step up/down transformer
 

hi everyone, I am moving to Newfoundland in November. Apart from a couple of items which are dual voltage, I am leaving my electrical stuff behind. However I am considering bringing my sewing machine- for occasional use only. I have been reading around step up/down transformers etc. My machine is 220-240 voltage, 50 Hz and 50 W.

I understand the bit about changing from 220-240 to 110, and think I will need a 100 Watt transformer, but I'm a bit confused about the 50 Hz bit!

Basically has anyone brought a sewing machine from the Uk and successfully used it in Canada?

Also do I need to buy the transformer in Canada, or here in the UK and put it in the container which is heading off in 2 weeks.

Any advice would be much appreciated

kind regards
Shirley

Re: step up/down transformer
 

50Hz sewing maching should be OK with a 110-220v Transformer.

Purchase one when you get here

In the following thread

http://britishexpats.com/forum/canad...ooster-881051/

Re: step up/down transformer
 

North American mains is 60Hz, so depending on the motor, it might not run at the right speed.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I bought my Transformer in Canada from Amazon, It was $100 and took less than a week to arrive, it is about the size of a shoe box. I have more than returned the outlay, as my Dyson Vacuum works in Canada and they cost a small fortune to buy new here.

The thread that not2old pointed out is my thread about just this matter.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

hi guys thanks for the very helpful information, and links in referenced thread. It can be bewildering when trying to weigh up the cost of replacing items while trying to ensure I don't blow up our home in Canada. We are heading over for a familiarisation visit in 2-3 weeks to get practical stuff organised, in advance of our final move, so i'm sure I will be back with more questions!

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I have a transformer sitting unused right now. Used it for some hi-fi gear and other stuff that wouldn't run here.

Yours if you want it. (I'm in St. John's)

WeeGem

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Some of the advice in the linked thread is not terribly clear, but it's sound nonetheless. For your sewing machine, don't let the 50Hz/60Hz thing worry you. In other cases, the recommendation is usually not to bother bringing over stuff that has a motor that needs to run at a particular speed (it'll run 20% too fast and likely burn out sooner) or a heating element (it will draw a hefty current and require a big and expensive transformer to be effective). But since a sewing machine has a variable speed motor controlled by the foot pedal, you'll be able to run it at the required speed by being a bit lighter on the pedal - and when you're stitching a long straight seam the flat-out speed will feed the fabric through a little bit quicker! We have a UK sewing machine that gets plugged in through a transformer and it has worked perfectly well for a decade.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

hi Wee Gem that's very much appreciated, and nice to 'meet' another expat when I move to St John's. I'm moving over mid November and would be happy to try yours out

Re: step up/down transformer
 

hi Oakvillan, this is music to my ears. I had really debated with myself whether to leave it behind and buy another, but just couldn't justify the cost of my loss here in the UK, combined with the replacement costs for an occasional use item, compared with the essentials we will need. That's helpful re foot speed, and I hope I get 10 years from mine too!

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I could have almost written this myself, we shipped a setup/set down with us for my Dyson as I was not giving it up & replacing it over here was not a reality with the prices they charge.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

thanks jukebox widow- useful to know that my machine will be viable. It's good we can take these things rather than paying a fortune for replacement!!

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I don't respond on here much but I wasn't leaving the UK without my 3 sewing machines. The sewing machine store sold me the the step-up step-down transformer and it's worked fine for me for the past 12 years. Having a sewing business I use them all the time.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

It will run fine. You may find it runs either a little faster or a little slower (if the synchronous speed is exceeded). In all likelihood it won't be that noticeable.

The only thing you need to be careful with due to the change in frequency is either sensitive electronic devices or larger motors greater than around 3kW.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

But at 3Kw they are at or above the upper limit of what it is safe to plug into a standard domestic socket in either the UK or North America. I have never seen anything rated at more than 3kw/12.5A in the UK, and in North America most domestic circuits are only rated for 1,800w/15A, and appliances drawing over 12A are rare. 20A circuits have a slightly different socket and accept a different plug that won't fit into a typical socket.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

For reference....

Looked on line at the UK Argos catalog store in the UK & indeed they sell 3Kw (3000watts) electric kettles for domestic household use. Breville was the one brand that is 3000 watts.

Now I know why my sisters kettle boils water so fast

In the UK, take the 3Kw/240Volts, is approx 12.5amps, which is pushing the upper limit of a conventional 13 amp house socket

Looked & could not find any sewing machines rated at 3000 watts - something lon average 100watts, with load, I'm guessing ~300watts.

