markek

Hello all, hope well wherever you are. This site seems a great resource and social forum.

Im Mark. I'm married with kids 10 and nearly 4, living in S London. Pretty happy here but time to go before elder daughter hits secondary school. Was always in mind. After some ups and downs we are looking for the right setting for our 'forever home', (ok sorry for estate agent lingo!), could anyone advise please?

We would like an area that offers all of the following, or as many as possible:
- On the coast or bit inland within max 1 hour of beaches (15 mins better).
- Near / in green hills, mountains (as large and wild as possible)
- Proper long hot summers; shorter and brighter winters than uk (but cold is fine and snow/ski within few hours a plus)
- Within above parameters, we would like a small town to small city size community
- A place that would not be too closed-minded to half-asian appearance kids (wife is Japanese), and where efforts to integrate are welcomed.

I was thinking possibly about the area between Narbonne and the Spanish border, possibly Narbonne or Perpignan but havent read much enthusiasm, or a smaller town Collioure or around, or going a bit inland maybe, perhaps as far as Ceret. This area appears to satisfy geographical demands, but was concerned to read somewhere the view in a post here that (French side) "Catalans are unwelcoming to outsiders" "my child was bullied/excluded".

Not sure if this was a one-off view or not. Definitely dont want already linguistically challenged children (no French yet but Japanese skills have loosened lingo muscles) to be in an atmosphere where being different means its likely to be bullied / ignored; on the contrary we want them (and ourselves) to become part of an open intelligent community and are happy and keen to work hard for that in various ways, primarily language but also in thinking about offering sthg to a community (various small business ideas - not desperately essential financially, but v helpful - to support becoming accepted).

If some areas are really deemed too uphill in terms of acceptance, I'd far rather steer clear than risk moving again to seek a more hospitable environment. (Eg - Corsica looks gorgeous geographically and in terms of being largely unspoilt, but it seems this is largely thanks to the violent intimidation, including bombings, of property developers; and the Corsican flag is the most unwelcoming to foreigners Ive ever seen; like hanging a dead foreigner to ward off others.).

Have read a lot of good things here about Toulouse, but too far inland for us.

Another poster said the Cote d'Azure was more open-minded / multicultural - any thoughts? Is it not super rich/super touristy?

If helpful in ruling out some areas: We have a variable property budget of €200-400k, depending on what we do back here. We would expect to bring with us a UK based income of around €2.5k a month and look to supplememt that with sthg new.

If you have any thoughts / advice on any of these points, or other suggestions of areas to aim for I'd be immensely grateful.

I used to live and work in NW Spain some years ago. Lovely; but weather too much like UK. Embarrassingly hardly know France at all. (But reasonably confident with the language).

Of course we need to travel and stay in places - planning to do a trip at Easter (anywhere crazily busy to avoid then?) - but any advice in trimming down possibilities would be lovely.

(Just in case you know these other areas and feel able to comment on their suitability to our criteria, I have also considered: just over the border into Spanish Catalunya; the Atlantic SW Basqueish coast of France - much dodgier weather than Med?; Coimbra in Portugal. Any comments or alternative ideas?)

loy loy

Cant help with location as where I am doesn't suit the beach. We are 90 mins from a beach, although there are lakes around here.

What I would like to comment on is your income. If you are living in France you will probably have to pay your tax in France. If 2500e a month is your gross income, after cotisations etc, you will probably struggle as a family of 4.

dmu

Hi, and welcome to the forum!
My first thought was the Pyrénées-Orientales, covering the coast going down from Narbonne to the Spanish border with the mountains close by. The Pyrénées-Atlantiques might also fit the bill - you've got the beautiful Basque coast, likewise with the mountains just behind.
I've no idea about "xenophobia" in those areas - IMO it depends on the personalities of the newcomers as to how they're accepted by the locals.
Be aware that the Corsicans hate even the Metropolitan French, not just foreigners!
I think an important factor of where to settle is your children's education. If you intend to stay in France forever more, then no problem. Every Commune has at least one Maternelle and Primaire. Your younger will learn French in no time, but the elder should do the last year of Primaire, to get used to the French Education System and pick up French Grammar and Culture rather than be thrown in at the deep end in Secondaire. "Going up" is daunting, even to French children.... On the other hand, if you prefer her to go to an International School, you should first find out where there are any. There may be some in Aquitaine, but there are none in Languedoc-Roussillon....
IMO you shouldn't want to leave the UK for better weather further South. Admittedly the summers are hotter, but last winter we had several perishing cold Arctic spells here in Hérault followed by continuous rain, and this winter is milder but it doesn't seem to have stopped raining since November. We haven't had flooding here, like the Atlantic Coast, but it's soooo miserable...
To follow on from L-L's comment, the official French Poverty level for a family of 4 stands at present at a joint income of approx 1900€ per month. This covers the basics, food, utilities, insurance, etc... but not treats, travel, school expenses, Mutuelle for 4, etc... Which brings us to the question of your status and healthcare if your income is coming from the UK.
I think you should make a Forum search on all these subjects and/or start new threads for each one!! (particularly (tax) status and healthcare coverage)

EuroTrash

Hi Mark, I used to live in Penge/Crystal Palace/Dulwich in another lifetime, can't imagine why you'd want to move
Well your kids are the right age for the move. As said - Hérault, Gard, Pyrénnées Orientales, Pyrénées Atlantiques are the regions that spring to mind. I'm not sure £2.5k/month is anywhere near enough for a Cote d'Azur lifestyle for a family of four. Especially if you're talking about a self-employed or remote-worker type of income that needs to be slotted into French system and have social security contributions deducted, which will take it down to well below 2000€. NOMB of course, and you've lived abroad before so you probably know, but don't forget that healthcare isn't free at the point of delivery like it is in the UK, has to be budgeted for.

