REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Oct 4th 2009, 8:47 pm
#31
50 and wanting to go back
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Bradford uk
Posts: 280
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Sorry to hear that your house is causing you so many problems, I cant believe the owners have been so terrible and not telling you the truth. I guess they will have relied on the fact that you were up to speed on how things work. Fingers crossed that when you put the house on the market you get a buyer quickly. How long was your house on the mortgage when you bought it?
if you mean our mortgage, we dont have one.
Oct 4th 2009, 10:03 pm
#33
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Why was it a cheap jibe? The first two sentences are facts. I don't know of anyone, even realtors, that would recommend using a realtor over a lawyer for legal advice.
Of course market conditions dictate, but the standard purchase contract in Alberta is so slanted in favour of the vendor that any realtor worth their salt should not be advising their clients to use it and, in the usual course, the buyer sends this contract to the vendor with an offer. It's a little late in the day for the buyer's realtor to then say the contract is unfair.
IMHO a lawyer should always be used before any contract for the purchase of a home is made - do you know of any realtors that recommend such a course of action to their clients, or at least advise their clients that no representations other than those in the written contract can be relied upon?
Stewart, this is not a particular dig at you, but your suggestion that disclosure will have to be made by the OP when they sell the property is diametrically opposed to what the standard purchase contracts used by realtors states. Again, realtors don't apear to understand their own contracts but are, usually, happy to advise their clients that lawyers aren't necessary. This is the reason why I have contempt for realtors. I have had to deal with the aftermath of such negligence too many times to honestly believe that realtors have sufficient legal knowledge to be representing their clients in a competent fashion.
Of course market conditions dictate, but the standard purchase contract in Alberta is so slanted in favour of the vendor that any realtor worth their salt should not be advising their clients to use it and, in the usual course, the buyer sends this contract to the vendor with an offer. It's a little late in the day for the buyer's realtor to then say the contract is unfair.
IMHO a lawyer should always be used before any contract for the purchase of a home is made - do you know of any realtors that recommend such a course of action to their clients, or at least advise their clients that no representations other than those in the written contract can be relied upon?
Stewart, this is not a particular dig at you, but your suggestion that disclosure will have to be made by the OP when they sell the property is diametrically opposed to what the standard purchase contracts used by realtors states. Again, realtors don't apear to understand their own contracts but are, usually, happy to advise their clients that lawyers aren't necessary. This is the reason why I have contempt for realtors. I have had to deal with the aftermath of such negligence too many times to honestly believe that realtors have sufficient legal knowledge to be representing their clients in a competent fashion.
I get where your coming from, but one of the biggest problems the Real Estate Agents complain about with the lawyer getting involved at the "front end" of the negotiations is that in the lawyers (understandable) interest to protect their client from every conceivable problem(s), is that the deal is killed, as the the other party throws up their hands and moves onto the next buyer or seller who is not so fussy.
To get a deal done often involves compromise(s) from both parties, lawyers invariably "muddy" the waters. My snip at lawyers is that they take something that is "black & white" and turn it into "shades of grey"
.I frequently add "subject to buyers lawyers approval etc" to a contract when I am the buyers agent. I have never had a lawyer turn down, or even amend, one of my contracts.
I agree with you that the system has loads of flaws, the good thing is that the Real Estate Boards are moving in the right direction especially with separating the role of Buyers & Sellers Agents. There is now better training for the Buyers Agent, but there is a long way still to go, and many court cases will be brought against well meaning, but negligent, Buyers Agents before the education and training standards are raised to where they should be.
Oct 4th 2009, 10:13 pm
#34
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
NO property is without some problem(s), the correct approach to the house purchase will at least lessen the chances of a nasty surprise.
Oct 4th 2009, 11:13 pm
#35
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Oct 4th 2009, 11:20 pm
#36
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Sorry to hear that your house is causing you so many problems, I cant believe the owners have been so terrible and not telling you the truth. I guess they will have relied on the fact that you were up to speed on how things work. Fingers crossed that when you put the house on the market you get a buyer quickly. How long was your house on the mortgage when you bought it?
Buyer Beware is built into the laws of most Provinces, and its good to understand that, before you buy anything, especially a house, in most of Canada. The Consumer Protection laws are way behind the UK in most provinces.
Oct 5th 2009, 1:27 am
#37
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,830
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Holmes, of Holmes on Holmes fame, is very dismissive of House Inspectors, but if you use them as the first line of investigation, and then pull in other professionals as required, then at least you know what you are buying. This should all be completed prior to the house purchase.
NO property is without some problem(s), the correct approach to the house purchase will at least lessen the chances of a nasty surprise.
NO property is without some problem(s), the correct approach to the house purchase will at least lessen the chances of a nasty surprise.
I would never use one again.
Oct 5th 2009, 12:20 pm
#38
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
http://www.cahpi.ca/index.php?lang=en
Its not perfect, but its the best there is.
