That is the question!

I've just come back from a few days in the UK. I went over there via TGV from Dijon to CDG airport where I took a plane - great stuff. But, as I was settling down at about 0700 to have a quick nap the controller came around asking for the tickets.
"Vous avez pas composter vos billets!!", he said to a bewildered english familly, who couldn't speak French. Oh FFS, I said to myself knowing damn well I wouldn't be getting any peace in the near future.

Normally I couldn't care less, but the conversation was heating up and nobody was going to give up. Already in a foul mood as it was and thinking that it had been a long time since I hadn't had the pleasure of punching someone, I was ready to step in.

So there I am trying to translate and explain to tweedle dum and tweedle dee what all the fuss is about and that they had to validate their tickets on the platform before boarding the train, blah blah blah. But the controller, being a real little git, was giving them quite a bit of hassle insisting that they had to be composté etc etc, and its then that I started to take sides with the English familly - So bloody what if the ticket hasn't been stamped, really, what the hell does it change?? They bought the ticket, they have it there to show you, so why all the fuss FFS??!! Does it really change anything?? Do we have to put the train in reverse so they can do what they should have done half an hour ago??
We were arriving in Montbard, so I asked if we could quickly go and compost them and the controller grunted in agreement. Me and the other guy quicky nipped off the train and there we were stamping the tickets for the whole of the familly and the guy says to me, ' I just can't understand why this is neccesary!" I gave the gallic shrug, saying I hadn't a clue either, but for the rest of the journey I couldn't stop thinking about it.

So any ideas as to why this french tradition "composting the tickets", is absolutely necessary??

Le Plumber,
The honest answer is I don't really know.
However if I was asked to guess a probable reason, it would be something to do with the average French persons attachment (still) to Serge Gainsbourg, and especially his very big hit 'Le Poinçonneur des Lilas'.
Even today 50 years on, it is still a frequently played song on French radio stations. It's a fact that the metro station of Mairie des Lilas is much less famous than the ticket puncher immortalized by Gainsbourg.

I'm a little surprised you didn't tell the (fat?)controller that all that composting was a load of merde.......

Anyone else with other theories?

http://www.voyages-sncf.com/guide/vo..._du_billet.pdf

doesn't explain why, but it's a fact that, if you haven't compostéd your ticket, then you aren't en règle and you're liable to pay a fine. Ours is not to ask the reason why, c'est comme ça!
Unfortunately it's an unknown concept outside of France and I dare say the OP's English travelling companions aren't the only ones to have been caught out.They were unlucky with their Contrôleur, who must have been having a bad day and was applying the maxim "ignorance of the law is no excuse".

I've never seen the reasoning for it either - fortunately they have the machines at the head of the platform in some of the major Paris stations, so even if you're in a rush, you can quickly punch it. I'm told you can board the train without having done so, but you must go and seek out a controller as soon as you're onboard and have them do it... Since being told that, I'm not sure controllers, such as the one you encountered, would agree with that advice.

It's not unique to France in the days of British Rail, A Platform Attendant would do it as you exit the Ticket Room and Enter the Platform. Back in those days you would get a ticket that was undated and only showed really if it was a Peak or Off Peak and Child or Adult, Composting it as you say just invalidates the ticket for future use, One Hole meant you were on the platform waiting for the Train a second punch/hole or rip indicates you were on the Train at the other end an Attendant would collect the used tickets.

Cut backs produced a machine to do the Station Attendants job, And if you were a regular train commuter getting a mouthful from the Guard would ensure passengers stamped their tickets prior to boarding. These days though it's a meaningless task as a ticket is dated any usually only valid for one journey.


Traditions Stick a lot of the Traditions within Sncf have come from British Rail and the founding regions that existed prior to the amalgamation them into British Rail.

Asked my French OH and in-laws and all say that it's to prevent people from using "open" tickets a second time if there's no contrôleur on the train, also to prevent them from getting non-compostéd TGV tickets reimbursed after their journey.
There you go, straight from the horses' mouths!

What so they worked for SNCF?

No, FRENCH is the operative word!

This system is used not only in France but several other countries in Europe, and who knows where else around the world.

Personally, I like it. So you can buy your ticket in advance and it doesn't 'run out' as would be the case with Brit Rail if you didn't use it on the day. It only becomes an operational ticket when it is validated or composted.

It avoids the hassle or panic if you are rushing and may not have time to buy as you board. And if you change your travel plans, so what, the ticket is still good for another day.

But with that, you can see why it requires validation, otherwise the wide-boys would use it for repeated journeys ad-infinitum.

You have to validate your tickets in Italy as well.

Before the days of computerised tickets, Italy used little different coloured bits of cardboard tickets. They had no date or destination on them. If there was no controller on the train you kept it and used it again the next day - and the next and the next ... especially if you only had to go a few train stops. (Much like DMU said earlier). You could almost always get on and off before the ticket checker even got to your carriage.

Not sure why today's modern, digitally printed tickets still need to be stamped though.

The French Mrs. told me if you don't stamp your ticket you can also get a partial refund on the ticket price... Another reason why they're so rigorous on the checking.

Well, Le Plumber, Le Hero of Le Hour, well done you! I'd have chinned him and chucked him on the nearest compost heap meself, bloody French red tape, drives us all nuts on the QT, but we roll over like Good Little Brits and just play the game. Don't get me wrong I adore it here, but the paperwork and chuntering of officials can be heard throughout the hills here on a regular basis.

As a rather outspoken sort myself, I have had to learn subtlety. Not easy, and a constant burden not just on myself but the poor OH who is constantly scared out of his wits I might "react" when we get a "close encounter" especially with that "dame mechant" we got embroiled with when we were trying to get that PACS thing. By comparison, doing the tax forms was a doddle.

We are trying to get a new window put in here, just a little one, at the back of the house, no one overlooking, and you can't even see it from the road. We've done architect-quality plans of every elevation, cross sections, diagrams, annotated drawings, the flippin lot. Just done another plan, which, to me seems totally irrelevant, but hoping that's it. Have a feeling that they will probably still want a sample of our DNA and 15 aerial photographs, but that's the way it is here.

Good day to all, and Le Plumber, for championing that poor family and taking on French Authority you have won my Homme de la Semaine award!

Right, off to chainsaw up the wood and expel some frustration!

Hardly a hero, lol, but anyway thanks for all the replies - I saw my father-in-law the other day who's a retired train driver and confirms what most said about re-using the tickets and/or getting a refund. I still questioned the idea because there are more and more "special offer" tickets available today (eg Prems), and these you can't have altered or be reimbursed so I whats the point??
I just got the gallic shrug and "ne cherche pas à comprendre, c'est la France".

Hi,
Prem's and idTGV tickets are much cheaper (to encourage the population to take certain trains), but because they can't be changed or reimbursed, it's not recommended to book them 2-3 months before the travel date, in case you have to change your plans. And I don't think you can give your ticket to someone else. The last time I took an idTGV (x years ago, I've got a Carte Sénior now), the ticket had my name on it and I had to show ID at the special barrier along the platform.

No they are not uniquely gallic. I've been caught with an uncomposted ticket on the Berlin metro. Since when I've been a good fraulein and looked for the composting post to perform the necessary before boarding German trains.

Perhaps it is one of those things. like driving on the wrong side of the road, that Napoleon gave to Europe.