Gregsrequest

I read with interest the discussion between igypsy and BritinParis .

I am hoping someone can help me .

I have a remarkably similar circumstance to igypsy , although they to not state their gender for application purposes regarding the BNA of 1981 .

Very briefly :

Grandfather born in the U.K. 1919 .
In Crown Service (RAF) in South Africa between 1941 and 1946 .(Demobbed in U.K. at Strensall ,Queen Elizabeth barracks in 1946.)
Meets and marries my South African gran ( of British descent)in 1942 in South Africa..
My father was born in South Africa in 1945 and received British passport many years later (after 1983).
I was born in South Africa in 1965 . (male)
Do I qualify for a British passport based on citizenship by otherwise than descent?
Thank you in advance .

BritInParis

You would be a British citizen by descent as your father was a British citizen otherwise than by descent based on his father's Crown service. Providing your grandfather was recruited for the RAF in the UK then you should qualify.

Gregsrequest

Thank you BritinParis for your speedy reply , quite remarkable indeed.

I would just like reassurance that ; 1. the BNA of 1981 in redressing the right of acquisition of BC along the maternal line did not remove the right of BC through the paternal line prior to 1983. 2. That the age of the applicant in application of BC is not affected by the BNA of 1981 .Where the paternal grandfather ,in crown service abroad during the time of birth of parent of applicant and recruited in the U.K. .
So essentially is my birth date of 1965 and male , U.K. born grandfather 1919,crown service abroad ,South Africa,recruited in U.K. 1941-1946 .Father born in South Africa during this time,British registered U.K. citizen with passport and U.K.pensioner now deceased.
I have applied for all the docs.that you mention in igypsy post, including the service record which states place of recruitment .
Please advise if all of this in order , for my application of BC to succeed.
Thank you once again .

igypsy

Greg I replied to you on my original post, but wouldn't it be funny if our grandparents served together? It all sounds remarkably similar!

I was under the impression that BC on these grounds would have only applied if you were born after 1983 -- or is it only that you would have been able to claim citizenship FROM 1983? BritInParis is very knowledgeable on these things so I would assume he is correct!

I don't think the maternal/paternal question will be an issue, laws granting citizenship through the maternal line didn't revoke anything from the paternal one.

Are you applying from within the UK?

BritInParis

Forgive me, I have made an error regarding British citizenship through a grandfather in Crown service. It would not apply to the OP as he was born before 1 January 1983.

Where was your maternal grandfather born? Which county of the UK was your paternal grandfather born in? Was your birth registered with the British High Commission in South Africa? Was your mother registered as a CUKC based on her marriage to your father before you were born?

Gregsrequest

Ouch . Paternal grandfather born in Leeds county, maternal grandfather born in south africa . birth was not registered with the high commission but with local authorities in SA, mother not registered as CUKC before my birth . However remarried a british citizen in !984 . please advise .

BritInParis

Unfortunately it appears that you only qualify for a UK Ancestry visa.

Gregsrequest

The issue of citizenship by otherwise than descent or citizenship by descent arises here . My father was registered as a british citizen , presumably by otherwise than descent because of my grandfathers crown service abroad,. My father , (now deceased) was resident in the U.K prior to his death aswell as a British pensioner . Which other avenues can i look at ?

BritInParis

The concept of 'otherwise than by descent' didn't exist until BNA 1981. If your father was in Crown service at the time of your birth then you would have a claim. Your grandfather being in Crown service would only be useful if you were born after 1 January 1983 like igypsy. The only thing I can suggest is applying to the General Register Office to see whether your birth was registered with the British authorities. Your fee will be refunded if there is no record.

angie_329

Just to say that an Ancestry visa is a good route if you have a spouse, as there is no need to earn a minimum amount ( or have vast savings) to sponsor them, they can come to the Uk as your dependent straight away and work also.

Gregsrequest

Thank you Angie for that info. I appreciate that .My focus must perhaps now be in that direction now ( ancestral visa), as you can imagine a huge disappointment when one has expectations of success ,due mainly to the relatively complicated law and the uncertainty that goes with different interpretations out "there". Kudos to BritinParis for his excellent work and interpretation of the law and his knowledge thereof. My next request is obviously going to be " Applying for British Ancestral visa - please help." Best wishes.

BritInParis

If your main intention is to live and work in the UK for at least five years then a UK Ancestry visa is a very good second choice; in fact it's vastly superior if you have a spouse as they can go as a dependent rather than you having to jump through all kinds of financial hoops and spend a small fortune on visa fees to sponsor them for a spouse visa as angie_329 points out.

Start here: https://www.gov.uk/ancestry-visa

The fee is ZAR 9241. You'll also need to pay the Immigration Health Surcharge upfront which is £200 a year so £1000.

It's a comparatively very straightforward application. Once you have been living and working in the UK then you can apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain and then apply to naturalise as a British citizen a year after that (unless you are married to a British citizen in which you can apply immediately). Naturalisation will give you British citizenship otherwise than by descent.

angie_329

The longest time is spent getting your family documents so that is a good place to start.
Even though there are costs involved it is the lowest cost work type visa one can get to the uk and bring dependents. There is no age limit either.
There are also some tips on an article blog of 1stcontact why people miss out on ancestry visas.e.g
you can show intent to work ( you dont need a job offer) by creating an account on an online job site and upload cv, apply for some jobs and keep replies on email. Once in the UK part time work or self employment is acceptable also.

also the funds shown to support yourself ( 1600gbp) if not in your account can be via a sponsor in UK who must write a formal letter of sponsorship.

Yes, I agree, it is disappointing that someone with British Ancestry cannot get a passport... but at least you have a fall back position.

Gregsrequest

Dear Angie , thank you for all that info , sincerely appreciate it . I accept that the ancestral visa is the next best option for the reasons you have stated . All info is welcome , thank you. best wishes Gregb

Gregsrequest

Dear BritinParis , thank you for your help. I will be back requesting more info soon as the process unfolds , thank you once again for your commitment to helping others .regards Gregb