens...
they are not perfect,all have there own hang ups...
by picking out there separate faults i suppose i am a rascist..
they probably say loads of stuff about me....
had some great nights out and meals with there families

being even more direct? when i tried to learn french here...i found the Chinese students not particulary sympathetic..in fact really rude..!!!!

le plumber

The Chinese I'm not sure, but when I learnt French in Besançon there were many Japanese. WHAT a barrel of laughs they were, and one or two have stayed good friends since. At the time I couldn't pronouce their names so I nicknamed them Suzuki and Kawasaki - it was very well taken and even today via emails & facebook I call them that - although I suppose that in the world we live in today that woud be called racism.................

SesameBun

Thank you for all the replies.

dmu - I'm in the Cote d'Azur. I have been advised to register with the Pole Emploi by a few people, but I already went to around 10 similar agencies and either they did not offer work I could do (e.g. construction), they were very rude and condescending, or they accepted my CV and acted as if they were going to help me and then I never heard from them and they ignored all further efforts on my part to contact them.

I agree with several of you on the point that racism exists everywhere. In fact, I have experienced the worst in the UK. I have been beaten, threatened with gang rape and have had bricks thrown at me more than once. I was not in a particularly bad area, either. Sure, I have not had that trouble here, but if negative stereotypes exist, are prevalent and I am actively being discriminated against with employment, it does make it a problem for me.

le plumber - I did not say the French are racist. I am saying that it seems many in my area (which certainly cannot be extrapolated to the whole of France) are racist. If I thought everyone was that way, why would I have French friends? French friends who agree with me about this area, nonetheless.

I see what you mean with the jokes regarding your friend and I would not see that as racist, but none of these comments I heard were made in jest. People became rather fired up and aggressive when discussing how much they hated X race. When a dark-skinned person would walk in, everyone would fall silent and glare at them, openly mocking their accent if they had one. Joking about someone stealing something because of a common stereotype, giving someone a silly nickname and laughing about it is very different from mocking and insulting others with hatred and disgust for them due to their race.

I hope you do not mean to say that describing black people as monkeys and Arabs as stupid and ugly is simply 'picking out their faults'.

G-J-B

I frequently hear disparaging remarks made against the Dutch, Swiss and Belgians in France (and of course the collective 'Parisians' who are a race unto themselves!) - these are more cultural differences and stereotypes, and quite different from racism. It's a little like the banter between English, Scots and Welsh. I have found Paris to be very multicultural and know people from all across the globe, and I'm sure racism exists, but I've not had the misfortune to come across it.

I have found the French to be more frank than the English. They usually just come out and say what's on their mind, and lack a little of the tact. I do not know if that is a good or bad thing, but I guess at least people normally know where they stand.

If I lived in an area where people were openly racist, I don't think I could stand to remain there. When you have groups of people living in close proximity the pact animal instinct usually kicks in, and to 'fit in' they will often mirror each other, whether they believe something or not. My grandfather (who I don't keep in contact with) is a prime example. He blames foreigners, all the time, for everything. Even since I was a child he came out with some really racist remarks, and several years ago an Indian neighbour moved nextdoor to him. His neighbour is now 'the salt of the earth', and he hasn't a bad word to say about him. Usually racism is a perceived fear against an imaginery 'foe'.

beigey

I have not encountered any more racism towards me here than I have in the UK ... I am near Avignon BUT I have noticed that people here really don't hold back in describing their disdain towards a particular ethnic group namely, North Africans which is also incredibly popular as a topic with Sarko's Burqa policy. Being PC is non-existent here.

DH was born and bred in the village we now live in - he is French but by blood his mother is Canadian - so he is now referred to as Le Canadien - I will always be La Anglaise. My mother is Egyptian and I am "beige" hence my username, given to me in the UK when I was 17 filling in equal opportunity forms when my peers said I could not tick white british and instead should tick "Other" which enraged me. My name is a traditional arabic name and people here have no issue asking me my religious beliefs etc ... once they have decided that I am "ok" I become 100% English.

I think the French mocking the Belgians is exactly like the English/Irish jokes ... every country has it!

To wrap up - I have French friends from the north who do say the southerners are considerably more racist than the north so you are not imagining it!

Nibbler

No...???? i think i am in the room next door,the one with a window...
personally i have never taken taken comments about myself from anyone to heart even particularly bad ones..i work very hard and recieve numourus insults each day as i am chief equipe in charge of 4 french people...they hate me and plus i am english..but i get the job done and i am excepted for this...
your thoughts on this subject are more strong than mine..and may i say extreme..
so best of luck..
going out for a drink tonight with 3 Algerians so i better watch what i say...

Roger O

I lived and worked in Antibes (Sophia Antipolis) 1994-2003 for a large international IT (travel agency and airline systems) company which at that time employed 39 nationalities from all over the world (today, many more!) - but all at very least MBA or BAC+5, mostly higher-qualified than that. I never saw any racism amongst them.

