DKYXE

New to the forum here. So Hello! Figured this would be a good place for this discussion. Ill try and keep it short and simple as I can.

Bit about me:
-In my early 20s, currently in uni doing a dual major in psychology and marketing. Hoping for some career in advertising or market analysis.
-Lived in the UK in northwest London as a child (primary school years), lived in Canada for over a decade now, dual citizen.
-Live in Saskatoon, have also lived in southern Alberta for a short time and have travelled most of the country (just about everything noteworthy from Vancouver to Montreal).

As of late, I have become more and more dissatisfied with my life here for a myriad of reasons (social life, career prospects, cultural differences etc.) As a child there were a lot of things I recognized were different about the UK. Mannerisms and things like that. As an adult now, especially on a recent trip this past summer, I find that overall the lifestyle is more in line with well me and my ways of thinking and in my opinion better overall. Some examples:

Overall personalities/social norms: Brits do get bit of a bad name for being too reserved. At the same time I like that. I find Canadians (americans also) to be too artificial especially when it comes to politeness. I find things like pointless small talk in public maddening but goes deeper than that with friendships too. Its harder to know people in the UK, but beyond that its easier to then create genuine relationships. Another thing is that anywhere you go, if you interact with anyone in law enforcement, security, border control, anything government level etc. they are so much more professional and polished, just overall.

Geography: The UK may be small but I like that. Nowhere is more than a couple hours away, the travel infrastructure is so good too as well as affordable. The trains are great. Here? almost nonexistent. Coach journeys between cities are so affordable too. Going from Saskatoon to Calgary can cost $100. In the UK coach fares of 10 pounds are not unheard of. Flights too. Domestic travel in Canada is a joke. In the UK it is so reasonable to go anywhere in the country or to the continent as well. Yes of course distance plays a factor, but then when you can fly internationally from the UK to Dubai for the same price as Saskatoon to Toronto.. thats crazy. Canada is so car dependant also, even in urban areas, endless sprawl and car dependancy. Nothing is planned out with any sort of outlook beyond the next 10 to 15 years. Just look at the new areas of all these cities like Edmonton and Calgary. Endless cardboard box suburbs accessible by only car. Overall transport, in any form is vastly superior in the UK both from cost and efficiency perspective.

Culture: Canada is too America centric. In my personal opinion. Life revolves around America, too many examples but the worst and most obvious offender is the media. Definitely noticed this when I was in the UK. People in the UK are generally more aware of their position in the world, as opposed to Canadians being more aware of position relative to the USA, and almost to the point of obsession.

Education: In my opinion, very lacking in quality, and Saskatchewan is not held to a high regard even by Canadian standards but overall in comparison to the UK it is all poor. Interested in hearing more thoughts about this though?

I am strongly considering returning to the UK to start my own life, either soon (if I can work out University transfers and such, or in the next couple of years once I have completed my studies). Am I right in some of what I am feeling? Or am I just young, naive and the grass always greener?

I apologize if this turned into too much of a rant, and if i sound like an entitled jerk... but heres my real question. For expats who may have immigrated later in life. What are your overall thoughts on life in the UK vs. Canada? If you have lived in the east and west of Canada how does that compare from your perspective to the UK, any differences there? Overall, big pros and cons? Any regrets? Would you do anything differently? Any advice for me?

Twitcher1958

My daughter is also in her early 20s - we moved here as a family 7 years ago, so she finished high school here (Ontario), completed her chemistry degree from Guelph and has now moved back to the UK to do a Masters, and may stay there on completion. I wouldn’t say she was unhappy here, far from it, but I think she wants to at least experience British life - as an adult, as she was still a teenager when we moved. I think she feels some of the same emotions as you and as she has had this opportunity, wants to take advantage of it.
I’m sure she would be happy to communicate directly with you, so pm me if this would help. It’s still relatively early stages for her, so her experiences are fairly limited but may be helpful, if only from a solidarity point of view.

Danny B

If you are having issues with the above highlighted points, you should move back. It ain't going to change.

I don't mean to state the bleeding obvious, but Canadians are renowned for being polite, Canada is the 2nd largest country in the world, and yes, Canada is America lite.

Oink

Enough said.

