RayS

For what it's worth they don't use ring mains in France, Germany etc - its a peculiar brit thing. It assumes that you will never load all the sockets on the ring at the same time 'cos if you do, you trip the circuit breaker. That's why rings are shared between downstairs and upstairs - again to reduce the chance of using all outlets at once.
In France and Germany they have a "safer" system, in that there is a strict maximum number of outlets on a line (2 or3?) and each line has its own circuit breaker. Cookers, immersion heaters etc which draw a high current are each separately protected.
Vive la France!
Cheers
Ray

macadian

Been running two complete Hi Fi systems I brought out with me here (Made up of 'seperates) off transformers for the past 2 years without issue. Also various power tools, wood turning lathe and power washer.

Think problems can arise re the 50/60 hz scenario where machines e.g. power tools, lathe etc are run continuously for a time which may result in overheating of the motor due to the increased speed it may run at.

As an aside, I never leave the transformer plugged in to the outlet when the item being run from it is not actually in use...just a precaution as I have heard of transformers catching fire.

I have also been told that your home insurance company may have issues about their use should a fire result there from while using UK equipment. Just a thought...forearmed is forewarned.

Cheers

dbd33

The turntable I brought in 1981 is still in regular use with a transformer and local capstan. I even have the original capstan in case I move back to the UK (and can pry the turntable from my child's hands).

MikeUK

To answer the ring and earthing here in Canada

IMHO the acceptable standard here would in a lot of cases be illegal in the UK, France and Germany, don’t ever take an earth here for granted either check it.
They get away with it because at 110v the fatality risk is lower, when you jump it up to 220v by using both live wires or step it up to 240v using a transformer your at risk if you don’t check it properly.

The ring is slightly more expensive to install so you don’t see it here, but the key idea is that the load is always spread over two wires, so if something fuses a lot more amps can be handled by the system before a fire risk occurs, you’d think this would be a smart option in a wooden house?
Separating the lighting and power circuits means that if something fuses then that circuit blows but you shouldn’t be plunged into darkness just when you need to see what going on.
Canadian electrics is one of the “cons” when you get here

neill

Correctly fused radial circuits are safer than British ring mains circuits because there is no potential of wire overload when the fusebox breaker matches the regular rating for the wire coming from it. This is one reason why BS 1363 includes the fuse in the plug...... we simply don't need it here.

Steve_P

Ha, found my copy of the Alberta version of the Electrical Code Simplified (Residential Wiring).

"A maximum of 12 outlets may be connected to a circuit. This may consist of 12 light fixtures or 12 plug outlets (not appliance plugs) or any combination of lights and plug outlets mixed, as long as their total does not exceed 12 outlets."

Cheers
Steve

macmike41

Not sure I go with that one - the trip here is 15 or 20 Amp so if you have a table/bedside lamp on it there is a distinct danger that, in the event of a problem with the lamp, the power cable to the lamp could melt and present a fire hazard. Whereas in the UK a 3 amp fuse in the plug would offer a lot more protection by blowing a lot sooner than a 20 Amp trip would blow. I have also noticed that power cables to various household items can get quite warm - not sure what causes it but it sure don't seem 'right'

MikeUK

The root cause of the heat is the amperage

For an appliance in Canada to be able to do the same level of ‘work’ as in the UK it require twice as much current, and this is the primary source of heat.

Which is why I think it would be common sense to use ring mains as they split the load across two wires there by reducing the heat load on the internal house circuitry

And I’m sorry for anybody that thinks a “correct” but high ampere fuse at the distribution box is safer that a smaller local fuse.

And allowing power sockets in bathrooms……. ?

iaink

Sockets in bathrooms do have to be a minimum distance from water sources. I love being able to plug in a stereo or whatever, whats the problem with that? If people want to fry themselves in the UK they can always run an extension.

Seriously, how often has a power outlet in the bathroom created a problem here? Come to that I wonder what the relative incidences of electrical deaths and house fires are in N America vs the UK. I suspect if 110 and the electrical code were a safety issue, someone would have been sued a long time ago and the whole thing revamped for our own protection....after all, this is Canada, the worlds most nannying state we are talking about

Steve_P

According to the Electrical Code Simplified (Residential Wiring) Alberta Version.

Not only do plugs in bathrooms have to be a minimum 1 meter from a bathtub or shower they must not be over a wash basin but can be to the side, they also must be GFI protected either with a GFI type plug receptacle or and ordinary plug which is supplied from a G.F. type circuit breaker in the service panel.

neill

But you can still overload the complete circuit, which is hidden from view, because the standard breaker is 30A.... the ring main was designed to save copper and is thus rated lower than 30A because there are two paths. The 13A fuse is there to protect the hidden wire, not the device attached to it. Altough i agree, 3A fuses do give additional protection.

This is also why you are only now allowed 1 socket on a ring spur.

The americans went completely stupid for a while and used aluminium which is even worse design. But both designs are a consequence of high copper prices.

The new IEE regulations (this year i think) are to allow sockets in UK bathrooms, to bring the UK in line with other European countries.

Steve_P

Tell me about it.

I have one of those homes with aluminum wiring, however in its defense it has stood for 35 years now with no electrical problems.

He says with fingers crossed.

iaink

The problem with Al is not its electrical properties, but its mechanical ones.

Thermal expansion is greater than copper and the brass and steel alloys used in most applications, so joint loosen. Corrosion also occurs in contact with Cu and Cu alloys.

Screw fastened terminals loosen as the Alumin(i)um gives over time, resulting in A: oxidation of the joint, increasing resistance (and therfore heating), and B: a spark gap. Thats why you are supposed to go around periodically tightening the connections in junction boxes etc etc....all in all enough to put me off ever buying a house with Al wiring...you never know when a junction box or marrett joint has been stuffed behind the ceiling or drywall.

Steve_P

Well I'm pretty sure that there are no hidden connections, so that's not a concern.

What's more of a concern is that is almost impossible to find outlets or switches that were designed for aluminum. They used to be fairly common but not anymore.

So replacing them means using plugs or switches designed for copper only which involves using a copper pigtail and a "purple marret" connector, apparently designed for use with dissimilar metals. At least that's what I've been told by an electrician.

Craftybanshee

Haven't you? It goes like this ring, ring, ring ring .......