However, in daily life - as in Carrefour when "the Vallauris lot" (mostly Algerians) arrived, it was a different story one heard around.

On the other hand, there were some Algerians (women!) working in that company holding down very well paid jobs - though there were plenty of young ones (male) up and down the route de Grasse every summer snatching stuff out of tourist (non 06) cars.
One didn't venture into certain quarters of Vallauris, nor of Nice, with impunity.

Sure they had a very rough treatment (especially the Harkis who fought with the French - vis. remarks from Georges Frêche about 'sous-hommes'
http://www.midilibre.com/articles/20...cassation.php5
which got him banned from the Partie Socialiste in France, though it didn't seem to make much difference to his popularity in the Languedoc-Roussillon region) as did many "locals" who fought for the British back in the 19th century - and even today (Gurkas). However, it is true that in general one finds the Tunisians and Moroccans much easier to get on with and many of them tend to shun the Algerians.

Personally, I consider myself as a "Member of the Human Race" and will get on well with any other person (of any race or creed) worthy of that appellation - unless and until they prove differently - e.g. spouse beaters, child molesters, animal torturers, modern slave traders, arrogant despots, etc.

Here, in Carcassonne, I must say that racism has never been apparent to me (in the two years we have lived here so far) but on the other hand we all noticed racism apparent in the Pyrenées Orientales where we lived near Perpignan for 4 years. There, it expresses itself more as a general antipathy towards non-Catalans, though, as everywhere, there are many exceptions which prove the rule!

DandNHill

Surely a lot of this comes down to people being uncomfortable with what they are not familiar with...

I am one of the orginal expats in France from the 70's.
I grew up in France and unless people knew my name they didn't know I wasn't French. So much so that when a group of people I was once with made a nasty comment on "foreigners". I immediately reminded them that I was English and their answer was "it's not the same, you're different" suggesting that I was one of them...

What about the Alsacians who switch to German the moment a French speaking person walks into a bar / restaurant?

My french ex husbands grandmother didn't like me because I was english - she didn't mind the Germans!!

My brother lives in the Dordogne and has his own restaurant but most of his customers are english - why? because a lot of the english don't mix and don't want to mix with the french!!!!

As for the Arabs, they don't bother me either way but even 25 years ago, people would joke about foreigners coming to France "taking our Arabs jobs!!!"

Surely it should simply be a matter of live and let live but when the economy is bad like now all these comments come out... (In England it is now the Poles who get picked on...)...

SesameBun

Thank you again, everyone.

I haven't come across this in the south, but friendly banter is not an issue for me. My Dutch family joke all the time about the British and occasionally the Chinese and it is not done in a malicious way as the people I've encountered in the south of France have done. I do know the difference between a harmless joke and something that was clearly intended as an insult.

I've found multicultural places to be far less racist, though where I have been there does tend to be segregation between those of different cultures.

This is one of the reasons I left the area where I was living in the UK. However, it seems to be safer now.

Yes, this is exactly the same thing I have been told by all my French friends from the north. Thank you for confirming things.

You are confused? Allow me to explain... I indicated that in my first post, here:

A post to which you replied with...

As if to point out I am overreacting because these people were only picking out their 'separate faults' and are far from being racist.

Therefore, either you agree that saying X race looks like Y animal and is stupid and ugly is acceptable, OR you read only the first few sentences of my post/skimmed the whole thing, jumped to conclusions and posted a sarcastic and provocative message insinuating I will call you a racist for pointing out flaws in people. I'm guessing the latter.

As for acting condescendingly towards me simply because you have a different opinion... perhaps you are far more sensitive than you claim to be because I never said anything to provoke some of your sarcastic and patronising comments.

I guess none of those insults have ever come with active discrimination or physical violence against you and others who look like you, which is why it is so easy to brush it aside. For example, if the majority of people in the country you were in seriously believed all of those insults and agreed it justified not giving you accommodation, employment, entry to their stores; made it acceptable to harass you verbally and physically; and gave them the right to damage or steal your property, I think you would feel differently when people showed clear signs of sharing that belief.

If you still disagree after reading (if you did not read) there is nothing more for us to discuss and I have done nothing to invite your attitude towards me, so please leave me be.

I agree. It is unfortunate that some people do not feel that way and I doubt the world will ever be 100% free from things like racism.

I suppose people do not understand that which is different and begin to fear that which they do not understand. Fear easily turns to hatred.

That makes sense to me.

Ray51

Beware , very many Brits , Dutch and Skandies are ready to go & fight go the end of the Earth ( or the known Universe , or is it just to Land's End ? ) with their Political Correctness -
often invoked entirely unjustifiably ;
this footnote , from one who has witnessed any number of such unrequited incidents , and worse , over the years...