Lest we forget...
 

Given today’s date, I felt it might be appropriate to post the following which was passed on to me earlier...Like GB, Canada has many troops in such as Afghanistan. Both countries have suffered casualties and no doubt will suffer more...

Lest we Forget

Your cell phone is in your pocket.
He clutches the cross hanging on his chain next to his dog tags.

You talk trash about your 'buddies' that aren't with you.
He knows he may not see some of his buddies again.

You walk down the beach, staring at all the pretty girls.
He patrols the streets, searching for insurgents and terrorists.

You complain about how hot it is
He wears his heavy gear, not daring to take off his helmet to wipe his brow.

You go out to lunch, and complain because the restaurant got your order wrong.
He doesn't get to eat today.

Your maid makes your bed and washes your clothes.
He wears the same things for weeks, but makes sure his weapons are clean.

You go to the mall and get your hair redone.
He doesn't have time to brush his teeth today.

You're angry because your class ran 5 minutes over.
He's told he will be held over an extra 2 months.

You call your girlfriend and set a date for tonight.
He waits for the mail to see if there is a letter from home.

You hug and kiss your girlfriend, like you do everyday.
He holds his letter close and smells his love's perfume.

You roll your eyes as a baby cries.
He gets a letter with pictures of his new child, and wonders if they'll ever meet.

You criticize your government, and say that war never solves anything.
He sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he is fighting.

You hear the jokes about the war, and make fun of men like him.
He hears the gunfire, bombs and screams of the wounded.

You see only what the media wants you to see.
He sees the broken bodies lying around him.

You are asked to go to the store by your parents. You don't.
He does exactly what he is told even if it puts his life in danger.

You stay at home and watch TV.
He takes whatever time he is given to call, write home, sleep, and eat.

You crawl into your soft bed, with down pillows, and get comfortable.
He tries to sleep but gets woken by mortars and helicopters all night long.

REMEMBER our Troops, and do not forget them LATER!

Lest we forget -

Re: Lest we forget...
 

excellent thankyou

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Very well put = thanks

Re: Lest we forget...
 

I think it cheapens the sacrifice of conscripted soldiers fallen in defence of our countries to lump them together with members of a volunteer force engaged in a police action. It's a shabby political move to try and extend Remembrance Day to include members of the forces in Afghanistan.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Right on 'Q' dbd...I expected little else from you ......and I doubt anyone else did either...:(

Re: Lest we forget...
 

One strives to keep up a good standard in the face of opportunism. There is already perfectly adequate poetry for the day.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

And why shouldn't we remember them???

They are still out in those places putting you 1st and not themselves so that you may sleep well at night.

And whatever you believe about the why's and wherefores of them being in those places they are still there and should be remembered for it!!!

Re: Lest we forget...
 

They're not though. Firstly, they've chosen to join a paid army so they're not putting the public before themselves any more than someone who has chosen to be an accountant. It's a career choice. Secondly, invading Afghanistan is a project having nothing to do with the defence of the west, I'd be no more or less secure if Afghanistan were to be the 51st State.

It's cheap politicing to try to include them today, next you'll be wanting to include police, firemen and garbage collectors.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Maybe not the garbage collectors!!!

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Whatever...:cool:

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Today should indeed be a day of remembrance for all those killed and maimed in battle, wherever and whenever that was.

However, that's no excuse for the appalling doggerel posted above. "your maid makes your bed and washes your clothes," "he sees the innocent tortured and killed by their own people and remembers why he is fighting" - I guess this is aimed at rich American high school kids, but it's still unbelievably crass. As dbd said, there is already perfectly adequate poetry for the day. Might I suggest the following, written by Herbert Read (1893-1968), which makes a better attempt than most to describe the horrors of trench warfare from the perspective of a participant:

"The Happy Warrior"

His wild heart beats with painful sobs,
His strin'd hands clench an ice-cold rifle,
His aching jaws grip a hot parch'd tongue,
His wide eyes search unconsciously.

He cannot shriek.

Bloody saliva
Dribbles down his shapeless jacket.

I saw him stab
And stab again
A well-killed Boche.

This is the happy warrior,
This is he...

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of disappointed shells that dropped behind.

GAS! Gas! Quick, boys!-- An ecstasy of fumbling,
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And floundering like a man in fire or lime.--
Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,--
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Irrespective of poor spelling, or crassness, given that most UK and prob Canadian , US and other European children now won't have any "direct" link with the first world war and are often shielded from other conflicts, any method that helps them connect or "remember" should be applauded.

Indeed - Lest THEY forget!

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Whether you agree with them being there or not, those guys are still fighting for our freedom and protection, and you should be bloody thankful for that.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

As above, they're not. If they want to go and invade Afghanistan there's nothing I can do to stop them but it's not in any way related to the freedom and protection of the public in Canada. Indifference is more appropriate than gratitude.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

I think there is a very clear difference between the conscripts of WW1 and WW2 and the paid volunteer forces of today
For starters cowardice is not a death sentence anymore and people have a choice on joining
Everybody in Afghanistan and Iraq joined the military in peace time knowing the risk involved, they are not fighting for queen and country and to protect their loved ones, but a for political ideal and one that many do not agree with.

