BC vs ON
Jan 29th 2018, 1:02 pm
#46
Phaedrus by Plato (not5)
Joined: May 2017
Location: Vernon, BC
Posts: 206
Re: BC vs ON
Perhaps also long walks on the beach and cuddling in front of the fire.
It'd be a struggle to find someone who didn't like holiday activities. The snag being that, if you move to a place suitable for them, it is unlikely to also offer career advancement, day cares and good schools.
It'd be a struggle to find someone who didn't like holiday activities. The snag being that, if you move to a place suitable for them, it is unlikely to also offer career advancement, day cares and good schools.
Jan 29th 2018, 8:34 pm
#47
"In cruce vincam"
Joined: May 2010
Location: Mill Bay, Vancouver Island
Posts: 3,232
Re: BC vs ON
I hate all those things with a passion. The prospect of pooing in the woods really doesn't do it for me. However, we function very happily in BC with the car windows rolled up. I can see the countryside perfectly well through the window of the golf club.
Jan 30th 2018, 12:28 am
#48
Dive Bar Drunk
Joined: Nov 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 8,649
Re: BC vs ON
Growing unrest in the UK; increasing intolerance; the predicted and uncared about increase in rough sleeping and other effects of welfare cuts; NHS problems; cozying up to undesirables like Trump and DUP; instability etc etc
I can certainly do without 'excitement' like that.
I can certainly do without 'excitement' like that.
I don't imagine many people move with 60 days worth of funding, we didn't have 6 days. I would think that in Guelph or K-W a CA willing to do any sort of bookkeeping job temporarily would have no trouble generating some sort of income. A physicist maybe less so, but there are posters on this board with connections to such work in the area.
I dunno though how someone who doesn't kayak would get on around here, we go out on kayaks nearly every year and we are not at all outdoorsy people.
I dunno though how someone who doesn't kayak would get on around here, we go out on kayaks nearly every year and we are not at all outdoorsy people.
To be fair this is very much a Canadian mind set because they have so few holidays. Most Canadians Ive met aren't particularly active until these periods. It's amazing how many people in Toronto barely acknowledge there is a lake in the City or take part in snow sports in the winter. I've told them many times they'd be better off in London. Vancouver is probably a better mindset and fit for this poster.
Last edited by JamesM; Jan 30th 2018 at 12:34 am.
Jan 30th 2018, 1:40 pm
#49
Oscar nominated
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: Moncton, NB, CANADA
Posts: 50,835
Re: BC vs ON
I think there are lots of things worse in Canada than the UK - welfare systems are another.
What makes it especially disappointing for the UK is that North America never really had these safety nets so doesn't miss them. The UK has had them but they're being dismantled. It's criminal.
Jan 30th 2018, 3:41 pm
#50
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: Maryland (via Belfast, Manchester, Toronto and London)
Posts: 4,802
Re: BC vs ON
Thanks guys for the helpful pointers to consider - the alternative outdoor hobbies in ON which I’d not realised were so accessible and the link to Kitchener and Guelph’s bike trails etc.
Just to highlight my original post however "I would really appreciate any personal experiences/thoughts/ideas/comments etc. on any of the locations I have mentioned". In no way have I asked for people to make a personal life decision for myself. Apologies if anyone misunderstood and wanted to take on this burden!
Just to highlight my original post however "I would really appreciate any personal experiences/thoughts/ideas/comments etc. on any of the locations I have mentioned". In no way have I asked for people to make a personal life decision for myself. Apologies if anyone misunderstood and wanted to take on this burden!
OK - I wasn't clear in my post above. This is anecdotal but I'll give you my actual experience. I moved to Toronto (from Manchester) with my wife in 1989. We were young, no kids and thought life is short so let's try something new.
