French immersion
#61
Odd. This wasn't the case with SD38 (Richmond). Maths was taught in English from 8-12. Electives (drama, music, art, home economics, etc.), Phys Ed, and English literature/language (obviously) taught in English. Sciences Humaines (social studies) and Sciences Naturels (Science) were taught in French from 8-10... possibly even until grade 11. Only Français langue (French language) gets taught in French (obviously) until grade 12.
I wonder if it varies from school district to school district? This chart shows that as the students progress through high school, French instruction decreases:
French Immersion Program - Public Schools
I wonder if it varies from school district to school district? This chart shows that as the students progress through high school, French instruction decreases:
French Immersion Program - Public Schools
#62
I can add an anecdote or two, as a parent of kids currently in a French Immersion elementary programme in Ontario.
I seem to have gone off one one - sorry!
TL;DR summary: there's nothing wrong with French Immersion, but it's no biggie if one's little darlings aren't in the programme
First, let's address the question of academic selection. I asked this question, explicitly, when looking at the options for #1 child at the end of kindergarten. I received what was obviously a prepared and rehearsed answer: while the FI programme is open to all, it is widely recognised to offer challenges that do not suit every learner. There is a tendency for the more academically-inclined to flourish within the programme, while there is equally a tendency for ESL kids, for example, to do better in the English-track programmes where they're not struggling to cope with instruction in a third language. What our local board, at least, is very keen to do is to build and maintain strong links between FI and English-track schools (where they are separate; in many the tuition is dual-track on the same physical site) and to give a thorough and honest review at the end of the early FI grades to assess whether pupils would actually do better in the English system. And to ensure that there is no stigma or perception of "failure" for doing so. I've mentioned on here before that one of our neighbours' kids was ushered into the English track after the end of Gr2, where she is now excelling. It makes it a little inconvenient for the parents, who now have children at two different local schools, but makes every kind of sense for kids who don't pick up languages easily.
Part of the process of integrating FI more fully into the school board has meant the removal of middle schools: in most districts in the Board area, elementary schools take kids all the way from JK to 8, or 1-8 for FI, then straight to high school for 9-12. There is a natural attrition in the FI system (people move away; it's more difficult for incoming kids to join the program after Gr1 if they haven't already had instruction in French, with the exception of a late entry program at Gr5 in some schools) that means year-group sizes tend to fall a bit as you go up through the school: this has meant more split-grade classes than I would have preferred to see, but it also has meant slightly lower average class sizes.
I was talking to the parents of a girl in Gr11 over the weekend. She attends the local high school which offers a huge variety of programmes, most of which are also taught within an FI stream - everything from an IB program (not all that common in public high schools hereabouts) to a very highly regarded series of vocational classes in the skilled trades. There is very little to choose between the English- and Immersion-track kids by the time they get to age 16-17, except that those who have received instruction in French are more likely (but by no means guaranteed) to have some degree of fluency and to be able to use either language to discuss what they're learning.
I'm happy for my kids to be in FI, but wouldn't sweat it if they weren't. My OH and I went through the form-filling process at the appropriate stage of the SK year, but otherwise have not been any more or less "pushy" than we would have been in any other situation. I think as somebody said up-thread, kids with the kind of family background (reasonably well educated & engaged parents, lots of reading materials in the house, encouragement and support of learning for its own sake) that are encouraged towards FI programmes where they're avaialble, are the kinds of kids who would likely do well in any learning environment.
I seem to have gone off one one - sorry!
TL;DR summary: there's nothing wrong with French Immersion, but it's no biggie if one's little darlings aren't in the programme
First, let's address the question of academic selection. I asked this question, explicitly, when looking at the options for #1 child at the end of kindergarten. I received what was obviously a prepared and rehearsed answer: while the FI programme is open to all, it is widely recognised to offer challenges that do not suit every learner. There is a tendency for the more academically-inclined to flourish within the programme, while there is equally a tendency for ESL kids, for example, to do better in the English-track programmes where they're not struggling to cope with instruction in a third language. What our local board, at least, is very keen to do is to build and maintain strong links between FI and English-track schools (where they are separate; in many the tuition is dual-track on the same physical site) and to give a thorough and honest review at the end of the early FI grades to assess whether pupils would actually do better in the English system. And to ensure that there is no stigma or perception of "failure" for doing so. I've mentioned on here before that one of our neighbours' kids was ushered into the English track after the end of Gr2, where she is now excelling. It makes it a little inconvenient for the parents, who now have children at two different local schools, but makes every kind of sense for kids who don't pick up languages easily.
Part of the process of integrating FI more fully into the school board has meant the removal of middle schools: in most districts in the Board area, elementary schools take kids all the way from JK to 8, or 1-8 for FI, then straight to high school for 9-12. There is a natural attrition in the FI system (people move away; it's more difficult for incoming kids to join the program after Gr1 if they haven't already had instruction in French, with the exception of a late entry program at Gr5 in some schools) that means year-group sizes tend to fall a bit as you go up through the school: this has meant more split-grade classes than I would have preferred to see, but it also has meant slightly lower average class sizes.
I was talking to the parents of a girl in Gr11 over the weekend. She attends the local high school which offers a huge variety of programmes, most of which are also taught within an FI stream - everything from an IB program (not all that common in public high schools hereabouts) to a very highly regarded series of vocational classes in the skilled trades. There is very little to choose between the English- and Immersion-track kids by the time they get to age 16-17, except that those who have received instruction in French are more likely (but by no means guaranteed) to have some degree of fluency and to be able to use either language to discuss what they're learning.
I'm happy for my kids to be in FI, but wouldn't sweat it if they weren't. My OH and I went through the form-filling process at the appropriate stage of the SK year, but otherwise have not been any more or less "pushy" than we would have been in any other situation. I think as somebody said up-thread, kids with the kind of family background (reasonably well educated & engaged parents, lots of reading materials in the house, encouragement and support of learning for its own sake) that are encouraged towards FI programmes where they're avaialble, are the kinds of kids who would likely do well in any learning environment.
#63
slanderer of the innocent










Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,695
From: Vancouver, BC











good post Oak.
I think the reasons really vary depending on where you are. Definitely in BC, due to the pace of demographic change FI has been seen as a way to avoid having your kid in a class with a high % of ESL kids/special needs. It is also seen, rightly or wrongly as more like private school. However that now seems to be changing.
The thing that strikes me looking ahead to high school is how for FI kids that want to stay with FI, FI is the only program you can take. You can't, say, get into Brainy Kids programme and do it in FI, nor can you do advanced sciences/maths or any arts programmes, nor AP. at least not in my school district.
I think the reasons really vary depending on where you are. Definitely in BC, due to the pace of demographic change FI has been seen as a way to avoid having your kid in a class with a high % of ESL kids/special needs. It is also seen, rightly or wrongly as more like private school. However that now seems to be changing.
The thing that strikes me looking ahead to high school is how for FI kids that want to stay with FI, FI is the only program you can take. You can't, say, get into Brainy Kids programme and do it in FI, nor can you do advanced sciences/maths or any arts programmes, nor AP. at least not in my school district.
#64
BE Forum Addict






Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,380
From: British Columbia











The thing that strikes me looking ahead to high school is how for FI kids that want to stay with FI, FI is the only program you can take. You can't, say, get into Brainy Kids programme and do it in FI, nor can you do advanced sciences/maths or any arts programmes, nor AP. at least not in my school district.
The IB program, however, doesn't look like it would be possible. The IB program only appears to be offered at one school, and the student would have to be transferred to that school if they wanted that.
#65
Forum Regular



Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 181











I have nieces and nephews in France, Spain and Italy-all of them marvelously bi or trilingual.
I will always be grateful for the opportunities my sojourn in France afforded me. I have lived and worked as a technical translator in West Africa, New Caledonia, Tahiti and of course France.
#66
Thread Starter
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 0











Looks like we have 1 elementary school that offers dual track English/French immersion and 2 High Schools, but the website's for the district and schools is vague and doesn't say how they break it down or any useful information.




