sonnyjames

Hi, newbie asking the usual old question, so I'll try and be a bit specific!

Work are offering me the opportunity to move to Toronto next year - initially on a two year secondment but if the move works out then we're likely to stay longer.

My wife and I don't have children (I'm early 30s, she's late 20s) and are moving from a countryside area in the UK (I lived in London for a number of years but prefer the country, as does my wife). That said, we're not totally opposed to spending some time living 'in' the city while we get to know the place, but would prefer (in this post, at least!) to focus on areas that are outside the city and more likely to appeal to us.

So, the specifics...

- We'll be renting, to start with, while we get a feel for the country and area
- My office is literally a two mins walk from Union Station (my wife would be on an open work visa but won't have a job when we arrive)
- My commute in the UK is under an hour; I want to keep it that way (inc walk / bus to the train station)!
- We live in small village in the Kent countryside right now and while we don't mind moving to a larger neighbourhood, we'd quite like to have a bit of a country feel
- My wife would love to be near the water - but that's not make or break (nice to have)
- We're looking for a 3 or 4 bed place
- Would prefer not to be right on top of a highway
- We have no preference as to north, east or west of Toronto.
- I'm working to a rough budget of $2,500CAD per month, but with a LITTLE bit of flex

If I think of more I'll add them! Alternatively, feel free to chuck further questions at me!

Really appreciate any advice that the good folks on here could give. Appreciate the GTA might not be for everyone but we like what we've seen on visits and this would be the start of potentially a new life for us in Canada, so we're not tying ourselves to ALWAYS living in GTA, just making our start there.

Thanks to all in advance

Dave n Ailsa

Hey, welcome to the forum.

We are in the early stages of visa application, and will be heading to the GTA, preferably Burlington/Hamilton area.

I think your budget might be a little on the low side, even without kids. In comparison, we are budgeting for around $4000 p/m

But then it depends how handy you are, and if you can save money by doing some things yourself (car, house diy)

Also depends on your lifestyle, drinking, eating out etc.

Obviously I'm not over there yet, so it's hard for me to give you a realistic view. The guys that are over there are still in bed, they'll give you better advice after they've had their breakfast

The main thing they are going to throw at you is, will you be better or worse off if you come to Canada, be prepared for some raosting, lol.

Dave.

sonnyjames

Hey Dave, thanks for your reply and good luck with your application!

The budget I mentioned is purely for rent of the house, rather than what we'll be living on every month, should have been clearer!

We've done a lot of thinking on the better / worse off point...realistically we don't think we'll be ANY worse off (and hopefully better off) but we're young enough to turn around and go home if it doesn't work out, and it is only a secondment to start with. And if you never try these things...!

Cheers.

Zap0ne

Hi,

Your expectations might be a little bit difficult. Less then an hours commute is unlikely to get you into the countryside of Ontario unless you can get your hands on a nice helicopter for the ride.

Take a look at the GO transit routes and schedule. This will give you a good idea of how, and where you might realistically commute from (also the cost to commute which is a budget factor).

http://www.gotransit.com/publicroot/en/default.aspx

A second consideration is the availability of property for rent. You may find that the choice is a bit limited as investors do not tend to purchase property that they intend to rent out in rural areas. They generally prefer areas of high density whereby demand is greater for a good return.

We live in a snow country and unlike Kent, it sticks around for a long time. Freezing temperatures can last for weeks and security of water and not getting snowed into your rural retreat is a real concern. Isolation can also be a factor especially in a winter commute. Taking work and commuting time into consideration, the face to face time with each other could be as low as 4 hours a day in the week.

You might want to consider embracing the city. There are many eclectic neighbourhoods around the city that provide a good location to commute into the downtown that you might want to consider.

Deeny

Hi,

When we were on a recce earlier this year my husband met quite a few contacts, many of them live in Burlington and Oakville. All of them were prepared to do the commute in order to get more property for their money, and all were very happy with their choice. Burlington in particular came very highly recommended.

Do a Wiki search on Oakville/ Burlington / Hamilton; there have been several
threads on all. There are a few BE members in that area and they hold meet ups, maybe some of them will be along soon to give you some advice.

On the East side, Pickering and Whitby seem to be popular, but I have been told they are more blue collar towns, I don't have a problem with that but some folk may.

We have considered all of the above but my husband is sick of a long commute so we will heading for the inner suburbs.

I wish you well...exciting times ahead.

club_biscuit

none of oakville, burlington, hamilton, pickering or whitby are rural or "in the country" by any stretch of the imagination. you can (sometimes) get more for your purchase cash in these areas, but not always for your rental cash. and to be perfectly honest, I can't imagine why a young(ish!) couple without kids would want to live in a mini-city and commute all that way to work. It'd be like moving to manhattan and renting in new jersey....an odd choice.