We loved Toronto. We got out and about as much as possible in all seasons. We're not great skiers but we went skiing at a few places north of Toronto. It wasn't Whistler but it was good enough for us. We felt like it was a constant holiday for the first couple of years. Then, in 1991, we quit our jobs and went traveling around the US, Canada, and Caribbean for 3 months - living off our savings. The intention was to end up in Vancouver, find jobs and settle there for a while. We loved the scenery and the surrounding area. We hated the city - at least compared to Toronto.
I got offered jobs in Vancouver (I'm in IT) but the salaries were well below those in Toronto and there weren't as many opportunities. The cost of living seemed higher in Vancouver. My wife is a nurse so she quickly started work at a hospital in downtown Vancouver. Compared to Toronto, Vancouver was just dull - especially in terms of nightlife. We ended up back in Toronto after a short period of time and lived there for another 5 years before moving back to the UK.
Again, anecdotal and a long time ago but things really have not changed that much. I think my observations still apply when comparing Vancouver and Toronto. I'm in the US now but I still go back to Toronto quite often. I also have a daughter who lives in London, Ontario. Wild horses wouldn't be able to drag my wife back to Vancouver. Of course, others will have different experiences/opinions.
Jan 31st 2018, 1:41 am
#51
Just Joined
Joined: Jul 2017
Location: Surrey, British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 26
Re: BC vs ON
As someone who has lived in both Ontario and B.C. and, until 18 months ago, a 12-year resident of Victoria, I'll offer my $0.02.
Victoria and Vancouver Island are beautiful and easily fulfill your outdoor requirements. If you love the outdoors, you will not get bored of the Island. That said, job prospects can be a little weak. While there is a growing IT community, it is still quite small. In addition, Victoria is still primarily a government town with public sector jobs (military, post-secondary, public service) and a limited private sector. Salaries are not all that good compared with other parts of the country and, yes, housing prices are higher than average. If traveling off the Island, you'll also have to factor in ferry fares (about $100 each way for two people in a car) and petrol prices are high. On the other hand, electricity and auto insurance (for now!) are quite reasonable. There is a huge drug problem in B.C. and Victoria is not immune from this. I lived in downtown Victoria and drug use was in the open and the police did not really care. Crime is also rampant.
Central Ontario, including the K/W-Guelph area, would be better for job prospects given the larger numbers of private sector companies, it close location to Toronto, and the Eastern U.S. Yes there are outdoor opportunities, but you might have to travel to them. Compared with Victoria, electricity and auto insurance prices would be higher.
That being said, I think you are overlooking a city that could fulfill all your needs. And that city is Ottawa, where I lived for 16 years.
Ottawa has a solid IT sector, a stronger private sector compared with Victoria, very good transportation links, a stable economy and reasonable house prices. As for your outdoor requirements, it checks you boxes with numerous parks, green spaces, very good cycling (Gatineau Parc loop is outstanding) and genuine four-season recreation opportunities.
Best of luck!
Victoria and Vancouver Island are beautiful and easily fulfill your outdoor requirements. If you love the outdoors, you will not get bored of the Island. That said, job prospects can be a little weak. While there is a growing IT community, it is still quite small. In addition, Victoria is still primarily a government town with public sector jobs (military, post-secondary, public service) and a limited private sector. Salaries are not all that good compared with other parts of the country and, yes, housing prices are higher than average. If traveling off the Island, you'll also have to factor in ferry fares (about $100 each way for two people in a car) and petrol prices are high. On the other hand, electricity and auto insurance (for now!) are quite reasonable. There is a huge drug problem in B.C. and Victoria is not immune from this. I lived in downtown Victoria and drug use was in the open and the police did not really care. Crime is also rampant.
Central Ontario, including the K/W-Guelph area, would be better for job prospects given the larger numbers of private sector companies, it close location to Toronto, and the Eastern U.S. Yes there are outdoor opportunities, but you might have to travel to them. Compared with Victoria, electricity and auto insurance prices would be higher.
That being said, I think you are overlooking a city that could fulfill all your needs. And that city is Ottawa, where I lived for 16 years.
