Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
Feb 14th 2017, 1:25 pm
#31
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,375
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
This is a problem where the unwary can get badly burned. There is a complicated dynamic going on at the moment with the listing prices of houses. It has been the practice in Toronto for some years now to underlist a property (so if, for example, the house is worth around $1.1Mi, the agent would list it at $800-900k), and then set a date and time for all offers. This strategy attracts those that know what its really worth and are prepared to pay for it, and also those that think they are going to get it for the list price, thus generating multiple offers. The more offers there are then generally the more over the list price the property goes for. So this strategy can net you 1.3mi for that 1.1mi house if you get enough offers and one person crazy (or competitive) enough to pay that price. $1.3mi then becomes the new benchmark for the street - hence the leaps in prices. Remember the bidders have no idea what the other offers are.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:07 pm
#33
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Orton, Ontario
Posts: 2,032
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I only wish I could explain it. I couldn't agree more, but those are the rules. Real estate salespeople are expressly forbidden to reveal the details of any offer to other bidders. The way to 'beat' other offers is to offer a stupidly high amount, and that is how we are seeing houses that are correctly priced selling for so much over the list price. For a house priced at $800k with 8 offers, 7 of them could be $810k, it only takes one to bid $950k and there it is sold at $150k over asking.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:15 pm
#34
Dichotomus tinker
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,678
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
The real estate industry in Canada sucks compared to rightmove UK, zoopla UK even the US realtor.com that have way way more information for a purchaser or seller.
In Canada a listing where the price isn't shown, that a potential interest in a property one must call to get details of it or what the price is from the agent. You'll never get the agent on the first call or it goes to voicemail
A listing on 'realtor.ca' is basic basic. Its doesn't give property tax details, the current owners yearly approximate utility costs, what the comparable house in the same street or area have sold for in the last 12 months
even a basic UK property has all the details including a floor plan & the cost of everything. So why not in Canada eh?
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/det...3ab451389ef54c
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/det...3ab451389ef54c
So, buyer & seller beware from the protected archaic realestate industry in Canada
That 'the real estate agent is not your friend'
.
In Canada a listing where the price isn't shown, that a potential interest in a property one must call to get details of it or what the price is from the agent. You'll never get the agent on the first call or it goes to voicemail
A listing on 'realtor.ca' is basic basic. Its doesn't give property tax details, the current owners yearly approximate utility costs, what the comparable house in the same street or area have sold for in the last 12 months
even a basic UK property has all the details including a floor plan & the cost of everything. So why not in Canada eh?
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/det...3ab451389ef54c
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/for-sale/det...3ab451389ef54c
So, buyer & seller beware from the protected archaic realestate industry in Canada
That 'the real estate agent is not your friend'
.
Last edited by not2old; Feb 14th 2017 at 2:23 pm.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:18 pm
#35
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,022
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I only wish I could explain it. I couldn't agree more, but those are the rules. Real estate salespeople are expressly forbidden to reveal the details of any offer to other bidders. The way to 'beat' other offers is to offer a stupidly high amount, and that is how we are seeing houses that are correctly priced selling for so much over the list price. For a house priced at $800k with 8 offers, 7 of them could be $810k, it only takes one to bid $950k and there it is sold at $150k over asking.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:30 pm
#36
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Orton, Ontario
Posts: 2,032
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I got into the industry 7 years ago and it was relatively sane then, in that you could tell a buyer to think about it overnight and maybe take a second viewing before putting in an offer without competition and with conditions, like home inspection. This past year has been impossible, I find it very difficult to encourage people to put down $100-200k more for a house than the data support with no home inspection or financing condition. And that is why I am currently 500km away from the GTA real estate market watching the snow rise above the windowsill.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:43 pm
#37
Dichotomus tinker
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 6,678
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
on the basis that I am looking to purchase a property in the GTA these days.
That I have to sign a representation form with an agent
That the agent is totally bored out of their head if you want a day of it seeing several properties.
