robert_masters

Hi!

Thought I would bring up a new thread on these two conditions.

Looking back on past threads there doesn't seem to be a problem with entering Canada with Diabetes unless uncontrolled. I am a bit confused with the costs of insulin. My 20yr old daughter does have an insulin pump and her insulin & pump are funded through the 'Primary Care Trusts' here in the UK. I'm guessing she would have to pay for re-placement pumps in the future and all her insulin/blood strips? The pumps cost roughly £3000 and the consumables are £1000 per year. I suppose some health care insurances pay up to 80% prescriptions. What happens to people on low income? Does anyone know about the two conditions together, if its a problem getting PR and future costs or treatments?

Is there good support on pump users?

What costs are we looking at?

Any new info or ideas??

Angela

Almost Canadian

If you are on a low income (unless it is very low) you will still have to pay full price for prescriptions.

My insulin (lantus and novorapid) costs about $200 per month. Test strips come in at around $80 per month. I have no idea about the pump as I have never used one.

Make sure you get good health benefits through work otherwise diabetes can be very costly

Biiiiink

I don't know anything about either condition but I remember this old thread where Dingbat mentioned in post #5 that the pumps were not covered under MSP in BC.

Are pre-existing conditions excluded from private healthcover offered by employers? I don't know, don't have cover...

BristolUK

The term 'low income' is relative and means different things to different people.

Schemes also vary from Province to Province.

My wife has fibromyalgia. Her monthly prescriptions, for this alone, here in New Brunswick are $350. That's what we have to pay and there are other prescriptions too.

We have to pay the full cost. We do not qualify for assistance because the property we own (a home @ $120k and a duplex @ $100k) is counted as an asset.

In Manitoba and BC the Pharmacare schemes look only at income as declared for tax purposes. If we lived there it appears we'd only have to pay a MAXIMUM of $400/$500 EACH YEAR....as opposed to the near $450 a MONTH we have to pay in NB.

In Quebec, what the patient pays per drug is a lot less than NB. Not only that, there seems to be a maximum the patient has to pay even if not on a 'low income' and that seems to be about $700 a year.

We could own property far in excess of the NB value and still receive assistance with prescription costs in other provinces.

Our income could be the same in other provinces and we'd only have to pay the first $400 or $500 or $700....as opposed to the $5000+ we have to pay here.

In NB we do qualify for a slight reduction in property tax ($200 a year - I understand this rebate hasn't changed in over 20 years) and we also qualify for a rebate of $100 a year on electricity costs. Yet we have to pay the full cost of prescriptions to a level 10 times that in some other places.

Hence my comment about the same circumstances being treated differently depending where you live.

JonboyE

Work based schemes are group rated, not charged per individual. As long as you apply within the defined times, usually 90-120 days after starting employment the insurer has to accept you at standard rates.

If you have high drug costs the employer's premium will rocket up on the next renewal, but hey ho ....

If you apply late the insurer can request you to complete a medical questionnaire.

agr

Hi Angela,
My wife is on a pump and we are planning to move to Alberta soon. We have estimated costs roughly as follows:
Medtronic infusion sets $110 per 10 sets
Humalog $60 per 10 ml
Accuchek Aviva test strips $60 per 100
We think we're looking at about $4500 per year, plus a few thousand every 3-5 years for a new pump. In AB we will have to pay for all this ourselves unless we can get insurance through employment (and even then, coverage varies). We have a diabetic friend in Calgary who tells us that there is quite a lobbying effort in the province at the moment trying to persuade the (it must be said, wealthy) govt to at least pay for insulin.
By the way, most of the price of an insulin pump must go towards the manufacturer's support, liability insurance and warranty costs. We recently received a replacement under warranty, and the customs value of the hardware was declared as US$227.

robert_masters

Hi! to everybody

Thanks for the info, interesting stuff. Cannot believe the costs involved. I will look at those links, thanks!

We are thinking about moving to Manitoba or Alberta, depends on employment/housing and weighing up the pros and cons. My O/H hoping to go out later this year to sit the 'Red Seal' exam in Winnipeg.

I will pass this info onto her, whether she comes or not is another question?

Just for people to know, we have submitted our PR application over a year ago as a skilled worker. Like lots of us, we have decided to put house on the market and go in on a Temp Visa, then apply for WP (common way in), the only way to get the PR fast tracked!!! Luckily for us my OH skills is greatly needed and finding employment once in Canada is EASY!! Doing a recce, making contacts, planning and searching through this site has been the best thing. BRILLIANT INFO

My 20yr old daughter is hoping to get married this August Trying my best to put it off. No I'm not being MEAN its just that as soon as she marries she's not classed as an dependant under our application. If things go wrong for her in the UK then its gonna be more difficult getting her in!! Any ideas?

Well I will give her all the options and the costs involved, keep things coming in. Be nice to hear about 'pump' users. One thing so glad the rest of us are all fit and well, that I can be thankful about!!

robert_masters

Hi!!

That's excellant info and I'm sure lots of people will be interested in this up-to-date thread!!

Gosh, I do feel sorry for her at the moment. She may well stay behind? I think her treatments are going to be too expensive for her? She's just starting out in life??

I agree at least the government should help towards insulin and needle therapy costs. Surely, long-term the government would save money, but that's another debate!!