Piff Poff

My daughter is in her early 20's, she moved to Burlington (Ont) a year ago today, she has blossomed and has a better understanding that there is more out there than Alberta can offer, she gets why we want to move on. She is planning a year or more in the UK at some point, but I think she will stay in Ontario now.

DandNHill

Ar you still moving to Ontario?

Vulcanoid

Different people like different things. Personally, British sensibilities were a driving force for leaving. Your 'pros/cons' generally are about personal taste - which means anyone else can only provide their own anecdotes really, and the decision will have to be yours.

.... ..... I ... I can only imagine our venn diagram has zero overlap whatsoever, when it comes to law enforcement, border control, anything governmental level. (I have yet to have a positive UK border experience, I have yet to have a negative Canadian one). CRA make HMRC look like monkeys throwing faeces (which would actually be a good explanation for most of what comes out of HMRC).

Bear in mind that your experience was (a) London (b) a while ago. Britain recently voted to pretend the world thinks they're a superpower, and the Government is currently proceeding to play high stakes poker, while holding cards which have on them only the phone number for a dodgy mechanic that closed in 1972. In my personal experience, Canadians know exactly where they stand in the world (generally liked, heavily dependent on American goodwill), and Brits don't have a clue.

Depends where you're studying? Oxford beats UoS. McGill beats Leicester.

Different universities and areas are going to have different strengths - eg if you want to study agriculture, UoS or UoM might be much better than if you want high energy physics. (Randomly picked - this might be when I learn they're actually world leaders in that regard? ) Saskatchewan is... well, it's Saskatchewan. But UBC, Toronto, McGill etc are very well regarded universities, again with varying strengths in different fields. Britain has hundreds of universities, many of which have.... questionable intakes and results.

Depends what kind of grass you want to eat. I spent years moving between them, weighing them up, and finally came firmly down on the side of Canada (based mainly on geography, economic future, world attitudes). For those gains, I'm prepared to force small talk with the waitress running my card.

I've never lived in the East. Vacationed in Quebec, loved it. Vacations, speaking of, are probably the big Canadian downside - two weeks is painful when you're used to five :/ Western Canada is glorious for the mountains, the open spaces, the cities. Sask is painful, and I ultimately concluded it was put there to make Manitoba look good

Advice for you: Decide what you want. Go for it. This sort of thing is pretty easy in your 20s, doable in your 30s, and gets harder later on. At the moment, if you can transfer into a decent UK uni, you could try it for a few years, and see if city centres full of trashed students vomiting over locals who are explaining how 'Europe is a Franco-German plot to destroy Britain, and the only way to save the country from Nazis is to install a fascist dictatorship, and that's democracy innit cause everyone I know wants that' is really your thing.

JamesM

Does anyone find any real cons to life in Canada?

Too many to list!

scilly

Been here over 49 years, love Canada, would never return to England (decided that after our first visit back 6 years after leaving).

Grass is always greener on the other side .......

........ you can but try it, you're young enough.

But never disparage Canada, it's much better than you think!

moneypenny20

Nothing to do with Canada per se. It's down to customer requirements. Far far fewer people want to fly Saskatoon - Toronto than want to fly London - Dubai so far fewer flights and therefore higher cost. It's no different in Aus or probably many other countries.

dbd33

This part of that post is spot on. Go for it.

Shakyuk

I haven't lived in Canada (moving over in January) but in the north (where I live) people are friendlier but even so they're not as friendly as they seemed in Canada. It did feel artificial at times in Canada, but at least they're making an effort. In the UK it's not uncommon to have your newly purchased goods thrown into a plastic bag right in front of you, and Sandra the rough arse check out woman who stinks of cigs doesn't speak a word and instead just looks at you with her cold dead eyes like you're something she stood in.

You then go home and cry into your cup of tea because all your biscuits are broken and so can’t be dunked.

I think the doctors and NHS in general in the UK is great, but the system is struggling and I fear it is in a downward spiral.

For example:
My girlfriend works in a nursing home, she frequently has to ring for an ambulance for some of the patients when they need to go to hospital. In the past year she's frequently on hold when ringing 999. She rang for an ambulance once and after being on hold for ages they said they would send an ambulance in 45 minutes for a man who's stoma (the hole they put in people’s throats to allow them to breath when they've had throat cancer etc.) was closing and he was losing consciousness due to lack of oxygen. My girlfriend questioned why this man wasn't a top priority since his life was in danger; she was told top priority is now imminent death. If they think there's a possibility of survival then you're left to wait.