That if the agent gets any sense one is what you are after, then its the 'hard sell' tatic, anything from 'it wont be here tomorrow, to if you really want it then put in the asking price, maybe even go over,with zero conditions.
As a seller, I'm having to sign a 90 day representation agreement with the brokerage.
Agents have different approaches on a listing. Tough as nails on commission, most have zero flexability, especially those big 'red, white & blue' ones where agents have to pay a desk fee.
I'd be told as a seller to get a pre-inspection done (paid by me) because this will show any flaws that can be corrected or make it an easy sell.
That I must have open houses which is for the agents benefit
That I must have a lock box
That to sell it fast list it at the price of the last sold prices in the area, or lower so we might get multiple offer
and on and on
Although in today's 2017 GTA or Greater Vancouver area goodness knows what will happen starting in the spring?
Maybe this will be the year to sell, or maybe next year?
What about the potential first time purchasers - seems they haven't a hope in hell of getting to own a home in the GTA or greater Vancouver area.
Well there is always making a first time purchase at least 100km away from the unaffordable properties
That I have to sign a representation form with an agent
That the agent is totally bored out of their head if you want a day of it seeing several properties.
That if the agent gets any sense one is what you are after, then its the 'hard sell' tatic, anything from 'it wont be here tomorrow, to if you really want it then put in the asking price, maybe even go over,with zero conditions.
As a seller, I'm having to sign a 90 day representation agreement with the brokerage.
Agents have different approaches on a listing. Tough as nails on commission, most have zero flexability, especially those big 'red, white & blue' ones where agents have to pay a desk fee.
I'd be told as a seller to get a pre-inspection done (paid by me) because this will show any flaws that can be corrected or make it an easy sell.
That I must have open houses which is for the agents benefit
That I must have a lock box
That to sell it fast list it at the price of the last sold prices in the area, or lower so we might get multiple offer
and on and on
Although in today's 2017 GTA or Greater Vancouver area goodness knows what will happen starting in the spring?
Maybe this will be the year to sell, or maybe next year?
What about the potential first time purchasers - seems they haven't a hope in hell of getting to own a home in the GTA or greater Vancouver area.
Well there is always making a first time purchase at least 100km away from the unaffordable properties
Feb 14th 2017, 2:49 pm
#38
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,375
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I only wish I could explain it. I couldn't agree more, but those are the rules. Real estate salespeople are expressly forbidden to reveal the details of any offer to other bidders. The way to 'beat' other offers is to offer a stupidly high amount, and that is how we are seeing houses that are correctly priced selling for so much over the list price. For a house priced at $800k with 8 offers, 7 of them could be $810k, it only takes one to bid $950k and there it is sold at $150k over asking.
Feb 14th 2017, 2:53 pm
#39
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,022
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I'm pretty sure in Ontario it is forbidden...don't know above the rest of Canada. At least that's what we've been told by the realtors we have used.
Feb 14th 2017, 3:35 pm
#40
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Orton, Ontario
Posts: 2,032
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
26. (1) If a brokerage that has a seller as a client receives a competing written offer, the brokerage shall disclose the number of competing written offers to every person who is making one of the competing offers, but shall not disclose the substance of the competing offers. O. Reg. 580/05, s. 26 (1).
Feb 14th 2017, 3:49 pm
#41
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,022
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I got into the industry 7 years ago and it was relatively sane then, in that you could tell a buyer to think about it overnight and maybe take a second viewing before putting in an offer without competition and with conditions, like home inspection. This past year has been impossible, I find it very difficult to encourage people to put down $100-200k more for a house than the data support with no home inspection or financing condition. And that is why I am currently 500km away from the GTA real estate market watching the snow rise above the windowsill.
