bobhopkin

Hello Everyone,
My name is Bob and I moved to Boquete, Panama with my wife in early 2020. We are both Brits but left the UK in 1979 for my work and spent 3 years living ( 5 years working) in France then 38 years in South Africa, again for work reasons. We could see the future in the latter there was bleak (very sadly after some wonderful times) and started looking for a final retirement destination a few years ago. After (mistakenly) using the statistics, advice and opinions of the 'International Living' organisation (Do contact me if you want the reasons why I said 'Mistakenly') we looked at Thailand, Malaysia, Mexico, Costa Rica and Panama before deciding on the latter to become our Last Outpost. After 3 years we have decided it is not for us (those interested in the reasons again please contact me) and we are now, reluctantly looking to move again and our favoured candidate country is France. We made a visit there in September and found it was still to our liking and the current plan is to sell out house here a look to buy in either the Herault, Pyrenees Orientales or Aude departments. Any advice, suggestions from ex pats in those areas regarding climate, housing, culture or any relevant topics would be most welcome.

SanDiegogirl

Post in the French section to get answers regarding France.
One of the first questions forum members are likely to ask is what visa you will be applying for to live in France?

SanDiegogirl

Post in the French section to get answers regarding France.
One of the first questions forum members are likely to ask is what visa you will be applying for to live in France?

bobhopkin

Initially 1 year,then 5 year then 10 as usual. Unlikely to need the 10 as I will be pushing up daisies by then! (Unique British black humour meaning I will likely be dead by then)

dmu

Hi, and welcome to the forum!
Some one more in the know will advise, but as far as I know, as Brits, you have to be in the UK when applying for a Visa for the EU. If you haven't worked in the UK since 1979, you must research the S1 form which British retirees have to produce to get healthcare coverage in France.
I live in rural Hérault and can confirm that "sunny and mild Winter weather in the South" is a myth. We had a dusting of snow last week after gloomy, wet weather. For the last few Summers, it has been blisteringly hot and dry. The climate change is certainly felt here!
How is your French? Retirees tend to consult more often and it's advisable to be able to communicate with doctors, etc.... Also for the nitty-gritty of daily living (bureaucracy, utilities set-up, artisans, etc...). If you choose l'Hérault, be close to Montpellier or Béziers - otherwise it's a medical desert. Likewise the P.O. and Aude, be near Perpignan or Carcassonne/Narbonne.
Hope this helps, and good luck with your decision!

EuroTrash

I think what the earlier question was getting at was, what will your visa status be, working or not working? But from your comments we can probably assume, not working, can we?
That being the case, I may be wrong but I think you start off with a one year visa and renew your CdS year by year. After four renewals you have the option of asking for a 10 year card but this isn't automatic, there are additional conditions, language and integration etc, and it's at the discretion of the prefecture. But those are all technicalities, you'll find out easily enough.

I guess that like any other country in the world, France is what it is and either it suits you or it doesn't. IMHO it's a subjective thing, depends what your personal priorities in life are, so without knowing what you're looking for, what's most important to you and what you didn't like about other places, it's not really pôssible to advise. Just a warning that visiting France as a tourist can be very different from living here, but again I guess that's true of any country. But by all means come back with any specific questions you may have.

Helen1964

Hi Bob

I think one of the big changes you’ll notice if you come to live in France now is the extent to which day-to-day life has been digitalised.

The days when you could wander into an office and make yourself understood with bad French and gestures are long gone. These days – whether it’s to renew your driving licence, complete your tax return, buy a resident’s parking permit, etc. etc. – you will need an excellent understanding of written French and a degree of tech-savviness that does not always come easily to older people.

To give you an example, I received an email from my landline provider Orange a couple of weeks ago. They were basically going to upgrade our contract to something more expensive unless we specifically opted out. So – to start with – it was important to be able to understand the email (my husband couldn’t). Opting out should then have been a simple matter of clicking on a link but in fact that was just the start. I spent the next 30 minutes or so running around looking for log-in details and basically jumping through bureaucratic hoops. Got there in the end but it was not an easy process.

Most important, in case you are indeed pushing up the daisies in a few years, your partner will also need to have an excellent understanding of written French and good IT literacy. Please do not underestimate the importance of this, unless you’re going to have some nice, French-speaking kids living up the road and willing to bail you out.

The second point I would make is that moving here late in life, you may suffer from social isolation. Unless you are both already very comfortable speaking French, you probably won’t ever reach a level now where you can really relax and enjoy socialising in French and have proper, in-depth conversations and – this is important – a LAUGH. I was back in Northern Ireland recently and I had more great conversations with total strangers in one day than I’d had in the last year in France. And proper conversations, too, not just the tedious, superficial exchanges I have in France about the weather. This is not a criticism of the French. I’m just saying that if your language is basic, your interaction with people will also be basic and the conversations not terribly interesting.

If you really are dead set on France, how about a location you’ve probably never considered, Strasbourg. It may be cold here in winter but there is at least a sizeable English-speaking community so loneliness is less likely to be a problem. Access to healthcare is also excellent, which is by no means the case everywhere in France.

