Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

My husband is a Squadron Leader in the RAF and we have put our papers in for skilled work pr visa Feb 05. Obviously not heard anything yet but I have spent hours reading through this forum and to my astonishment am amazed at the lack of preparation done and investigative work done when people apply to live in another Country. My husband has degrees and qualifications up to the ying yang but doesn't expect to walk into a job. I don't expect warm, welcome arms at the school gates either. We have costed exactly how much taxes are, tumble dryers cost, insurance, flights home, houses, cars and children's clothes cost. My husband is experienced in telecoms and would be looking for a job in this area but being the professional he is we are paying for him to take Canadian qualifications that can be recognised and he will volunteer to work free of charge for a Canadian company before he expects a full time job interview. Why do British people think everything should be handed on a plate without hard work and homework being done. It looks to me that people fill in these forms and apply for visas in Countries they know very little about (either politically or geographically) and then wonder whats gone wrong when it all goes belly up. How on earth you can make such a rash decision within the first 6 months as well, oh please. Everywhere is rubbish when its new in the first 12 months and then things start getting easier. Have I read it wrong or do people not ask enough questions first about life changing decisions? Please feel free to correct me or add to the debate....

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I remember Julius. One of his first posts was a lot like yours.
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=229107

He came here, got a job, was doing OK, then got homesick
http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=277068

Finaly ended up going back to the UK after a relativly short time in Canada, posts now and then in the returning to UK forum.

Its probably safe to say that if you have moved around countries before you are somewhat prepared, but if you havent, then your take on the reality rather than the theory of it all might be totaly different.

Until you have tried it, honestly you can plan all you like, but you just dont know how you will react, and moaning about stuff is a natural reaction, we have all been there to some extent I suspect, so we just put up with it :)

Sometimes the job market can be very cruel, and even with the best canadian qualifications, without canadian experience and contacts, it can get very demoralizing.

Good Luck though:)

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

So how are things in the Iain household these days?

Getting much sleep?

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

You are sooooo right! Knowing what you are getting yourself and your family is so important.

And also the people you are talking about worry about the weather, if it will be too cold. They worry about the food they might not get, chocolate!!! A lot of people state the attraction of the outdoor for coming over, yet they worry about not getting the British TV.

It does cost more money than you planned when you move, work might not be easy to walk into, there are some good baked beans, there is some good chocolate. Food you can't get, cook it from scratch! There is no CBbees but there is PBS and others and a lot of the same programs for the kids. For the rest of British TV, download stuff from UK nova or the likes. But also what there is available, is ice skating, sledging, breath taking view, friendly people, etc. A better quality of life.

You have to put the efforts and research on the right stuff!! Forget about what you can't get anymore and focus about what you can! Costing everything is so important. Canada is not as cheap as some people might think.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

The only thing I wouls say is, that as a forces family, having had many postings (presumably), you have had many experiences of moving to places far from where you may call home. These experiences will have taught you to adapt well to new situations and also what to be aware of regarding differences in culture and behaviours. In summary, your experience has taught you to be prepared.

For many Brits, the only experience of foreign lands is from holidays, which obviously gives an unrealistic view of living away from 'home'. Without prior experience, many may not know what is needed to be done to prepare.

Having said that, you can be confident that you have prepared thoroughly, but you cannot predict what events might happen which result in the move not working out for you.

There are probably many people who are living in Canada sucessfully with little preparation and vice versa.;)

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Not so bad thanks Sue. Getting 4 or 5 hours at a time most nights now. Hard to believe its only been a month.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

There's a major factor in addition to inadequate preparation which is a personality assessment.

If you're going to be uncomfortable being away from friends and family etc even if you move to another part of England then be careful.

Also, if you have a personality like a bag of wet mice or are an a***hole then it won't help either.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Ah the Beauty of wealth, Not everyone has the luxury of a monthly Squadron leaders pension coming in, for most of us that would be our wages.

For some you might be right, that looks good and away they go pick a spot from 1,000's of miles away don't like it turn round and go home, say it was crap. Others come here find something completely different and not like anything they have done or planned before and live happily.