The UK being small is good because you don't have to go far for most things, I can travel two hours north and walk some mountains and travel an hour north, east or west and be in one of three cities. The downside of the small UK and large population is the perpetual traffic jam.


On public transport it's around $4.20 for a 1.5 milesjourney from my house to the bus station in town. When you get to the busstation you'll see Wigan's mascot; Meningitis Annie, who is an old woman who chases kids shouting meningitis and screams at adults that we're going to die of cancer... I usually drive or walk


I used to travel quite frequently to Reading, around 200miles from where I live, the train was $312 (£186). Coach travel is reasonablebut it won’t be comfortable and it’ll take ages, I went to London on the coachonce, it took over 8 hours. I only did it once.


This is at the extreme end but…
The '£5k commuter club': Who pays that sum to get to work? - BBC News


With respect to urban planning, you'll find the UK urban planning system is like opening a tin of Heinz spaghetti in tomato sauce and throwing it at a wall. All of the spaghetti piece that stick are the roads we'll have. The rest of the spaghetti represents the dreams of congestion free travel of the UK population... this spaghetti is scooped up (like their dreams) and thrown in the bin.


We expect an annual increase in population of around 300,000 people yet do not build the infrastructure to deal with this. Our roads in urban areas are constantly congested and most public transport to anywhere other than a large town/city centre is prohibitively expensive or disjointed such that it makes driving the preferred option for most.


In the UK planning for a new industrial/commercial unit will include parking for just over half the number of staff they plan to employ.This is to discourage car use, but then no viable public transport alternative is provided and so you end up with commercial and industrial developments littered with cars because there's nowhere to park.


Housing developers seem to think the UK is still in 1923 and we're all reclusive midgets. They design tiny dolls houses with no parking,small gardens and no access to parks or greenery in the area. This is becausein 1923 people didn't have as many cars and reclusive midgets only need small houses and they don't like going outside. They're wrong though, I'm not a midget, I do drive a car and I like to go outside.


You can get cheap flights to Europe though and that really is great. Flights pretty much anywhere are reasonable from Manchester.

International travel by plane is usually cheaper than domestic travel by train or plane…





I can see your point here; I think the UK's population are far more knowledgeable about the world in general.


However 50% of the UK's media is owned by two rich blokes who like to drive their Europe hating propaganda down the throats of anyone in throat ramming distance (everyone).



From what I've read, Canadian schools are very much the same in terms of quality of education. In the UK families will move house to ensure their kids get into a good school. The UK's high schools vary massively. My high school was terrible, but my college and universities were very good (Manchester and Lancaster).

There's a lot of universities in a small area to choose from and student populations can be very high in cities (100,000 in Manchester which I'd assume is bigger than most Canadian cities student populations). This means student life is pretty good, it's mainly focussed around drinking a lot though.Public transport within city centres is good too (but I found this to be the case in Canada and it was cheaper and in better condition in Canada).





After writing all that I realise just how much I dislike living here now maybe when I move to Canada I'll develop some great love for this country...


I think you should go for it, people change but you only live once. You could have your fun in the UK now and then when you grow older and all the things I moaned about actually matter to you. You could move back to Canada, or to Europe or somewhere in the UK. The point is you have options so why not go for it.
Good luck

Paul_Shepherd

I think that is a well balanced view/comparison between the UK and Canada, to say that your not yet living here. I think you will enjoy Canada, you have the right attitude for such a move to make it a success.

However I think OP sees things the other way around....its all relative and subjective, every person has different priorities in life, there is no universally right or wrong choice.

Shakyuk

Thank you, I did feel I may have got a bit carried away.


I'm happy I spent my 20's in a more urban environment, I had a great time. But as you everyone is different and people change. I have definitely changed although I have always been an out doors person.


Variety is the spice of life

Moses2013

I think people need to stop comparing countries. At the end of the day the neighbouring village can be completely different and it just depends what you personally can get out of a location. People are people and the friendly cashier will probably be Chinese anyway, be it Vancouver or London. I recently went to Carlingford (Northern Ireland) and everything was different than Reading, just like the Isle of Man is different than Jersey. Even in Canada your friendly doctor is probably from India, so a bit like the UK LOL.