Ottawa has a solid IT sector, a stronger private sector compared with Victoria, very good transportation links, a stable economy and reasonable house prices. As for your outdoor requirements, it checks you boxes with numerous parks, green spaces, very good cycling (Gatineau Parc loop is outstanding) and genuine four-season recreation opportunities.
Best of luck!
Jan 31st 2018, 7:36 am
#52
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 181
Re: BC vs ON
Thanks guys for the helpful pointers to consider - the alternative outdoor hobbies in ON which I’d not realised were so accessible and the link to Kitchener and Guelph’s bike trails etc.
Just to highlight my original post however "I would really appreciate any personal experiences/thoughts/ideas/comments etc. on any of the locations I have mentioned". In no way have I asked for people to make a personal life decision for myself. Apologies if anyone misunderstood and wanted to take on this burden!
I do believe a few of the posters here need to think, would an accountant and physicist really make an uncalculated decision based on no research what so ever. I wanted to keep my intro brief, however just for additional background – I got my first job at 18, no going to Uni just getting stuck in, working full time on an apprentice salary and studying for my qualifications in my spare time. I am in no way scared of hard graft and fully appreciate I may need to start out doing office admin or bookkeeping or maybe something completely different.
My Institute have a reciprocal agreement with Canada and I can obtain my CPA designation relatively quickly and by sitting a short multiple-choice test. Yes I don’t know the Canadian system but I’m capable of learning.
My partners line of work doesn’t have the same hurdle as me, but again he appreciates he may have to step down to step back up.
Yes we are comfortable in the UK however we cannot progress our careers any further in our current area. The option for us in the UK would be to move to London for the majority of tech/research/innovation opportunities – I go to London every few months and would never live there and this isn’t due to a cost of living issue. We can’t do comfortable from now until retirement age (looking like 90?) it’s just not us.
Just to calm the nerves of a certain few: -
When we move over we will have enough money to live including rent, food etc for 2-3 months. In this time we aim to find a longer term rental in the correct area and hopefully get some sort of a job. After that 2-3 months we will then have substantial savings to fall back on to, however we are not entertaining this in our mind just to make sure we don’t become complaisant.
We do own a home in the UK however my sister is willing to move in and rent for a while and if we make the move permanent will buy this from us. We are not torching any potential return to the UK – we are not afraid to cut our losses and say well we tried.
Haha Oink, classic – venture holidays, done enough of them thanks – you’re not making a generalisation that I’m of a certain age, trying to find myself and boost my Insta followers, are you?! I’m just like any other Kant trying to better themselves where possible.
Just to highlight my original post however "I would really appreciate any personal experiences/thoughts/ideas/comments etc. on any of the locations I have mentioned". In no way have I asked for people to make a personal life decision for myself. Apologies if anyone misunderstood and wanted to take on this burden!
I do believe a few of the posters here need to think, would an accountant and physicist really make an uncalculated decision based on no research what so ever. I wanted to keep my intro brief, however just for additional background – I got my first job at 18, no going to Uni just getting stuck in, working full time on an apprentice salary and studying for my qualifications in my spare time. I am in no way scared of hard graft and fully appreciate I may need to start out doing office admin or bookkeeping or maybe something completely different.
My Institute have a reciprocal agreement with Canada and I can obtain my CPA designation relatively quickly and by sitting a short multiple-choice test. Yes I don’t know the Canadian system but I’m capable of learning.
My partners line of work doesn’t have the same hurdle as me, but again he appreciates he may have to step down to step back up.
Yes we are comfortable in the UK however we cannot progress our careers any further in our current area. The option for us in the UK would be to move to London for the majority of tech/research/innovation opportunities – I go to London every few months and would never live there and this isn’t due to a cost of living issue. We can’t do comfortable from now until retirement age (looking like 90?) it’s just not us.