But in most cases people who are in the process of immigration are on this site to ask questions, sometimes too general, sometimes too dependant on personal choices to be fully answered. But at least they are here trying to learn and learning fast about the need for reseach and homework.

So you really should be making rash opinions about others.
--

If you have already worked out you taxes you must know exactly where your going to live, do you?
As for material things virtually nothing is paid for here at retailer recommend price, so you might be able to snag a bargain or two. As for food have you done the grocery web sites and seen the products are actually here? PS Kellogg's Cornflakes here don't taste like Kellogg's cornflakes in the UK.
Nor does the cheese, baked beans cuts of meats aren't the same. . . .

Finally
It's not only British people, but at least they speak the local language.


Hope you and your family have a wonderful civilian life and enjoy working and living in a total different environment than anything you've probably experienced before.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Quite the generalization, as the old saying goes, "Don't tar everyone with the same brush"

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

As a Canadian I can't really comment on most of your post, but just wanted to make a note of this statement. I find this a disturbing trend in job hunting. Companies should not expect people to work for free just for the honour of getting a job or even an interview. Sadly, I am starting to see this more frequently in job ads. Volunteering for an organization you like/admire and want to help is something to be lauded on a personal level, but for companies to demand people donate their time before hiring them is despicable and frankly sounds somewhat like blackmail. I hope it is a trend that gets nipped in the bud.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Absolutely agree. Its not something I've seen here on the Rock but frankly I'd be buggered if I was going to work for free (even if I could afford to which I cant.) I'm not being arrogant, I have been flexible (taken a paycut to stay here) but do have a good sense of my skills & experience and their attraction or otherwise to Canadian employers. Actually, strike that, I have found in my field no appreciable differences between job hunting here and in UK, other than the size of the market which is driven by my preferred location. And thats from both the position as a job seeker and a recruiter. The latter I'm going through again as we speak.

I have some sympathy with the OP inasmuch as a cursory or even more detailled reading of these forums can give an impression of doom and gloom in the whole moving to Canada/getting employment experience. To repeat the most oft quoted piece of advice about Canada .... 'its a damn big country and experiences vary from place to place and job to job'! You sound well researched which is good and probably have some experience in moving around the world which is better. Dont right everyone off here as whiners 'cos we're not!

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

One comment: when you get bitten on your sanctimonious rear end, which you will, how will you feel then?

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Also an illegal one in nearly all cases.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Yes, I know that this is illegal in Australia. Shame on the companies that try to take advantage of people like this. :(

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I think you need to hold off on the high and mighty talk until you get here and have spent 3 years of your life settling in before you start ranting an raving about how stupid everyone is. Preperation cannot ultimatly prepare you for 'Real' life.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Well said Vixen.
Karma sent!!

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Thats what I was trying to say, only in a less succinct way :)

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

he will volunteer to work free of charge for a Canadian company before he expects a full time job interview.

If workers find it hard to find work here, maybe it's because people like your husband are willing to work (illegally) for free. There are labour laws here in Canada that state what the minimum wage is. This does not just apply to those who need the money, but to everyone. You also have to stop and think about what kind of company would do this sort of thing. If they are willing to break the rules about this, what else are they willing to do? And really, what does this say about the person willing to take an illegal position?

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I may be naive but I am hoping for a warm friendly welcome at the school gate.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

In that case dont take Jez ;)

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

aahh he is a pussy cat really :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

If hubby was a Squadron Leader...RAF organised and paid for any moves for them. The residual activity left to the service household of packing up a house, isn't exactly key in terms of facilitating an externally organised move overseas. Since this was post #1 for the OP, we may have a troll. :rolleyes:

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

well said i totally agree with you most of them that go home will be dollopers anyway :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Kicked out of the lounge were you, so you decided to come to the canada forum? :D

We're all do-gooders here as well! :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I was intersted to read your "perception" of other peoples naivity when preparing to emigrate to other countries. Perhaps your confidence may well be your downfall? I sincerely hope not, but I can't help thinking that it might be. I noticed that you mentioned your husband is currently serving in the RAF. Have you given any thoughts to his adjusting to life in the "real world", ie civilian life? I ask because having served in the RAF myself for 14 years, it does take a lot of getting use to when you don't have all the assistance closeby, ie on a RAF base! It took me about 2 years to adjust to life outside the "wrapped in cotton wool" world of the Armed Forces.
I don't agree with your statement that "Everwhere is rubbish when it's new in the first 12 months" either. I would say that it can be daunting, frightening and yet exciting, but that depends on a positive attitude and a willingness to adapt to a new way of life.
My wife and I have found this forum to be interesting and informative, as real life experiences provided here, are invaluable.

