Rachgb

Hi,
I am a UK citizen and I am moving to France soon to live with my French partner and I am in process of applying for a visa. I am a qualified primary teacher but unfortunately have not been able to secure a job so I cannot apply for a working visa. I therefore have to get a long stay tourist one but I am unsure which length to apply for.

My boyfriend and I will apply for Pacs status once I am in France which should allow me to apply for a family visa after a year of living together, however not sure what is best to do in the meantime. After many hours spent trawling the visa website I am still unsure exactly what the rules are about changing visas mid term. So basically I know I cannot work on a long stay visa but presumably can still look for work (as long as I don't tell them that in my visa interview) If I find a job can I return to UK and apply for a working visa whilst my tourist visa is still valid? E. G say 6 months into a 1 year visa?? Or do I have to wait until it expires. A year without working is a lot (and I know I have to get private medical insurance and show proof I can support myself) and although I have savings if I can find a job this would be preferable.

So really what I want to know is should I apply for 6 month, 9 month or year tourist visa? (I know I can come for 3 months without a visa but that is too short and I cannot return again for 90 days). If changing visa status is possible mid term then a year visa is my best option I think.
Sorry if what I'm asking is confusing, the whole system is very baffling. (I wish I'd met him before Brexit, everything was so much easier then 😢)
Thank you for any advice.
Rachel

EuroTrash

Have you considered studying in France?
That is probably what I would look at if I were in your situation, for the following reasons:
- A student visa allows you to work a limited number of hours
- If I had to spend a year doing nothing, and I didn't have much money to do it on, I would soon be climbing the walls and become un-liveable with which would not be good for romance;
- I would choose a course that would improve my future employment prospects in France;
- I believe a student visa also gives other advantages and entitlements that you don't get with visitor visas.
It just seems a waste to put your life on hold for a year, when you could put that year to very good use.

Also, don't make the mistake of thinking that the people who interview you are naive. If they see a young person who doesn't have a lot of money put by but wants to give up their job in the UK and spend a year visiting France, they are going to wonder what this person will really be doing and why they don't apparently want to work. In fact they will have a shrewd idea of the answer and if they think you are telling them the thing that is not, it won't help your application.

Rachgb

Thanks for your reply. However, a few things I'd like to clarify.
I absolutely want to work in France, unfortunately I am not an entrepreneur, or work in a career that is seen as a talent according to French visa rules. I am also too old to apply to be an au pair or a working holiday visa and I already studied for 4 years to be a teacher so don't particularly want to be a student again at 38. I have 13 years teaching experience and would love to teach in France but I am also happy to change career if that is an option. I have looked for teaching jobs but there are only so many international schools, two of which I have already applied to but been unsuccessful. I am not married to a French citizen so cannot apply for a spousal visa. I have searched for many jobs but most of them state a working visa as a requirement which unfortunately I cannot apply for without a job offer. I have spent a very long time on many, many different sites trying to find an answer to how I move to France, become a resident and work, and live with my French partner whom I have not been able to see many times in the last 2 years due to Covid restrictions. I have read all of the visa FAQs about interviews and what they will ask so actually i am not a niave young person. I just want to move to France and work but there seems to be no easy way to do this anymore. Thank you anyway.

EuroTrash

I'm sorry if you felt I was suggesting that you were naive or missing something, I was not at all. I suggested this route because out of all the routes available, of which as you say many are closed to you, this seemed potentially the most hopeful.
As you say, short of getting married to a French national there is no simple one-step route for a Brit to move to France and work, now that we no longer have freedom of movement. Although of course, not nearly as hard as it is for foreigners to come to the UK.
So I was suggesting that this would be a "workaround" or stepping stone if you like, that would be a way to spend a full year in France, work part time if you want, and potentially learn a new skill and get a French qualification under your belt - you mentioned changing career, which especially in France often means getting new qualifications because they do like a vocational qualification or two - and then pitch at the spouse visa.
I appreciate that you may not particularly want to be a student again at 38, but it could be a means to an end. After all what are you going to do in France for a whole year if you can't work and don't have much money? do you particularly want to spend a year doing nothing? Plus more importantly, I think you would have a better chance of success with the student visa. Reputedly it's quite difficult for people of working age to get a long stay visitor visa because the suspicion is that even if they're not setting out with the intention of working on the black, they're liable to be tempted to do so while they're in France. It's a lot easier to get a long stay visa if you're retired, or officially on sabbatical or something like that. As a working age person you would need to come up with a convincing plan for the purpose of your visit and how you will keep yourself occupied for the year, and have the funds to match those plans. Whereas going to France to study is something that a lot of people do, and France encourages it; So the student visa a route that's quite often used by third country nationals, not only youngsters, who want to establish themselves in France and don't have any other route open to them.
But if you don't like it, fair enough, and good luck with the job hunting/visa application.