Just to calm the nerves of a certain few: -
When we move over we will have enough money to live including rent, food etc for 2-3 months. In this time we aim to find a longer term rental in the correct area and hopefully get some sort of a job. After that 2-3 months we will then have substantial savings to fall back on to, however we are not entertaining this in our mind just to make sure we don’t become complaisant.
We do own a home in the UK however my sister is willing to move in and rent for a while and if we make the move permanent will buy this from us. We are not torching any potential return to the UK – we are not afraid to cut our losses and say well we tried.
Haha Oink, classic – venture holidays, done enough of them thanks – you’re not making a generalisation that I’m of a certain age, trying to find myself and boost my Insta followers, are you?! I’m just like any other Kant trying to better themselves where possible.
Jan 31st 2018, 8:49 am
#53
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 181
Re: BC vs ON
Look into childcare costs - without family at hand you can be shelling out $2k+ a month for a couple of kiddos in Vancouver or BC as a whole. That's if you can even find somewhere.
That said it's not that much better here in Edinburgh...
That said it's not that much better here in Edinburgh...
Jan 31st 2018, 8:53 am
#54
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 181
Re: BC vs ON
as someone considering a move back to BC, I'd genuinely love hear your comparison of the Canadian / BC school system vs the British one.
Jan 31st 2018, 5:21 pm
#55
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Feb 2014
Location: Done with condescending old hags
Posts: 1,194
Re: BC vs ON
This continues at university, where undergrads study many more smaller courses (so whereas a UK uni student might have 4 year-long modules per year, a Canadian could have 10 modules for that year, each a semester long, and would be more likely to draw them from anthropology, english, introduction to astrophysics, psychology, history, etc).
Testing is more continuous, with things like in-class quizzes, participation grades, etc.
I think from the perspective of a north American, the UK system looks like it's still designed around 'this is your place in life and this is how you'll be well trained for it', while to Brits, the Canadian system can look like 'study stuff. Just.... stuff. What do you mean aimed at something?'.
In terms of outcomes... I'm in law school, and my Canadian classmates all seem perfectly intelligent, well-educated people. (This is one of the fundamentally different subjects, where in Canada law can, outside Quebec, only be studied as a second-entry degree, there is no first-undergraduate entry, it's professional training).
Last edited by Vulcanoid; Jan 31st 2018 at 5:23 pm.
Jan 31st 2018, 5:54 pm
#56
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 181
Re: BC vs ON
My partner went through the BC school system, and we compare them sometimes for mutual needling - so far as we can tell, Canadian schools can be much larger (there were as many people in his graduating class as in my entire secondary school), and education is much broader, with less specialization - so eg at 17, UK students have cut down from 10-11 GCSE subjects to 3-4 A-levels, Canadian students will still be doing something like 7-10.
This continues at university, where undergrads study many more smaller courses (so whereas a UK uni student might have 4 year-long modules per year, a Canadian could have 10 modules for that year, each a semester long, and would be more likely to draw them from anthropology, english, introduction to astrophysics, psychology, history, etc).
Testing is more continuous, with things like in-class quizzes, participation grades, etc.
I think from the perspective of a north American, the UK system looks like it's still designed around 'this is your place in life and this is how you'll be well trained for it', while to Brits, the Canadian system can look like 'study stuff. Just.... stuff. What do you mean aimed at something?'.
In terms of outcomes... I'm in law school, and my Canadian classmates all seem perfectly intelligent, well-educated people. (This is one of the fundamentally different subjects, where in Canada law can, outside Quebec, only be studied as a second-entry degree, there is no first-undergraduate entry, it's professional training).
This continues at university, where undergrads study many more smaller courses (so whereas a UK uni student might have 4 year-long modules per year, a Canadian could have 10 modules for that year, each a semester long, and would be more likely to draw them from anthropology, english, introduction to astrophysics, psychology, history, etc).
Testing is more continuous, with things like in-class quizzes, participation grades, etc.