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

no but i bet you have an interesting life going of all your posts

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I do indeed....without having to insult people! :D

You seem to be quite the hit in the lounge these days.....want to define do-gooder for us now? :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

boring boring boring boring :zzz:

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Is there an echo in here? Im sure I've heard you say that before?

Im so sorry that I miss your posts at nite but unfortuntely other committments come first!

But I am very impressed with how well you play with others! :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Nothing very much, what do you think it says?

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I may be one of only a few, but I totally agree. I did months of research mainly on internet and visits to make sure we were doing right thing. BUT
I had two things. .............
1. Plenty of time,
2. Money to enable me to visit Canada more than once and not have a mortgage here.

Not everyone has the time, especially if you have a young family or still working long hours, or have no savings after spending most on the application!!

So it is not fair to make such a statement. Also degrees etc here are ten a penny for many, university education seems common to everyone here, In the end you have more people to compete against, They are short of tradesmen / labourers, and retail staff from what I see.
You need to be adaptable too. Also volunteering is the Canadians way of gettingfree labour!! Something you dont see in the UK. There are some very good jobs here that go to volunteers, that would otherwise be salaried in UK.
Start down that road, and you'll be on a hiding to nothing. If you are good at what you do then you deserve wages. There are no shortage of eldery people volunterring for very good jobs, and here, you even have to fill in an application to be "chosen" to be a volunteer! So dont think you are doing anyone any favours!

Not everyone is internet crazy like me, not everyone has the time to spend searching, researching etc etc as I did.

I must admit we would not have got here if I had not done it all.
We also really really wanted a total lifestyle change, had no huge family to leave behind. We were also well travelled and did not get attached to homes or possessions. My husband used to be in the Navy, and I travelled extensively. This all helped.

We on the other had do not have degrees or qualifications to show. We have life skills, and experience.

What you need here to get started is to have plenty of savings. We were up to our eyes in debt one way or another in Uk working to pay mortgage bills and everything else.
It was coming here that freed us of all that, enabling is to concentrate on life and living it, using the equity in the UK house.

I was worried about jobs. I wanted to realise my dream of being able to return to becoming a fulltime artist. MAking money from something I love would be impossible in UK. I went out on foot and literally sold myself! and it has paid of. I have my first commission, and offers to display in galleries locally. May not be much but it is a start.!

My husband was more worried her has a job that no one seems to do here!!
Anyway he was prepared to try anything that fitted his talents. We scoured the papers weekly, and applied to jobs online. Mostly no response, which we had been warned about. Then the phone rang! After a written test and two interviews, against a number of applicants, my husband has today been offered a job with Government Canada!! It is only a temporary contract, but a great foot in the door, for that ever needed Canadian experience. Who better than a reference from Government Canada!!

If you really want something, and are prepared to wait and put in time, then hopefully things will happen. Jobs do not fall in your lap, and people must be prepared to diversify from their current line of work.

Everyones circumstances are different, and for some they do not have the money or time to lose in not getting a job. This can put awful pressure on families, on top of the stress of moving.

Emigrating costs money, and at the end of the day, this is the only thing you have to lose. Making that step to move overseas, with or without visiting researching etc. is a gamble for anyone.

Life really is too short too say "I wish I had done that..!" If the move fails and people feel they have made the wrong decidion and want ot go back to the UK, then as long as they are prepared to lose money they can go back. There is no law against it. But at least they can say " Well I did it , no regrets, time to get on with my life" then so be it.

In our case we have no regrets, we were prepared to do anything to stay here, and we have only been her 3 months. We are so happy, are stress free for the first time on years. We are prepared to make it work, but luck really has been on our side from the begining.