Mind you the price of some of the fancy computerized sewing machines range £2000 - £6000 in price

For the OP, you may want to check the power rating of your machines to make sure they wont exceed the approx 1800 watts Pulaski posted on above, also that if they are computerized you may want to check with the manufacturer to see if the software will work without issues or will there be any issues for any reason over this side of the pond

As well as if service & parts for your machines is available here in Canada


.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I'll be curious to find out how you get on with the Newfie dialect, and if coming from NI will mean you can understand the hard bits. Some of their speech is impossible for outsiders to decipher.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Thanks very much everyone for your help

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Just buy a transformer. Believe me, almost EVERYTHING will work. For some things, maybe the Hz thingy might be a bit different, but unless you're running some sort of life enhancing gizmo, in my experience it really doesn't matter.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Hi Shirley,

My Family and I plan to move to Ontario in the New Year. We are also from Northern Ireland. Perhaps we could share our experiences to date as it is a very daunting process.
The chat would be interesting if nothing else.

Thanks

Farmboy

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Happy to chat!- feel free to PM me
Shirley

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Honestly transformers are such a faff you're better off buying new stuff imx. I've got a whole shelf full of those transformers for things I brought over from the UK and hardly use, e.g. paper shredder. I use them with drills as well and yes they do rotate at a different speed, not exactly a big problem though, just use a different setting.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

As a kettle is just a fixed resistive element (R) it willwork in Canada , it’ll just take a little longer to boil as the current will belower due to the lower voltage
If any care to post up the resistance of a Canadian kettle,I’m quite will to take a measurement of one here, I’m betting there’s not much difference
Interestingly I used an Old Dyson DC02, for an experimentyears ago I ran it on just 120v/60hz andit still out performed a traditional bag type cleaner J

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I had an interesting chat with my house inspector about the voltages. This is all subject to further research and confirmation:

He explained that voltages are 240V coming to the house in two live lines, and that only one live line is generally used inside the house. There are two common exceptions, electric cookers/ranges and driers which run on the full 240V!

So in theory, a qualified electrician should have no trouble running additional 240V sockets with full British sockets.

However, thinking about it more, there is a difference in frequency, 60Hz over 50Hz, so something won't be happy I bet!

Re: step up/down transformer
 

That is entirely correct, and is the reason that the breakers in the breaker box (like a fuse box) are lined up in two columns (you should have roughly the same number of breakers on each side) as one of the 120v wires feeds each of the columns, and so anything that requires 240v has a double-width breaker that taps into both of the 120v supplies.

The wiring for a 240v socket in North America though is quite unlike 240v wiring in the UK because in the UK all 240v is in one wire, whereas in North America you need two wires each of 120v to get a 240v socket. ..... So you (ideally) need four wires - two lives, a neutral and an earth, though it used to be acceptable to use two lives and a neutral for clothes dryers, with the ground (if any) connected to the neutral. .... So you are unlikely to be able to just swap out 120v sockets for 240v sockets (they're much bigger anyway), because the existing wire only has one live core. I have heard that some sockets have two lives wires - one connected to each half of a double socket, but I have never seen one installed.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

We're in the Philippines where our supply is, supposedly, 220V at 60Hz. I say suuposedly as it is a bit variable!! My wife brought her 5 sewing machines/ overlockers here and they all run perfectly , even the computerised one. Our only problem is they are all Janome and getting service here is difficult as the Janome agent is useless! However, I ship spare parts from UK and the computerised one goes to Singapore every 2 years for a full service. The 50/60Hz thing is not a problem for most items except for the speed - so if you have a speed dependent device it will run faster. We also have a few items brought from Canada, so 110V, but they all work fine on a step DOWN transformer. Oh, two of the sewing machines have 110/240v 50/60Hz brick power supplies so no problem other than changing the plugs!:lol:

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Pulaski's post #24 is correct to heed a warning...the 240VAC supply in USA/Canada is different to that in UK and could be dangerous to simply connect a UK appliance to this source....

The Canadian 3-wire 240VAC is supplied as two 120VAC live wires and one safety ground. The neutral is the phasing shift between the two live wires.

Therefore, it will NOT supply a UK 240VAC appliance without some serious re-wire as the internals of these appliances are wired for one live 240VAC, one neutral and one safety ground.

A transformer will work as its 240VAC output conforms to the UK 3 wire system.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Are you sure? The wiring for 240v that I am used to seeing in the US has either four wires (two lives, a neutral, and a ground) or three wires (two lives and a neutral, with NO ground - IIRC this became obsolete in 1994).

