I've had two Caravans and two Villagers. I've driven a Windstar and a Grand Caravan. The ordinary Caravans were ok but, by the end of the leases (3 years) they were pretty much finished. I thought the Windstar awkward and cumbersome both to drive and when dealing with the seats. I thought the Grand Caravan, when loaded, to be unsafe. I won't drive one of those again.
The Villagers (really Nissan Quests) were pretty good except for eating the front brakes but they stopped making them so we started on SUVs instead.

If I had the money to maintain a Honda I'd get a Ferrari instead. The running and insurance costs (if insured in Canada) for the Element are absurd.

I have a friend with a large family and an Odyssey, and he swears by it. All the other people I know with minivans just swear at them.

Its a lot of weight to be stopping and starting all the time, so Im not surprised there are a few mechanical issues to report. Windstar transmissions were spectacularly poor, and you arent wrong about the driving experience!

Thanks

Out of interest why did the Grand Caravan feel "unsafe" when loaded ?

It has a long overhang at the bag and that's the only place to put large or heavy objects. The one I drove was rented and we were in the mountains in Arizona; at every turn the back lunged for the cliff. Really quite frightening.

Why have decided on the new 7 Seater Sante Fe SUV instead of a van to get the best of both worlds with 4 wheel drive and good load space. From what I have heard they are excellent value for money and far better than the old Hyundai's.

Nooooooooo

Don't throw SUVs into the frame !! I thought I had this fairly well worked out

Ah well, back to the drawing board

Right then, anyone recommend any SUVs for a family with 3 kids and two large dogs hell bent on going out and about in the wilderness regularly and with a father hell bent on lugging large items around fairly regularly

I wouldn't think 4wd to be an advantage in Canada. I had an Explorer, a Sidekick, a Vitara, two Escapes and the Element, each for multiple years without using the 4wd. It's just more expense for nothing in particular. If you were in Chelsea, where people notice you have a 4x4, then fair enough but it's nothing special here.

I can tell you how easy it is to drive, but as for fuel consumption - I'd have to consult the Oracle, but he's at work at the moment! He hankers after a pick-up but he won't get one because the fuel consumption isn't nearly as good; I can let you know later, unless someone else comes up with it first. I like the Montana cos I feel less intimidated by the huge trucks - probably something to do with being higher off the ground; being in a car feels really scary to me now. One thing about the seats - you do need somewhere to store them...garage or basement.

Have a look at www.lemonaidcars.com The Oracle always has a look at the current book when he's thinking of changing vehicles.....

Nope, there are no advantages and several disadvantages for SUV ownership, unless you intend to tow something pretty heavy. Its all hype and image. I wont bore you with the details here, theres plenty of educational sites out there to google for.

The intimidation thing is real, when I first arrived I got a Jeep Cherokee for just that reason, to be higher up and feel less likely to be squished. After two years of ~20 MPG, poor handling and harsh ride I went for a Subaru... I figured it was far better after all to be able to stop quickly and steer around trouble with a lower center of gravity, and actually have a smooth ride and reasonable economy too, but perhaps by then I had acclimatised to the larger size of everything over here. It was also way more enjoyable to drive too.

AWD is a help some of the time, at least it is where I live outside the city, but tire selection in the winter is probably more important then having 4x4 or AWD capability unless you intend doing some serious off roading, in which case a vehicle specifically for that like a jeep YJ/TJ/Wrangler would make way more sense than any SUV anyway.

And, if you do want to tow something heavy, you really need a pick up so you have the option of using a gooseneck.

True, but that makes fitting 3 kids and two large dogs in a bit tricky, unless you put one or other group back in the bed, which is probably no fun in February and very likely illegal in most jurisdictions.

I got a ride in a courtesy one the other week - seemed okay, not as nice as the Sorento inside but okay (for a minivan). I think there's a big promo on DVD player for back seats as standard at the mo if that floats your boat...

My Kia days are numbered, gutted! We're moving to Windsor soon and that sort of thing doesn't go down well there. Not good for Mr B to have one of those parked outside his surgery. Just trying to figure out which of the big 3 has the least terrible vehicle for us. Or if the locals will accept a Land Rover being part of the Ford family?!

Winnipeg, Windsor, you see some all the tourist spots.

Indeed. We have need of space for one "child" and one large dog so, when the dust settles, we'll turn the Element into a F150 with the super cab (super being the smaller of the bigger ones). It wouldn't work for more bodies though, that calls for a minivan.

<smiles at having outgrown the need for a minivan>

as far as the winter capability goes...Toyota Sienna offers an all-wheel drive version. From 2004 on they have a 60/40 stowable seat in the rear and removeable buckets in the middle (or three seats in the middle with the 8 passanger option) The drawback to the all-wheel drive is run-flat tires. No room for a spare anywhere, so they opted for run-flats.

Chrysler has dropped all-wheel drive due to the stow and go seats (the middle stowable seats eliminate room for the all-wheel drive transfer case).