michael walsh

Hi everyone,

Apologies if some of the answers I am looking for can be found in other threads but I need to be specific:

We 'Famous Five', Jackie and Barrie, two professional keyboard players: their retired mum and dad ... and family friend me (freelance writer / journalist ) are becoming fed up with Spain. It is suffering more than most from the recession. Even talented people struggle to get by but we do scratch a living. I am okay: I have a guaranteed investment income of £500 a month. So does Jackie's mum and dad so we are financially independent.

Jackie and Barrie need to earn - as musicians. Restaurant / Venue gigs! I can easily top mine up by writing. I already write for many English language newspapers, magazines; and some copywriting.

Where do we go from here? The real appeal is Argentina or Uruguay. I am just wondering; has either nation got a work / leisure advantage over the other. And, is £500 a month likely to pay the rent and prevent me from starving? Cheers, in anticipation of lots of helpful replies.

Jules Europe

I would have said that Argentina would be by far the better choice from a working/entertainment perspective, especially Buenos Aires as Montevideo in Uruguay is distinctly dead from that perspective, Punta del Este in Uruguay though, would be ideal but work would be seasonal, whereas in Buenos Aires it would probably be all year.

Uruguay is a better country in which to live in, if security and stability are foremost on your mind.

el rubio

I know nothing about Uruguay but Buenos Aires (BA) has hundreds of bars, restaurants and music venues of one sort or another. There is a long-established English language newspaper, the Buenos Aires Herald, and an internet radio station (WBAT).

You could probably survive on £500 per month, many locals do on this or less, but you would struggle if you wanted to be in a nice part of town and enjoy much of the good life I think. The economy is volatile and not immune from the global recession. Like many places though, some sectors of society seem to do very well nevertheless. You won't find much in the way of a welfare state and state-run healthcare is basic, so most people have private medical cover, often arranged and paid by employers.

BA is a very lively, cosmopolitan city, sometimes a bit mad and personal security has become a worry for many people. Life in the provinces is more sedate and can be third-world in some places but the country as a whole offers a huge choice of climate, scenery and way of life in general.

Hope this helps with your decision.

michael walsh

Thanks, both of you. Very helpful. I can usually top up my £500 by writing or writing / generating leads, as I do here in Spain. Would need to the way the pound sterling is sinking. What you say is encouraging. Cheers.

Jules Europe

By the way if you choose Argentina be wary of the banks, as I`ve heard some negative stories concerning these, whereas banks in Uruguay have a solid and good reputation and indeed a lot of Argentinians invest there.

geoffreybrooks

I have lived for two years in Uruguay (2001-2003 Paysandu) and in Argentina on and off for the fifteen years since the birth of my Argentine daughter.

All financial thinking here is in terms of "the lower the local currency sinks against the dollar/sterling, the better the conversion rate", i.e. change your money into pesos and keep it there.

Present interest on plazo fijo in Argentina is around 10%. In Uruguay at the height of the 2001 crisis I was getting 50%. In the city centre Banco Piano, despite its name, is the bank for international dealings. You must have at least a passport to cash a cheque with 35 days' wait, but with a DNI they will cash a foreign cheque on sight. With guaranteed income you should be able to obtain residence after four months or so.

In tourist areas of Argentina one can often rent a villa for 200 pesos a month (current exhange rate 6 pesos to the pound sterling) for the nine off-season months of the year (March-November). I can live very comfortably on my UK state pension of 3500 pesos, all found, paying a large portion of it to supporting my daughter.

michael walsh

Nice one! It's an option then. Things are pretty grim here in Spain!

geoffreybrooks

If there is anything more you want to know from me, particularly about Argentina but also Uruguay just ask. If I do not know the answer to any question I can ask my family here in Buenos Aires and Gualeguaychú).

michael walsh

Thanks, Geoff. Will do. I was in both countries once - as a young British seaman. Both were enchanting - or I had my rose-coloured specs on?

clive66

..I am a financial consultant living in Buenos Aires...ITS CHEAP!...As well as culturally sophisticated, and fun...I also play drums...when I have time.. They love live music here...Arg. peso is at least 5-1 on £...If you want to know more...ask!::

michael walsh

Thanks! Will do. Here's some of us!

http://barrieandjackie.blogspot.com/

Expat_Family

Hi Michael.

Just want to share a bit of our personal experience.

After leaving for about 10 years in Spain we moved to Buenos Aires, and we stayed there for 12 months. Now we just moved BACK to Spain (Costa del Sol.)

Forget about Spain's recession! I know it's bad. But it's NOTHING compared to Argentina! Argentinas economical situation is much, much worser, and compared to living in Spain, it is completely insecure to live there.

Additionally, local people are getting a monthly salary of about 250 euros per month. Nobody would hire European entertainers, and if so, they would pay "local" salery. Maybe about 2-4 euros per hour?

Non-residents have to pay either a complete year rent in advance to rent an apartment, or they have to pay "foreigner prices", which usually "starts" at USD $600-$750 per months for a 2 bedroom apartment.

I don't see at all how you could live there as a foreigner for about 600 Euros.

We really enjoyed Buenos Aires, and I love the locals, but now we are extremely happy to be back in Spain!

MichelleAlison

Just to put the records straight - there are around 6 pesos to the pound.

Geoffrey, I would be interested to know where you can rent a villa in a tourist area for 200 pesos a month off season?

Although some things are cheaper here than in Europe, it is certainly not as cheap as it was.

Regards

Michelle

TallisFantasia

Appreciate your information and frankness, GeoffreyBrooks. Please tell us more about Paysandú. There are highly contrasting reports of it online. Are the heat and humidity ghastly in summer? Is property more expensive above the floodling line? Any expat gatherings/networks there? (Am aware of those in Mvd area.) Cheaper than Mvd? Winter better there than Mvd? Etc etc etc!

All ditto for Salto if anybody's lived there. Neither looks exactly picturesque in Youtube, though Salto is rated thus in some commentaries. Also, how much would one save on cost of living if settling, say, 30-45 min outside of Mvd versus in Mvd? (Can you tell I'm on a budget?)

Thanks to all for this enjoyable, informative forum. My first post here.

TallisFantasia

Appreciate your information and frankness, GeoffreyBrooks. Please tell us more about Paysandú. There are highly contrasting reports of it online. Are the heat and humidity ghastly in summer? Is property more expensive above the floodling line? Any expat gatherings/networks there? (Am aware of those in Mvd area.) Cheaper than Mvd? Winter better there than Mvd? Etc etc etc!

All ditto for Salto if anybody's lived there. Neither looks exactly picturesque in Youtube, though Salto is rated thus in some commentaries.

Thanks to all for this enjoyable, informative forum. My first post.