Novocastrian

babyblue #47 "It good to see a healthy debate!"

IMHO this debate is anything but healthy. Given the tone of much of this thread, why would anyone want to live in a "Great Brit" neighbourhood?

Also, if you bother to look at the Statcan site, it doesn't take long to find that a fairly small percentage of UK country of origin immigrants come to Toronto itself (23.6% in 2001) cf 33.1% for the rest of Ontario and 43.9% for the rest of Canada. You can compare this to eg China (41.1/8.9/50), Jamaica (76.7/11/12.3) or former USSR (46.6/15/38.4). You can then deduce that the most likely place to find your apparently desirable "Great Brit" neighbourhood is outside of Toronto, elsewhere in Ontario.

Here's to living in a multicultural Canada.

Lapsed Canuck

Good points. Do people not understand that the whole of Canada (with the exception of Quebec) is 'British'? This is why groups of immigrants have over the centuries tended to gather in groups in the big cities - to feel accepted, welcomed and part of a community. Tolerance for 'foreigners' and 'non-whites' has been a hard fought battle in Canada (as in other British colonies)and although lots of inroads have been made, unfortunately there are still too many people who have a narrow, exclusive attitude. Brits don't need a place to 'gather' - you have the whole of the country!!

stevenkilleen

I know it is difficult to get a point across on a forum, as the basic premise of a forum like this is to offer opinions as opposed to ideas - no matter how narrow-minded, ill-informed they may be. Pick up any political science or history book and you will realise how hard it is to change or challenge people's opinions compared to their ideas. It's pointless, but this particular thread is deeply concerning and depressing, so in this instance I choose to add my ideas.

Through the late twentieth century to the present day, liberal thinkers and arcitects of the European Union, have blamed nationalism for most of modernity's evils. Tribalism in a more modern guise, they denounce it. If only we abandoned this old fixation with national identities, then we could finally get past nasty ethnocentrism, vulgar chauvinism,and bloody feuding. In place of nationalism, one can propose that we become cosmopolitans - shelving patriotism and submitting to government by international institutions and laws.

Now I know this is a beautiful picture, but not at all realistic. And it turns it back on a strain of liberalism that begins with John Stuart Mill and continues through to Isaiah Berlin. This tradition understands that humans crave identifying with a group. It is an unavoidable, immemorial, hardwired instinct. Since modern life has knocked the family and tribe from their central positions, the nation has become the only viable vessel for this impulse. To deny this craving is to deny human nature and human dignity.

But patriotism and cosmopolitiansim should be perfectly compatible. You could love your country - even consider it a superior group - without desiring to dominate other groups or closing yourself off to foriegn impulses.

However, to address the sentiment of the thread, ie craving a "Brit Area", wanting fish and chip shops, etc, I believe that can be found in a place called Great Britain - where you are free to read the Daily Mail and join the British National Party.

babyblue

LISTEN!

I am all for this wonderful multicultural city. I was simply voicing my opinion after driving through the city.
Gay,Lesbian,straight,chinese,indian,or anythign else is fine with me i am not predjudice in any way.
I work with special needs for goodness sake!.... If anyone is segregated alot of the time it is the individual with special needs.

I have no problems with this city... I love canada becuase it really does accept any culture and sexuality.

you have misunderstood the concept of this thread.

babyblue

This is a wonderful insight but what about the allowed segrigation that exsist here already? china town etc

Why do we have such a hard time getting into the country to start with?

why do we use this website?
would it be to guide and help each other through the transition?
support through applications and resetttlement?
is this a group place?

dbd33

That's a cheap shot. It doesn't follow at all that someone who craves theme park Britain is xenophobic or right wing. I, for example, enjoy having pubs and chip shops nearby despite being a dedicated Guardinista.

More than that, this condemnation conflicts with the Canadian model of society, we are expected to be British-Canadians in the way that other people might be Chinese-Canadians, someone who wants to merge into a foreign English speaking society would be better placed to move to the US where the model for immigration is the melting pot and not the multi-culture.

Oxford

Thank goodness there is no Little Britain I have to say! That is the whole point of us trying to leave the UK - these days I find it quite embarrassing to be British. We can't wait to give it our best shot to integrate and explore other cultures.

MikeUK

Well if your embarrassed to be British, I’m sure you'll find another G7 nation of similar stature with similar problems to be a wonderful and refreshing change

dbd33

You can't integrate into Toronto. You can, however, see the world from the Gerrard streetcar window. If Toronto has any merit at all it is that people here do not integrate but carry on being who they were. Thus, if you want, you can buy almost any food, raw or cooked, from someone native to the country of the food in the language of the country of the food. One cannot, overnight, become a bit Chinese, a bit Italian, a bit Jamaican, yadda yadda (oh, yes, and a bit-kosher) so the only option is to carry on being a Londoner (or from somewhere peripheral to London) and to enjoy the fact that no one else is from here either.

Novocastrian

Babyblue:
"This is a wonderful insight but what about the allowed segrigation that exsist here already? china town etc

"Allowed segregation" !!!!! You mean neighbourhoods with a predominant enthnicity? Segregation FFS?

Why do we have such a hard time getting into the country to start with?

Do you expect preferential treatment because you are a "Great Brit"?? Do you have "special needs"?

CalgaryBlade

Maybe where you live.

babyblue

Hold on to your horses!

What is your problem?

Why do you attack in such a way!

I am sure i am not alone in my observations. Ok then!, Why do we have these 'neighbourhoods with predominant enthnicity'?
Why should this be allowed in the first instance. Becuase if this is what this country is about then why allow such facilities to be built in the first place?
Why allow (lets say!)China town, To be built and constructed soley for the chinese comunity? Why chinese writing everywhere in prodominantly english speaking country?
I have nothing at all against multi culture nor prejudice against individuals.

I am not at all saying that i should receive preferential treatment in any shape or form. I have already found out that this does not happen for us! I was simply stating how cool it would be to share some of our cultural delights!
Don't tell me that you can go anywhere and buy haggus, soada bread, cream teas etc
These are classed as speciality stores and are few and far between. We are often in here discussing where to buy certain items.
I happen to think it would be great to have an area where we could visit from time to time to puchase those little home comforts we all talk about.I am sure the others would apreciate this too.
I am sure that even if you have been here 20 years, you still miss certain things even if you love this country and would never move back to the UK.
I am not here to fall out with anyone or cause trouble as this was a simple observation on my behalf.

celine_uk

that's the stupidest comment I've ever heard in a while! hmm

god i didnt think this thread would drag on to over 70 post! oh my

celine_uk

Good for you babyblue, so many people on here are so up themselves….. ( not all of them but a lot)

Mctree

Why is there no Little Britain in Canada? Because (judging by this forum) Brits don't get along with each other.