Rachgb

Sorry I read your first message after a long day at work where I told my class I was leaving and I was a bit emotional. I really appreciate your advice and also your honesty. I hadn't thought about studying as my French is only level 2 (I studied to gcse level a long time ago and have been attending evening classes this year) but if there are courses available to English speakers this would definitely be something I would be interested in.
Maybe I could change my plans slightly and go over on the 3 month tourist visa, research local courses and return to apply for a student visa to allow me to move in September?
I have tried to look for work but it's hard to see why a French company would employ a Brit now with all the paperwork when it's much easier to employ an English speaking EU citizen. I distinctly remember crying on the day the referendum result was announced even without knowing I would meet a French partner in the future and how it would affect me. But no point thinking about that now because sadly Brexit is done and I have to get on with it.
Thank you again for your advice, I will speak to my partner and start looking into the student visa option.

Helen1964

Can’t you just get married?
I did that years ago so I could stay with my then boyfriend. It worked out fine.

EuroTrash

I think we were simpler folk in those days Helen.
It is astonishing what complicated webs the younger generations will weave for themselves to avoid old fashioned marriage.
But it does seem blindingly obvious sometimes that it would be the best solution.

Helen1964

Yes, I think we were much more impulsive. I was totally guided by my hormones in my 20s and 30s. It certainly made life simple.

EuroTrash

If your French could use an upgrade, perhaps taking a one year advanced French course might be a route to a visa and also a good investment for the future? Once you have your spouse visa, speaking good French will likely be a great help in your working life.
Don't be too annoyed with the employers who don't feel able to offer you jobs - bear in mind that it's designed not to be a level playing field. French employers have to apply to the French labour inspectorate for permission to offer a job a foreigner, and as part of the application they need to actually prove that they have tried and failed to recruit a suitable EU candidate. So it's not only that it's more paperwork, it's that they will not actually be allowed to employ you if there are French/EU candidates available who could do the job.
So you do need a game plan but it is do-able. Bon courage, and do come back to the forum and let us know how it's going, or if you feel the need for any well meant advice and moral support. I'm sure we all understand your frustration. I certainly do. I didn't cry when I woke up and heared the referendum result, but I remember feeling quite numb with shock and apprehension.

Lou71

People have all sorts of reasons for not wanting to get married. Fortunately there is another option - a civil partnership. You benefit from the same rights as a married couple and civil partnerships are legally recognised in France, Spain, Portugal and most other EU states.

EuroTrash

Absolutely, and I do respect that even though I don't always understand it.
But you don't always benefit from exactly the same rights, do you. For instance, to get a visa for France you have to have been in a civil partnership for at least a full year. Whereas if you get married, you're entitled to a spouse visa immediately.

Helen1964

The great thing about marriage is that it’s hard to wriggle out of it so by the time you’ve worked up the energy to decouple you’re best of friends again.

Tweedpipe

That's very true. Pension rights for example. Some time back I mentioned that my m-i-l was PACSed and the partner was in recent of an extremely generous monthly military pension. They were both getting on in years and he had often encouraged her to marry him. She refused. When he died my wife learned from the notaire that his military pension ceased and would not carry forward as part of the estate. Fortunately he otherwise left a very generous sum, which a few years later paid for the m-i-l's 6year care in an EHPAD (at 1.8k euros/month), which financially for us was a life-saver.