If you are correct then the difference only in presentation, because the neutral and the ground are identical any way, as both are at ground potential.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

You are correct in that a 3 wire 240VAC neutral is also grounded...but it is considered neutral as it completes the circuit to the centre tap of the grid split-phase transformer that sources the 240VAC and the 120VAC simultaneously. If the third wire just went to ground it would not allow the 120VAC to be used...that's why it is recognized as a neutral. i.e. return circuit wire to the center-tap.

I thought the 4 wire system was gradually phased out...I had those plugs in my own house but that was from 30 years ago. My understanding is they used 2 phases of a 3 phase distribution system....but I'm not sure.

Copy from internet...
"First we do not use a 2 phase system, that proved ineffective years ago or maybe it was politics.... What we use in residential is a transformer with a secondary of 240 volts single phase center-tapped step down type. Primary voltage is generally around 2.4 KV to 7.2 KV from a 3 phase source. This allows us to serve both 120 volt loads and 240 volt loads. So our systems for single family dwellings are actually 120/240 volt single phase 3 wire sometimes called the edison system."

Re: step up/down transformer
 

The subtle difference is that the neutral conductor is intended to carry a current during normal usage. In UK wiring code it's treated the same as a live conductor. The ground isn't and can in some cases be bare- and is also directly connected to the casing.

Because a UK-spec neutral is treated as a live you should get away with connecting it to one leg of a 120V system to yield a net 240V. I'm just deeply unhappy with people blithely doing it without understanding exactly what they've done.



On that quote, you do sometimes see 208V single phase here, which I'd think of as two-phase, ie two legs of a 3phase 208 supply connected to a motor or somesuch. Conceptually it horrifies me but the continent hasn't burnt down yet so I guess in practise it works.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

That is exactly my understanding.
I understand that to be correct, but have never done so myself.
I agree 110% with this!

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I was considering this to run a 240V soldering iron, comforted by the fact that the iron would be supervised in use (IE never left on) and would only be used by me. The plan was kaiboshed because a spare dryer plug- which I was going to swap onto the lead in place of the 13amp one- cost over $30, more than a new soldering iron (albeit a small electronics one) on sale at crappy tire (think that was under $10)

Re: step up/down transformer
 

I can see that swopping the soldering iron plug to fit the US 240VAC dryer outlet would work, as it is a simple resistor circuit but...if a UK dryer's plug was similarly swopped .....would the UK dryer motor work?

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Yes, as people have reported in this thread, you put a delta of 240V across a motor and it runs, albeit 20% faster than intended due to the frequency.

The fact that the system was designed to have 240V/0V across it rather than +120V/-120v (excuse the simplification of AC there) is why I'd never recommend anyone do this at home.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Doesn't a delta connection require three-phases?

Re: step up/down transformer
 

In this context I used Delta to mean differential; a voltage is always a differential. But don't get me started or I'll drift on to non-zero ground bonding.

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Thanks Pizza...my question about the motor was rhetorical as I know it cannot be done by simply swopping the plug, and using the 240VAC split-system, as it can with a soldering iron or a kettle.

Therefore, I think we are in agreement with my response to Weve's post #23 where I suggested simply wiring his house from the N. American 240VAC system to enable using UK appliances, was a non-viable, and possibly dangerous, idea.

btw...trying to get a 240VAC kettle to steam using 120VAC, as someone suggested, seems to me like watching paint dry...:lol:

Re: step up/down transformer
 

On the last part do the math...
if R is fixed and V is reduced by 1/2 then I is 1/4


for a 3kw in the UK we can fairly assume a resistance of 20ohms
the same kettle on 120v would function at approx. 750watt


allowing for the same amount of energy required to boil and losses being insignificant then it would take 4 times longer to boil the same kettle




isn't it interesting that most kettles in the US/Canada are around 1kw so a UK 3kw unit would only take 25% longer to boil than a local unit

Re: step up/down transformer
 

FWIW


I have run several units on the US/Canadian twin phase 240v without issue

Mainly resistive (kettles/soldering irons/heater)but some inductive (drills)without any issues

I had a garage/workshop wired for both 120v and 240v with a couple of 250v 3 pin sockets (two live one earth> two horizontal pins one round earth) -'-

Never bothered trying a switch mode unit as most could handle the 120v's

Re: step up/down transformer
 

That's why I sarcastically suggested if waiting for a UK kettle (240VAC) to boil on 120VAC it would be like watching paint dry....I understand the math.

Are you saying you used a UK 240VAC drill on the edison split 240VAC system or the 4 wire twin-phase system.....or a Canadian 240VAC drill?

Re: step up/down transformer
 

Clear not on the maths front, 25% longer isn't waiting for paint to dry
Uk Kettle ~20ohm CAN kettle ~14ohms


UK Black and Decker on CAN 250Vac at 60HZ