I wouldn't be paranoid about getting a hostile reception, but don't expect people to fall over themselves to welcome you either, in most communes it just takes time for people to suss you out and decide how you fit into their scheme of things. People tend to be very family focused. Being a family with 2 kids should be an advantage.

Tweedpipe

How did the New Oxford Marching Band (NOMB) get in here......?
http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/NOMB

EuroTrash

Now that is deffo None Of My Business

Tweedpipe

Nice one.

InVinoVeritas

Hi Mark and welcome to the forum.

I think budget-wise you are going to find most of the towns you have mentioned will be out of your reach, Collioure is the St-Tropez of the Pyrenees-Orientales with prices to match. Ceret is very popular place with artists but also for the wealthy Spanish who have their second/third homes here.

Narbonne and Perpignan will be a bit cheaper and Beziers is always popular. Toulouse is quite expensive thanks to Airbus.

I once looked seriously at Prades and loved the combination of mountains and rivers and it also has a good climate - prices were reasonable as well (in 2007). Catllar is a small village just outside the main town and I very nearly bought a property there.

Anyhow good luck with your research!

criodain

Are there many jobs down south for English speakers? For example in Pyrénées-Atlantiques? In know Quiksilver are there, but they're looking for IT type folk, and not digital content fiddlers/technical writers etc.

I would love to make a move to the Sth West region, or along the Atlantic coast, but looking for jobs online is a complete nightmare.

Sorry to butt in on this thread.

InVinoVeritas

The OP seems to have gone AWOL so at least you're keeping the thread alive.

Honestly there are no jobs for French speakers so unless you have a sought-after skill you would have a hard time finding employment in France.

Sorry to be so negative but France has serious competivity issues and consequently the economy is still in free-fall. The UK seems to be a much better bet for those needing to work.

Tweedpipe

Be aware that looking for jobs online, by mail with detailed CV, or directly at the Pole-Emploi centers is an absolute nightmare too, even for bi-lingual French job seekers with BTS or even higher qualifications.
If on the other hand, one has an unusual or particularly sought-after qualification or specialty, with the right timing, there may well be a related job available.

Many of us had high hopes for the new government, who in 2012 promised to reduce the already very high and increasing unemployment situation. Unfortunately it hasn't happened. A sad, high record of unemployment has just been reached as indicated by latest Jan 2014 figures - and the employment minister's comments to this is just mind-boggling!

markek

Hi all, thanks for some interesting replies, especially re how much money is needed dor living expenses. I'd expected that €2,400 coming from UK was enough for a simple family lifestyle, but that seems in doubt and requires attention. Appreciate advice and will be busy researching further.

Re house prices I think we will need to hit or pass the max €400k mentioned. But not by too much based on research of estate agents.

No one had anything to say, other than general points, on the thornyish question of locals' responses to half-Asian looking newcomers; does that mean people see it it's a non-issue? I hope so but not sure. Clearer comments on that?

We're currently planning a trip out for 2 weeks at Easter to get tonknow the area and look at some.properties. If anyone has suggestions of how to find a property to use as a base during our recce that'd be great.

Thanks again for responses

Novocastrian

I think you need to figure out what the nett would be from that. i.e. what disposable income would be left after taxes, social contribution and health insurance costs. These will vary wildly depending upon your residency/tax status, eligibility for CPAM and on the source of the income.


For two weeks, rent a gîte. Check out e.g. the gîtes de france website. There are many others.

EuroTrash

Personally I would have thought you're overestimating on the house price and underestimating on the cost of living, but then I've never looked at property in those particular areas.

When I first moved I found the cost of living certainly no lower and probably a little higher than in the UK. Since then the cost of living here has definitely increased, not sure what it's done in the UK - but then the exchange rate makes a big difference.

However the big difference for people who work is the cotisations. You keep mentioning that your income 'comes from the UK' but if this is earned income, and if you yourself are physically in France when you do the earning, the income will be classed as money earned in France, irrespective of where in the world your employer/client happens to be. Therefore it'll be subject to French social security contributions. If it's unearned income, it will be subject to tax (CSG and possibly income tax) in France, plus you'll have to find another way to obtain healthcare. All this 'infrastructure' expense eats away at your income before you start paying the day to day living expenses.

Re the acceptance thing, I can only give an opinion based on my experience in the west of France, but I would definitely say that round here people are very respectful of others. France is very big on everybody's right to privacy. People don't pry into other people's private lives (although they don't miss much either!) and they are slower to judge a person than people in the UK, it is more of a live and let live culture. People are polite to newcomers, they bide their time, watch how you behave, and gradually form their opinion over months or even years. FWIW there is one particular Asian family that lives about 6 doors away from me, their cat often sits outside the house and I always stop to stroke it when I go past, they're a lovely family and everybody likes them because they are 'sérieux'. Being 'sérieux' is the main criteria round here, it doesn't exactly mean serious, it means that you work hard and live a respectable life. If they decide you're not 'sérieux', they will still be polite but you will probably notice a touch of coldness.

markek

On the income side, we have 2 properties we get a rental income from, besides our home. We are undecided as yet on what to sell/keep. The €2,400 / month figure is a very modest estimate of rental income from 1 of the flats and our home, the modesty accounting for a rough estimate of tax deducted (re UK tax system). I am unfamiliar with the how tax obligations in France will impact: clearly this is a v large and complex area to delve into, more so than I'd anticipated. Must be many here with properties rented out back in Blighty I imagine, and a lot of posts already on that.

Thx EuroTrash for comment on being accepted; well explained and clear.