Angela

agr

Just to put the numbers in context, my wife and I between us pay - in UK - £460 per month in National Insurance Contributions. That's over CA$10k per year. Alberta provincial healthcare costs (I think) $88 per month for two (inpatient treatment only). We would need to look at the whole picture of taxation to get a balanced view, but for us $4500 per year in prescriptions is a price worth paying for the quality of life. I suppose it depends on your income though.
Small point that I know my diabetic wife would want me to make: I expect your diabetic daughter considers herself fit and well too...

robert_masters

Hi!

I value each ones views and comments, everyones situation is different!!

Unfortunately for my daughter she has had it HARD. She has not been able to work f/t since leaving school. Its been a shame for her, her diabetes is very hard to controll even with the pump, although the pump has been the best thing!! At least she is seizure FREE. Past fits have caused long-term damage and has to take epilepsy drugs for that. She's just beginning to start driving and seeking further employment. So at the moment she is on a low income, although her husband to be earns a decent wage she cannot depend on that at the given time.

However, a very good point to remember!!

I'm gonna print everything off and give this info to her!!

Angela

robert_masters

Done the maths!! or Math (Canadian way)

Assuming 1 vial = 5 cartridges, each cartridge lasts 3 days
5 x 3 = 15 days divided by CAN$60 = $4.00 per day x 7 = CAN$28.00 per week.

Giving sets $100 divided 10 sets = $10 per set, which lasts 3 days? so 3 sets per week MAX x $10 = $30 per week

Blood Strips 3 x per day testing = $22 per week

Total for week CAN $80.00 x 4 =CAN$320.00 per month

That's a lot for someone young and starting out in life!! GOSH

And then normal health insurance on top!!

What are Epilim drug costs?

Going to ask some friends in Manitoba will keep posted.

Thank you to everyone!!

Angela

Grah

Anglea heres a link to some more info, but your figure isn't far off the MB estimate of $3700 a year.

But slight snippet for those not deep into the figures.
It is estimated that the cost of services for adults with diabetes is at least $200 million per year.
Estimated Direct Costs of Treating Diabetes in Manitoba1

2000 2005 2010 2016

$189,600,000 $214,900,000 $247,900,000 $295,300,000


• Of the 17 diabetes medications approved as safe and effective for Canadians, Manitobans can only fully access 10 of them under the Manitoba Pharmacare Program (MPP). The MPP does not list three of the approved diabetes medications at all, and restricts access to four of them.

Out of Pocket – it costs a lot!
Statistics Canada reports that Canadians over age 35 and living with diabetes are more likely than those without diabetes to have lower levels of income. A Canadian living with diabetes is likely to be a senior on fixed income and have medical costs two to five times higher than a Canadian without diabetes.
A June 2005 online survey of Canadian Diabetes Association and Diabète Québec members revealed:
• Over one in two Association members with diabetes (52%) reported that they pay personally for diabetes medications and supplies. More than seven in 10 (72%) of Diabète Québec members pay out-of-pocket for medication and supplies.
• Almost one in two (46%) of Association members reported paying out-of-pocket expenses between $50 and $200 per month; one in four (25%) spent less than $50 a month.
• Among Diabète Québec members, 47 per cent said they paid more than $50 a month but less than $200, while 36 per cent paid less than $50 a month.
• Almost one in four (24%) of Association members reported there were diabetes drugs, supplies or devices that their doctor recommended, but that they could not afford to purchase and could not access through their insurance plan. One in 10 Diabète Québec members reported that there were prescribed drugs, supplies or devices they could not afford.
• Those under age 40 with type 1 diabetes were more likely to be unable to afford medications and supplies recommended by their doctors.

robert_masters

Hi Grah!!

I think it all sounds crazy but if thats what you've got to pay, well so be it!!

That's where the UK is better with funding medical problems, we can't really slam the uk!!

It's a shame that the Canadian Heath Authority don't really invest in diabetic treatment, I guess they think 'Let them die young'!! But the more they invest/educate at a young age the less long term complications, both for the patient and the government. PITY!!

Anyway, thanks for the info, cheers!!

Will send a pm!!

Angela

Grah

Anglea,
sorry link was broken.
try http://www.diabetes.ca/Section_About/prevalence.asp

The financial burden of diabetes and its complications is enormous.

People with diabetes incur medical costs that are two to three times higher than those without diabetes. A person with diabetes can face direct costs for medication and supplies ranging from $1,000 to $15,000 a year.
By 2010, it’s estimated that diabetes will cost the Canadian healthcare system $15.6 billion a year and that number will rise to $19.2 billion by 2020.

So I'm not sure about the let 'em die young it's more of no money for everything.

robert_masters

Grah!!

Well earlier intervention springs to mind!!

Does this still apply to kids then, or is it free to them?

I disagree, I think helping with good diabetic control, prevents long-term damage and less $ for health care and taking up hospital beds, operations, appointments etc, etc.

Yeah its a long-term complication but we don't say no to people who smoke or drink!!

I feel sorry for people like my daughter, they didn't abuse their bodeis to get this disease. Strange thing we haven't even got diabetes it in the family!! She got it from just having a virus!!

But I believe people should be well educated, free support and prescriptions and it would save thousands of $ in the long run!!

That side of things the UK have got it RIGHT!! (for a change).

I will send a pm to you soon, been busy sorting the house out, ready to sell, if we can, what with the slow down!! Hopefully see Canada sooner rather than later!!

Angela