Roy's given you good advice above with respect to things to consider about living in the country when you've never experienced an Ontario winter outside the city. You might want to check in with him about what's available rent or purchase-wise, or his experience with expats who have come over into these different living situations - he's got a lot of experience and has been a great resource for many of us for years now (thanks Roy!)

Just my thoughts, for whatever they're worth. Good luck to you regardless!

Maria_747

I lived in Brampton, in the GTA, I hated it, it was dull and boring with a diabolical bus transit system, stay clear of it. Mississauga is a better option with better public transport links.
Depending on your work place (if you work in the city), its better to be on the end of the subway line like Finch or Kipling.

lmartin999

Stay in the UK

MarylandNed

Agree with the above post.

I think the most important thing is to be able to get to and from work easily and take some time to get familiar with the GTA. Renting an apartment might make more sense especially as there's only two of you and you have no kids. I would suggest Yonge/Eglinton or The Beaches.

MarylandNed

Yeah I lived in Brampton too for a while. Not a very interesting or exciting place that's for sure. However, I was in the Heart Lake area of Brampton and it was OK. We had 2 young kids at the time and could walk to the park - in fact we backed onto a great green space. There was also a really good British pub within walking distance on Sandlewood Parkway that showed English footie. I wouldn't want to commute from Brampton to downtown Toronto but I was able to drive 20 mins to my job in Mississauga.

Lychee

You simply cannot replicate the lifestyle you currently have in Canada. I think that if you were to attempt to replicate it, you'd be highly disappointed in your choice. As a result, I too would opt for embracing the city and rent an apartment in an interesting neighbourhood and consider it as a new experience. Toronto is the most industrialized/developed/urbanized region of Canada. Live in the heart of the city and spend your weekends exploring the rural bits before moving out to them. You'll realize there is no equivalent to UK village life or UK countryside here.

dbd33

I've lived:

- in Toronto proper

- in an inner suburb, the Beach

- in an outer suburb, Mississauga

- in the country, commuting by car, also by car and train combination.

If I were starting out, as described, I'd stay in Toronto to begin with, walk to work, get the measure of the place. There are very many apartments available to rent within walking distance of Union and I'd get one of those, ideally around the market, maybe looking as far up as Cabbagetown. A central location is best for exploring other options and defers the need for a car.

sonnyjames

Many thanks to all for the suggestions so far, all very helpful.

We're not really looking for a village or rural lifestyle, just some of the 'greenness' and space that those types of areas afford, which you don't get in the built up centre of a city. As I said in my original post tho, we're quite open to giving the city a go to start with while we get our bearings (as a few of you have suggested) and that may well be what we end up doing (it would certainly be easiest).

I guess what I was trying to get a feel for was whether there were any areas close enough (i.e. within an hour's commute) that would perhaps feel maybe more like 'town' rather than 'city' living. We're certainly not looking to replicate what we have now (we may as well stay here, if that were the case!) but we know from experience that we prefer to be slightly out of the city centre and would prefer a house to apartment style living. As I say, we're not discounting that as a short-term option when we first get there, we're just trying to get some views on alternative options that would be closer to the type of lifestyle we know we enjoy. But we're not expecting (or hoping - that would be boring!) to find *exactly* what we're looking for...the fun's in the finding out!

The Beach area is one that really appeals and Oakville seems to generally get a pretty good rap, plus possibly Markham. We also looked out towards the Bluffs, but I've heard other people give Scarborough a bit of a bashing? So that gives you an idea of the areas and distances we're really looking at, as possibilities and the kind of places that seem interesting to us.

So thanks again to all and please keep your thoughts and ideas coming - they're gratefully appreciated!

dbd33

Oakville means commuting by car or GO train, the Beach by streetcar, the Bluffs by car. I've no idea how one might get to Markham and anyway I don't speak the language. Each form of commuting has it's own issues but the more viable option there is the Beach as no car is required and there's no concern with the cost of parking it at work.

As far as the areas go, I'd characterise the knocks against them as:

Oakville, snobby below the QEW, suburban wasteland above. Long way from work, shopping, entertainment.
Beach, up itself, housing stock is old, often self-built, prone to subsidence and termites; expect drafts. Streetcars very slow, unreliable in winter.
Bluffs, houses prone to falling off the cliff. Some of the bars, especially the big plastic one on the south side of Kingston Rd. are a bit rough. Rest of Scarborough, except that string of mansions at the bottom of Vic Park, is properly rough; weekly shootings, that sort of thing.

Zap0ne

I was stuck at the point of trying to imagine Scarborough as a leafy lane or open green space

I think that you have cut a long story short dbd33 thanks