I think from the perspective of a north American, the UK system looks like it's still designed around 'this is your place in life and this is how you'll be well trained for it', while to Brits, the Canadian system can look like 'study stuff. Just.... stuff. What do you mean aimed at something?'.
In terms of outcomes... I'm in law school, and my Canadian classmates all seem perfectly intelligent, well-educated people. (This is one of the fundamentally different subjects, where in Canada law can, outside Quebec, only be studied as a second-entry degree, there is no first-undergraduate entry, it's professional training).
Jan 31st 2018, 7:36 pm
#57
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 0
Re: BC vs ON
I have mostly lived in BC, but also spent time in Ontario (Port Hope/Coburg area as well as Whitby.)
For BC, I am lumping Vancouver and Fraser Valley into one.
ON was nice, found it easier to get around without a car as there was a decent regional transit system, as well as Via Rail, where in BC there is less regional transit, and no Via Rail option.
Rent was a bit cheaper in ON but wasn't any easier to find a place, vacancy rates seemed low.
I found there was more to do in ON, take a train for the day somewhere, go to Toronto for the day etc, where Vancouver you pretty much need a car to do anything outside the city.
Healthcare was more difficult to access in ON, less walk in clinics from what I could tell, and nearly impossible to find a GP, I never found one, and the service offered to wait list for one and be notified took almost 3 years to get a call, by that time I had left ON.
I found food a bit cheaper overall in ON, and gas at the time seemed cheaper although I did not drive there.
Weather is more mild in winter in Vancouver, but more rain, but more snow in ON.
Summers I find nicer in Vancouver, less humid and more tolerable.
Easier to access the US from Vancouver.
For BC, I am lumping Vancouver and Fraser Valley into one.
ON was nice, found it easier to get around without a car as there was a decent regional transit system, as well as Via Rail, where in BC there is less regional transit, and no Via Rail option.
Rent was a bit cheaper in ON but wasn't any easier to find a place, vacancy rates seemed low.
I found there was more to do in ON, take a train for the day somewhere, go to Toronto for the day etc, where Vancouver you pretty much need a car to do anything outside the city.
Healthcare was more difficult to access in ON, less walk in clinics from what I could tell, and nearly impossible to find a GP, I never found one, and the service offered to wait list for one and be notified took almost 3 years to get a call, by that time I had left ON.
I found food a bit cheaper overall in ON, and gas at the time seemed cheaper although I did not drive there.
Weather is more mild in winter in Vancouver, but more rain, but more snow in ON.
Summers I find nicer in Vancouver, less humid and more tolerable.
Easier to access the US from Vancouver.
Feb 1st 2018, 12:07 am
#58
Assimilated Pauper
Joined: Mar 2005
Location: Ontario
Posts: 40,018
Re: BC vs ON
It may be easier from Vancouver but K-W is close enough that people go to the Walden Galleria shopping for the day, to the football or ice hockey for the evening and routinely fly from the Buffalo or Detroit airports. People who want fashionable clothing go to the collections around Detroit and people who want cheap clothing go to the discount mall near Flint. K-W is close enough to America for most purposes.
Feb 1st 2018, 4:03 am
#59
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: Maryland (via Belfast, Manchester, Toronto and London)
Posts: 4,802
Re: BC vs ON
Not sure I agree with that. I doubt there's enough of a difference for that to be a factor. The GTA is reasonably close to the US border. There are many flights out of Toronto to US cities on the east coast that are really just a short hop away. For example, just 1.5 hrs to Washington DC. Then there is New York, Boston, Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, etc.
Feb 1st 2018, 4:33 am
#60
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 0
Re: BC vs ON
Not sure I agree with that. I doubt there's enough of a difference for that to be a factor. The GTA is reasonably close to the US border. There are many flights out of Toronto to US cities on the east coast that are really just a short hop away. For example, just 1.5 hrs to Washington DC. Then there is New York, Boston, Chicago, Detroit, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, etc.