Oct 16th 2009, 1:01 am
#39
50 and wanting to go back
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Bradford uk
Posts: 280
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
I recommend that people use a qualified inspector from:
http://www.cahpi.ca/index.php?lang=en
Its not perfect, but its the best there is.
http://www.cahpi.ca/index.php?lang=en
Its not perfect, but its the best there is.
Once we sign the acceptance offer document, which gives move date and price, which is also subject to buyers securing finance, insurance and inspection. Am i right in thinking if we pull out of the deal before the buyer is satisfied, we have to pay the 5% sales commision to the buyer and seller representatives.
Oct 16th 2009, 1:10 am
#40
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,375
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Quick question, if you please
Once we sign the acceptance offer document, which gives move date and price, which is also subject to buyers securing finance, insurance and inspection. Am i right in thinking if we pull out of the deal before the buyer is satisfied, we have to pay the 5% sales commision to the buyer and seller representatives.
Once we sign the acceptance offer document, which gives move date and price, which is also subject to buyers securing finance, insurance and inspection. Am i right in thinking if we pull out of the deal before the buyer is satisfied, we have to pay the 5% sales commision to the buyer and seller representatives.
You would be sued for breach of contract and the damages that you would have to pay would be subject to the normal rules of foreseeability and remoteness. i.e. if, to purchase a similar house, the purchasers have to pay $1000s more and have to incur legal fees, storage fees, removal fees etc, you will be on the hook for all of that, subject to their duty to mitigate their loss.
All you can hope for is that the purchasers cannot remove the conditions before the date to do so expires. Don't offer them any extensions, keep quite and hope the date passes, then you are free to walk.
Your above post sounds like you are the vendor, I thought you were the purchaser?
Oct 16th 2009, 2:08 am
#41
50 and wanting to go back
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Bradford uk
Posts: 280
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
You would be sued for breach of contract and the damages that you would have to pay would be subject to the normal rules of foreseeability and remoteness. i.e. if, to purchase a similar house, the purchasers have to pay $1000s more and have to incur legal fees, storage fees, removal fees etc, you will be on the hook for all of that, subject to their duty to mitigate their loss.
All you can hope for is that the purchasers cannot remove the conditions before the date to do so expires. Don't offer them any extensions, keep quite and hope the date passes, then you are free to walk.
Your above post sounds like you are the vendor, I thought you were the purchaser?
All you can hope for is that the purchasers cannot remove the conditions before the date to do so expires. Don't offer them any extensions, keep quite and hope the date passes, then you are free to walk.
Your above post sounds like you are the vendor, I thought you were the purchaser?
Oct 16th 2009, 2:38 am
#42
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 12,830
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
Backing out once you have a signed contract could cost you a bundle!
Oct 16th 2009, 11:40 am
#43
50 and wanting to go back
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2007
Location: Bradford uk
Posts: 280
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
You would be sued for breach of contract and the damages that you would have to pay would be subject to the normal rules of foreseeability and remoteness. i.e. if, to purchase a similar house, the purchasers have to pay $1000s more and have to incur legal fees, storage fees, removal fees etc, you will be on the hook for all of that, subject to their duty to mitigate their loss.
All you can hope for is that the purchasers cannot remove the conditions before the date to do so expires. Don't offer them any extensions, keep quite and hope the date passes, then you are free to walk.
Your above post sounds like you are the vendor, I thought you were the purchaser?
All you can hope for is that the purchasers cannot remove the conditions before the date to do so expires. Don't offer them any extensions, keep quite and hope the date passes, then you are free to walk.
Your above post sounds like you are the vendor, I thought you were the purchaser?
Oct 16th 2009, 12:30 pm
#44
RETIRED Realtor
Joined: Aug 2006
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 2,087
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
If you have had a change of heart and really don't want to sell, you could always try the truth approach.
Tell everyone involved that you would prefer not to sell and why, they may just let the deal die. It would be nice if you offered to cover everyones out of pocket expenses at the same time.
Oct 16th 2009, 1:22 pm
#45
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,375
Re: REAL ESTATE PROTECTION
I am totally confused
It sounds like the purchaser has put conditions on their offer, which you have accepted. If those conditions are not removed by the purchaser by the deadlines set out, the contract expires and you can do what you want to. If the purchaser removes those conditions within the time allowed, the contract is valid and, if you do not comply with the terms of the contract, you may be sued for breach of contract.
As Stewart has said, it may be worth you trying to negotiate a release of your obligations under the contract with your purchasers but, if they feel that they are unlikely to be able to obtain a similar property for a similar price, they are unlikely to want to do this.
It sounds like the purchaser has put conditions on their offer, which you have accepted. If those conditions are not removed by the purchaser by the deadlines set out, the contract expires and you can do what you want to. If the purchaser removes those conditions within the time allowed, the contract is valid and, if you do not comply with the terms of the contract, you may be sued for breach of contract.
As Stewart has said, it may be worth you trying to negotiate a release of your obligations under the contract with your purchasers but, if they feel that they are unlikely to be able to obtain a similar property for a similar price, they are unlikely to want to do this.