To a point I agree and, as I said above, lawyers charge way more here than they do in the UK and, personally, I think that this is a result of lack of comptition.

I don't know about Ontario but in Alberta, one doesn't have to have a lawyer to obtain a divorce if the parties are pragmatic about who gets what. It is, of course, different if they want to argue over everything and, once that stage is reached, my experience is that the red mist descends and being "reasonable" is the last thing on their minds. Unfortunately, this then means that the lawyers' fees increase dramatically.

The whole house transaction process over here is bizarre. Why somebody that is paying cash for a house cannot simply do the documentation without a lawyer is beyond me. Having said that, I'm sure that some would do it incorrectly and would then need a lawyer to put it right so may not end up saving a great deal anyway.

Ah, but the client isn't in a position to instruct as the client doesn't know the likely outcome of the case except as advised by the lawyer. A prudent client might seek a second opinion before putting up the $4,000 but, of course, you can't just buy one hour of a lawyer's time so it's $4,000 for the court appearance or $4,000 to retain a second lawyer to tell you that the first one has no chance and you shouldn't pay for the court appearance.

No answer to that one

I guess what you are saying is that lawyers over here are more corrupt than their UK counterparts. I would suggest that, if one saw a competent specialist in the UK, they would be given the same advice as if they had seen a competent specialist in the firm next door. If people don't "trust" lawyers over here (I would say that in the UK they generally do) then there is a huge problem

Of course you are right AC, what I was trying to say is that sometimes lawyers give the advice best suitable to their pockets and not necessarily their clients, who depending on their emotional condition, etc., may not think for themselves. There is dishonesty in every profession, that is the simple reality.

It's not a question of trust but of expectation. In the case of family law each lawyer will present a different spin on the case, one will propose stretching some fairly innocent behaviour to be abuse, another will suggest claiming dishonesty on the part of the other parent, a third will suggest that he or she will be able to manipulate the proceedings so as to appear before a judge friendly to his or her firm. Without being dishonest, they won't give the same advice as one another as they each intend to sell the case differently. As well, there really aren't any guidelines for family law cases in Ontario, judges have great liberty, so a lawyer's opinion of the outcome of a case greatly depends on his or her assessment of the likelihood of being able to appear before a specific judge. It's legitimate for them to have differing opinions though I doubt there's one who will say "your current lawyer is doing a good job, keep your business at that firm".

OMG, that is such a large & important transaction that I would have never dreamt of having done it without a lawyer. You reminded me of Jane Harvey dbd, I used them when I made my purchase, it all went so quick & smooth and knew ALL the fees right upfront. Are they still around?. They used to have an office at Yorkdale, but not anymore.

They're very much still around. We used them to buy the current place.

http://www.janeharveylawyers.com/

Sad, but true.

You managed to leave a lawyer speechless dbd.

Only because I'm not paying him.

Thanks...I think I will give them a try in revising my Will.

Your comparison of tax officials with concentration camp guards is completely inappropriate.

Which do you think carries the greater social stigma? I suggest it's the tax collector, the guards at Gitmo will eventually just be more embittered vets back at home while the tax collector will likely not move and will always be shunned in the neighbourhood. There's also no Christian angle to people's dislike of concentration camp guards, in western countries dislike of tax collectors is an article of faith.