For anyone willing to wait the lengths quoted for visas now the very best of luck, for anyone who feels emigrating was a wrong move. At least you did it, and can get on with our life. Nothing worse than regrets in life!




we have put our papers in for skilled work pr visa Feb 05. Obviously not heard anything yet but I have spent hours reading through this forum and to my astonishment am amazed at the lack of preparation done and investigative work done when people apply to live in another Country. My husband has degrees and qualifications up to the ying yang but doesn't expect to walk into a job. I don't expect warm, welcome arms at the school gates either. We have costed exactly how much taxes are, tumble dryers cost, insurance, flights home, houses, cars and children's clothes cost. My husband is experienced in telecoms and would be looking for a job in this area but being the professional he is we are paying for him to take Canadian qualifications that can be recognised and he will volunteer to work free of charge for a Canadian company before he expects a full time job interview. Why do British people think everything should be handed on a plate without hard work and homework being done. It looks to me that people fill in these forms and apply for visas in Countries they know very little about (either politically or geographically) and then wonder whats gone wrong when it all goes belly up. How on earth you can make such a rash decision within the first 6 months as well, oh please. Everywhere is rubbish when its new in the first 12 months and then things start getting easier. Have I read it wrong or do people not ask enough questions first about life changing decisions? Please feel free to correct me or add to the debate....[/QUOTE]

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

boring boring boring go boring go :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Just cant seem to define do-gooder can you?

Im sure there must be an echo in here!

You know you might actually be able to make some friends in the lounge if perhaps (do I dare say it) you were a little nicer to people! :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

boring boring boring go boring go boring :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Are you on auto-record.....or just not clever enough to think of something new and exciting? :D

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I think the general conclusion from this forum is moving to Canada will/will not suck. You will be miserable/happy. Don't/do it.

Jeez, as long as there's beer I'm happy anywhere. :beer:

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

I think you have misread what I wrote, I didn't say the British were stupid but I did question their motive for such a life changing decision and their lack of preparation. I'd be very interested to know your experience of settling into Canadian life - are you saying it took 3 years before you felt settled? If so, why? What did you feel it was down to? Jobs? Neighbourhoods? Leaving family? Are you intending moving back to the UK?

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Yes, perhaps I should have made myself clearer - the work experience is part of the re-settling that is provided by the UK Military you can take this within your own country or another where you settle - it would be legal within a military capacity - like an exchange post if you like

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Now theres the voice of experience and wisdom

Re: Correct me if I'm wrong or start a debate?!?
 

Yes it took 3 years before I felt settled, no matter how prepared you are, homesickness still has a way of creeping into your mind. days when things are bad or something happens to disengage the norm your first response is to head home to the safe gorund. I am still unable to work as im still in the process (married a canadian) but only now have I found a home i like, filled it with things I like, my freindships are like my old ones back home strong and dependable. I would say that up until about 6 months ago I thought about going home at least once a month. But i havent felt that in a long time. I know someday i will feel it again but the homesickness only dulls with time and routine in your new home. I dont intend to go back to the UK no.

You can prepare from 3000 miles away as much as you like but it still doesnt beat actaully being here! I mean how do you prepare or no what areas are good and bad, how do you navigate a subway system you have hardly pyhsically used? How do you know what schools are good until your kids have spent a month their? how do you know where to do your grocery shopping and what shops are best for you until youv done a weeks shopping in each? we can all sit here and tell you what ones are best but you wont know which one you prefer until you get here.

preparation is good but being here and real reality is a damn site better.

I didnt misunderstand your post, However I do feel that you are comming across as a little superior and patronising when you are not even here yet.

You may find that you are craving Turkish delight chocolate, or cant find bras to fit, and your HB may not find the job he wants straight away. I dont think that you have any right to talk about ppls inability to research when you dont know them personally and also you havent landed in Canada and experienced what they have yet.

Maybe a better way to have started the post was to ask ppl what research they did. I really dont see anyone on this site that just decided that they were going to move to Canada and never had another thought about it till they moved here.