Feb 14th 2017, 3:51 pm
#42
Banned
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: SW Ontario
Posts: 19,879
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
Non-Catholic Child - Parent/Guardian Non-Catholic School Supporters
The Board may admit the non-Catholic elementary school child whose
parent/Guardian is not a Catholic school supporter following a review of the
application for admission by the School Admissions Committee as per policy
statement number 6. The parent/guardian will be required to complete the
Admission Expectations for Students form acknowledging acceptance of the
admission requirements
It is possible in Simcoe, but not simple.The Board may admit the non-Catholic elementary school child whose
parent/Guardian is not a Catholic school supporter following a review of the
application for admission by the School Admissions Committee as per policy
statement number 6. The parent/guardian will be required to complete the
Admission Expectations for Students form acknowledging acceptance of the
admission requirements
For Brant Haldimand Norfolk it's also possible but not simple.
What these boards say on their general website and what their board policy states doesn't always match up, so it's worthwhile doing a search for 'non Catholic admittance process'
Feb 14th 2017, 4:04 pm
#43
BE Forum Addict
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 3,363
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
Hamilton can.
For Brant Haldimand Norfolk it's also possible but not simple.
What these boards say on their general website and what their board policy states doesn't always match up, so it's worthwhile doing a search for 'non Catholic admittance process'
Non-Catholic Child - Parent/Guardian Non-Catholic School Supporters
The Board may admit the non-Catholic elementary school child whose
parent/Guardian is not a Catholic school supporter following a review of the
application for admission by the School Admissions Committee as per policy
statement number 6. The parent/guardian will be required to complete the
Admission Expectations for Students form acknowledging acceptance of the
admission requirements
It is possible in Simcoe, but not simple.The Board may admit the non-Catholic elementary school child whose
parent/Guardian is not a Catholic school supporter following a review of the
application for admission by the School Admissions Committee as per policy
statement number 6. The parent/guardian will be required to complete the
Admission Expectations for Students form acknowledging acceptance of the
admission requirements
For Brant Haldimand Norfolk it's also possible but not simple.
What these boards say on their general website and what their board policy states doesn't always match up, so it's worthwhile doing a search for 'non Catholic admittance process'
Feb 14th 2017, 4:04 pm
#44
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Orton, Ontario
Posts: 2,032
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
on the basis that I am looking to purchase a property in the GTA these days.
That I have to sign a representation form with an agent
that's because there has been a trend for people to use local agents to show them properties then get their cousin or friend with a licence to write up the offer. I don't like to ask Buyers to commit until we have be out a few times and they can hopefully see the value. I have been burned a few times where I have spent hours with people only for them to buy through someone else
That the agent is totally bored out of their head if you want a day of it seeing several properties.
that's not acceptable - complain
That if the agent gets any sense one is what you are after, then its the 'hard sell' tatic, anything from 'it wont be here tomorrow, to if you really want it then put in the asking price, maybe even go over,with zero conditions.
thats not hard sell tactics that's just the hard facts of the current GTA market.
As a seller, I'm having to sign a 90 day representation agreement with the brokerage.
not sure about all boards but my local Mls rules require a minimum 60 day listing
Agents have different approaches on a listing. Tough as nails on commission, most have zero flexability, especially those big 'red, white & blue' ones where agents have to pay a desk fee.
shop around, but remember cheapest isn't always the best. That person is going to have access to your house, pick the person you are most comfortable with
I'd be told as a seller to get a pre-inspection done (paid by me) because this will show any flaws that can be corrected or make it an easy sell.
because buyers are having to come in with no conditions a pre inspection is getting more common. Not sure, as a buyer's agent, I would trust it that much unless I was familiar with the inspector and knew him to be honest
That I must have open houses which is for the agents benefit
there seems to be an increasing number of people looking via a Open Houses with the intention of offering directly through the listing agent, in an often misguided effort to increase their chances of getting the house, however you absolutely do not have to have one if you don't want it.
That I must have a lock box
you don't have to, but the easier and more pleasant you make it for the buyers to see your house the more people will want to buy it, the more offers you will get and ultimately the best price.
That to sell it fast list it at the price of the last sold prices in the area, or lower so we might get multiple offer
depending on exactly where your house is, that advice probably will get you the best price
and on and on
Although in today's 2017 GTA or Greater Vancouver area goodness knows what will happen starting in the spring?