Ian E. Kaye is a good author of war time poetry, written from the perspective of the lads in the trenches
Not the arm chair heroes who are always so proud the wear their poppy
It’s annoying to listen to all the rhetoric about heroes when so many of those war graves are filed with teenage boys whose sole contribution to the war effort was cannon fodder for the generals
I’d suggest a long careful walk around a war graves site, before you choose to lump in todays professionals with the young conscripts of the world wars

Re: Lest we forget...
 

FFS At least make some effort, modernise it for the youth to understand.

"He done
a Johnny Foreigner.
Proper, innit".

R.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

The ramblings of those who have never experienced conflict or the tragedy of war. Whether by choice or by force, life is life.

Once you are in you go where you are told, like it or not. In 1982 the the line ups at the recruiting offices stretched down the street, men and women wanting to support Britain in a cause that some supported and others did not. Perhaps they did not reaslise what would have awaited them had time allowed. The military goes where it is sent, whether defending the homeland or helping others in need, persecuted by aggressors. What greater sacrifice can man make when they lay their life down for another.

Whatever, there are children today that don't have fathers, mothers who lost children. There are servicemen who continue to suffer the burden, physically and mentally.

Wars will never stop, there will continually be those who are willng to take the risk of the ultimate price so others may live and to help relieve suffering.

http://www.psywar.org/psywar/images/...s_memorial.jpg

http://www.lastpost.be/

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Is this a brief description of the rest of the post?

Re: Lest we forget...
 

They certainly won't stop if people allow themselves to be manipulated by cynical incompetent bastards like the 1982 Prime Minister of the UK.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

"Dulce et decorum est / Pro patria mori" ("It is sweet and noble to die for one's country")
What greater sacrifice can man make when they lay their life down for another
Wars will never stop, there will continually be those who are willing to take the risk of the ultimate price so others may live and to help relieve suffering.

This is the rhetoric of generals, politicians and religious leaders

The young and the naïve will believe it sign up and as was said “Once you are in you go where you are told, like it or not.”
Only then does the cannon fodder realise his real value and his own mortality

You need to grow up with the military, rather just be in it to see it for what it really is

Re: Lest we forget...
 

So what you're essentially saying there is that The Man is a co**s*cker ?

R.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

The words I want to write to describe your stupid comment, I can't on this forum!

In my final year of service with the Royal Air Force this year, I spent time at Headley Court (Look it up!). I was humbled to be in the presence of some of the bravest men and women I have ever had the privilege to meet, all of whom had returned form Helman Province or Basra. Despite their loss of limbs or severe head trauma, and all they had sacrificed for their (AND YOUR!!!) country, they remained loyal and proud to have served in the British Armed Forces. Their fallen friends were not so lucky to return home.

You can thank them and the thousands of people just like them who laid down their lives for idiots like you! Be it WWI, WWII or ANY of the many global conflicts since!!

Lest we forget…….

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Sounds serious. A lot more serious than you do.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

their governement..... not the same thing anymore

these wars are fought for politicans and their ideaologies, they have very little to do with protecting your or somebody elses country from hostile invasion,
at least the Falklands had that going for it....

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Oh come on everyone - I think the inital post was done in "good faith" given the date. Lets just . . .not forget . .

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Sorry...got to say it...

<snip>!!! :zzz:

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Feel free.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

but isn't that just the case so many things were done in "good faith"

Its the reasons why that count......

Re: Lest we forget...
 

No. WWI - conscripts who believed the old lie. WWII - conscripts who didn't believe it. Both wars fought in defence of my country. Since then, professional soldiers who took their chances in foreign adventures conducted for various reasons unrelated to the defence of the UK.

I'm sympathetic for their injuries but no more or less so than if they'd sustained them while driving a bus.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Words fail me, you make me sick!

Re: Lest we forget...
 

I'll tell you what, lets have no armed forces and let the terrorists run wild. You'd be the first one to complain if someone you knew got blown up by a terrorist bomb. Theyre there trying to make the world a safer place for idiots like you. God knows why.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

If they were actually doing that, then they and their governments wouldn't be invading sovereign nations and causing global havoc, indeed almost creating WW3 in the process, and religious rifts which will probably not end in my lifetime.

i.e. Iraq/Afghanistan - "not in my name".

You swallowed the red pill, it should have been the green pill.

R.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

There's no reason to suppose that if there were no troops in Afghanistan there would be terrorists running wild in the UK. Even if the troops were effective in combating terrorism it's what they've chosen to do, their claim on the gratitude of the public is a weak one compared with that of people conscripted to fight in a conventional war.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Sovereign nations who are in cahoots with Al Qaeda. What sort of sovereign nation is that? Yes, lets just lay down our arms and hope they don't come calling. Maybe we could shout at them or poke them with sticks.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

I don't see why you need be so melodramatic. I'm only expressing indifference to your occupation, I`m not saying you're doing something directly harmful to society in the manner of a crack dealer, lawyer or investment banker.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Or maybe we should enter into discussions with people who are willing to blow themselves up. I'm sure that would be hugely sucessful.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

No mate you are just telling the world what a <abuse> you are!

Re: Lest we forget...
 

Not sure which people you mean but, yes, that's how the war in Afghanistan will end. The Americans will negotiate a withdrawal.

Re: Lest we forget...
 

There's no call to be uncivil. You choose to make a living by invading foreign countries and hurting the inhabitants, I'd rather you didn't, but so long as it's legal I accept that there's nothing to be done about it. Asking for gratitude is a bit much though, like foxhunters asking the public for expressions of appreciation.