Even better, live somewhere nice in the UK and come here for long holidays.

Listen Very Carefully

To get a Visa you will need an income of at least the French minimum wage or close to.There is a bit of flexibility plus you will need private health coverage until you are eligible to join the French health system

Moses2013

I'd agree with what others have already said and when it comes to climate, the areas you have mentioned will all have very different climates. Even when it comes to culture, no place is identical and just because it's France won't mean two people living in that country experience the same things. We are not permanent residents and only have a 2nd home across the border in Catalonia, so not too far from Pyrénées-Orientales.
Going from the coast to an area inland can feel like a different world, so I would really look at you needs rather than the country. We sometimes visit Roses and although it's a different country, it would feel more like Banyuls-sur-Mer in terms of climate, culture etc. Go to Py and people who live there might feel like foreigners when they visit Perpignan. I suppose for those who don't speak the language, Portugal and Spain (further down) might offer easier visa options and have typical coastal resorts where English is widely spoken. Italy or an island like Sardinia might be an option but there you still have the issue with admin, visas and language.

Lou71

I hope nobody minds if I interject from Iberia!

First of all, I love France and I have always enjoyed holidays there and latterly, driving through on the way to and from Spain and Portugal. Great food, great scenery, great culture, friendly people and lots more.

That said, unless you have fluent French, you may find that it's easier to settle in Spain or Portugal, particularly if you are retirees and want to get that holiday feel. Much of it is about personal taste and preference and everyone is different but generally speaking, I think Spain and Portugal are rather more geared up for residential tourism. Obviously it depends on your needs to some extent but for retirees who are not moving with young children and/or looking to work or set up a business, I feel that Spain and Portugal might be more suited to the relaxed lifestyle in a good climate where there is plenty going on all year round - well it certainly is where we are!

If neither of you have an EU passport, Portugal is the easier of the two in terms of visas whereas Spain has a higher minimum income threshold.

Something to think about perhaps?

Helen1964

Are you living in Spain/Portugal full time, Lou?
Or just spending winters there?
Am I right in thinking it’s easier to manage in Spain/Portugal with poor Spanish/Portuguese than in France with poor French?
Because there are plenty of English-speaking accountants, lawyers, etc to take the pain out of admin?

Moses2013

From previous posts Lou71 lives there permanently. I think that you'll find that there are more people in Spain/Portugal (mainly Algarve) who manage without any Spanish/Portuguese at all.
Of course everybody should try to learn the language, what I think Lou71 meant is that Spain and Portugal are just more set up for residential tourism in a way where English is accepted and widely spoken.
Be it British/Irish, Scandinavians, Dutch, German, they all communicate in English and just more common to find shops, restaurants, bars that are set up that way for year round living.
Something like a gestor is very unique to Spain for example https://www.idealista.com/en/news/le...y-can-help-you
Your example with Orange is great and simple things can be difficult. Be it phone/internet, electricity, car/home insurance, banking, medical, getting furniture delivered and just the general day to day stuff. When things happen around your home it gets even more complicated and you might need a plumber, electrician, carpenter.

Rosemary

Why do people presume that just because it may be possible to live in some areas of Spain with little or no knowledge of the language that this applies to Spain in general. It definitely does not. There are many areas where English is not understood or spoken.

Rosemary

Moses2013

I think you misunderstood. Nobody said that every area in Spain is English speaking, it's just reality that you will find far more areas where it's possible (also Algarve).
Where we are it's Catalan, but along the coast you will find more areas that are set up for foreigners who holiday/live there long-term.

Helen1964

Morning Rosemary.
I don't think anyone is presuming that that applies to Spain in general. I think we all realise it's true of certain areas in Spain and Portugal. As regards France on the other hand, I can't think of any areas of the country where you could get away with knowing practically no French.

It would be very nice to have gestors here to help with admin. But's it not just about admin, is it? With basic French, you can certainly muddle along in France. Plenty do. From what I gather, Bob and his partner are no spring chickens. I know lots of nice middle-class English people who have moved to France late in life (they tend to be a bit snooty about Spain for some reason) and not one of them has managed to learn French to a really high level. Usually one of the spouses has significantly better French than the other and, as a result, deals with all the paperwork. But even if your French is good enough to cope with the French tax return, deal with insurance companies if you have a car accident, etc. at the end of the day it's still a slightly unsatisfying half-life. You're never going to fire off an acerbic and highly effective email to a company or government agency, complaining about bad customer service. You're probably not going to stand up in a public meeting and explain exactly why the new proposed tram route should go down one street and not anotther. You're probably not going to join in the heated political discussion going on at the next table in the local bar.
You'll basically always be floating along the surface of society. A tourist with knobs on. Remember I'm not talking about younger people moving to France. I'm specifically talking about older people.

I'm thinking that this is less true of Spain and Portugal where there is perhaps a big enough English-speaking population to enable someone to play an active part in what feels like a community without having great Spanish or Portuguese. Or mabye I've just seen too many episodes of New Life in the Sun where the Brits always seem to be raising money for donkey sanctuaries.