Maybe this will be the year to sell, or maybe next year?
What about the potential first time purchasers - seems they haven't a hope in hell of getting to own a home in the GTA or greater Vancouver area.
true
Well there is always making a first time purchase at least 100km away from the unaffordable properties
That I have to sign a representation form with an agent
that's because there has been a trend for people to use local agents to show them properties then get their cousin or friend with a licence to write up the offer. I don't like to ask Buyers to commit until we have be out a few times and they can hopefully see the value. I have been burned a few times where I have spent hours with people only for them to buy through someone else
That the agent is totally bored out of their head if you want a day of it seeing several properties.
that's not acceptable - complain
That if the agent gets any sense one is what you are after, then its the 'hard sell' tatic, anything from 'it wont be here tomorrow, to if you really want it then put in the asking price, maybe even go over,with zero conditions.
thats not hard sell tactics that's just the hard facts of the current GTA market.
As a seller, I'm having to sign a 90 day representation agreement with the brokerage.
not sure about all boards but my local Mls rules require a minimum 60 day listing
Agents have different approaches on a listing. Tough as nails on commission, most have zero flexability, especially those big 'red, white & blue' ones where agents have to pay a desk fee.
shop around, but remember cheapest isn't always the best. That person is going to have access to your house, pick the person you are most comfortable with
I'd be told as a seller to get a pre-inspection done (paid by me) because this will show any flaws that can be corrected or make it an easy sell.
because buyers are having to come in with no conditions a pre inspection is getting more common. Not sure, as a buyer's agent, I would trust it that much unless I was familiar with the inspector and knew him to be honest
That I must have open houses which is for the agents benefit
there seems to be an increasing number of people looking via a Open Houses with the intention of offering directly through the listing agent, in an often misguided effort to increase their chances of getting the house, however you absolutely do not have to have one if you don't want it.
That I must have a lock box
you don't have to, but the easier and more pleasant you make it for the buyers to see your house the more people will want to buy it, the more offers you will get and ultimately the best price.
That to sell it fast list it at the price of the last sold prices in the area, or lower so we might get multiple offer
depending on exactly where your house is, that advice probably will get you the best price
and on and on
Although in today's 2017 GTA or Greater Vancouver area goodness knows what will happen starting in the spring?
Maybe this will be the year to sell, or maybe next year?
What about the potential first time purchasers - seems they haven't a hope in hell of getting to own a home in the GTA or greater Vancouver area.
true
Well there is always making a first time purchase at least 100km away from the unaffordable properties
Further on the Open House thing, as I mentioned I recently sold my own house and I held a couple of Open Houses. It was a weird experience hosting in your own home and some of the comments were quite eye opening - particularly the 'have the owners gone into a retirement home' one. There were a couple of people that were interested in offering but only through the listing agent. I explained that I was the listing agent but also the home owner and did they really want me to represent their interests too in the purchase? Amazingly one guy couldn't understand the conflict of interest because he had read somewhere that he would get it cheaper through the listing agent.
Feb 14th 2017, 4:12 pm
#45
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Orton, Ontario
Posts: 2,032
Re: Toronto suburbs/ outer communities
I am aware that we have somewhat hijacked the OPs thread. Hopefully some of the discussion has provided them with useful background information. To summarize:
-secondary school age children can readily attend Catholic schools, elementary age may or may not depending on the board and how many hoops you have to jump through to get permission.
-Buying a house in the GTA is a nightmare.
-Check out any commute that you may be considering at the time you will be commuting as some routes are unbelievably congested.
-secondary school age children can readily attend Catholic schools, elementary age may or may not depending on the board and how many hoops you have to jump through to get permission.
-Buying a house in the GTA is a nightmare.
-Check out any commute that you may be considering at the time you will be commuting as some routes are unbelievably congested.
Last edited by HGerchikov; Feb 14th 2017 at 4:15 pm.