perkinsgap

hi
iam moving to sasaktoon
at the end of oct and what to buy a 4wd and i am not sure which one to buy for the best overall value can anyone help
thank you Garren

iaink

Unless you live on a farm and want to drive out to the "back 40" I wouldnt bother. They use more gas, they have a higher center of gravity, they are less manouverable, more likely to roll over and more likely to kill anything/body else they hit. Many dont even have independent suspension, so you get bounced all over the road too.

I used to have a Jeep, so its not just green sympaties here, I have tried both side of the fence. The vast majority of canadians drive front wheel drive cars. If you are really worried about the weather, or absolutely have to get to work come Hell or High Water then get an Audi or a Subaru, your back and bank balance will thank you for it later. Remember too, 4x4 may help you get going in icy conditions, but it does absolutely bugger all to help you stop, so you just slide into the ditch going faster. Tires are just as important as drive train in my opinion, if not more important.

Remember too, Canadians are well practiced at clearing the roads, the number of times you will have to drive in snow deep enough that the ground clearance of a 4x4 becomes helpfull will probably be counted on the fingers of no hands!

Iain

MikeUK

If its the weather your worried about... forget the 4X4

Think snow/ice tyres and spend what you can afford....

The 4x4 is fine if you intend to drive around the in the north and off the main tracks, and plan to do this on a regular basis... otherwise its a waste of money.. both Gas and insurance

However if its really the outdoors your after... then you should allready know which size, engine, gear setup suits your needs best..

owen

2 options really
1. go and get a big american beast and keep it 4 months to get it out of your system and get a normal car
2. really need 4x4 go for the subaru forester or out-back (the turbo is fun!! )

iaink

Whats wrong with the Legacy? Outback is overblown and overpriced. Give me a Legacy GT any day over an Outback. The problem with the turbos is they need premium gas, and insurance is a lot more. My boss (also from UK originally) just got a new turbo Forrester XT, and its scarry fast :scared: . I have an old style, pre turbo legacy GT, I really like it, although I only get to drive it in the winter, I just wish my wife hadnt talked me into an automatic. If I didnt absolutely have to be at work, then I wouldnt even bother with the extra expense of AWD over FWD anyway.

Smokey

For the most part I would tend to agree with the other posters here in that you simply don't need one in Saskatoon. You don't get (usually) the HUGE snow dumps like you get in Ontario and they keep the roads very well cleared and gritted. We had a Ford Taurus and had no problems last year so unless you're going somewhere off the beaten track the I wouldn't bother.

That said, when we arived here in Gull Lake, in the middle of winter, we had a lot of trouble getting the truck (a two wheel drive) in and out of the back lane and out of the garden. Problem was here that we had a couple of thaws and some freezing rain so there was about 4-5 inches of solid ice over our yard. The streets were worse as they don't get cleared so around 6 plus inches of ice covered by grit so we did buy a 4X4. Be interesting to see what difference it makes.

iaink

Problem with a 2wd truck is they are all rear wheel drive, and without a load in the bed there is little weight to push the wheels down to help with traction. Plus truck engines generate a lot of torque, so combine that with poor traction at the driven wheels and its a bad winter combination. One alternative is to slighly deflate tire pressures to increase the contact patch, and chuck a few bags of sand in the back to increase the weight over the wheels if you have to get about in a RWD truck. 4x4 should be a lot better, but make sure the surface is slippy enough before engaging it in 4x4 mode, otherwise you will get "scrubbing" and the potential for transmission damage when you go around corners with the center differential locked The nice thing about AWD is you dont have to worry if there is enough slip to engage it in 4x4 as its designed to operate all the time anyway. The down side is you have the extra friction from the extra drive components being engaged all the time, so you dont get the same mpg as 2WD in the dry.

MikeUK

Another option is to look for 'Auto' 4x4 option these appear on may of the newer 4x4 SUV's as standard and will engage and dis-enage the rear drive system when its detects slipage on the front wheels...
This this great when transfering from normal (ploughed) roads onto the back country snowy or icy roads as it only kicks in when needed

iaink

Yep, its a whole mess of terminoligy, 4x4, Auto 4x4, AWD, part time, full time, command trac, etc etc. front rear and center Locking differentials, , viscous couplings, torsen diffs, clutch packs. Not surprised its confusing Anyone entering this minefield is well advised to figure out all this in advance as most sales people wont be a lot of help figuring out what you need.

But the basic advice seems to be that you really dont need 4x4 capability if you are not going to live off the beaten track like the 98% of SUV owners who have no intention of tackling anything trickier than the odd unpaved road.

MikeUK

Yep. we have our because we got nearly got stuck a couple of winters ago tackling that unpaved road in mid Jan...(out on a mountain road ona skiing holiday) it hadn't started snow when we set out. but when we came back it was over the front bumper... so now we drive an SUV and I can still use all my back routes and explore .. but I don't need it... I never needed it to get to work even at the worst parts of last winter... I only ever used mine in a vengeance for play either on muddy back roads in northern Ontario or out on ice and snow in winter and then we don't push it and keep the 4x4 for getting out of trouble.

A good case was put forward by my father in law.. if you need to use 4x4 to get somewhere and then get stuck.. nobody will come in and get you out.. you drive in 2wd and only use the 4x4 to get out of trouble.. I’ve also heard this from the snow plough drivers as well…

Purley

You are right. Lots and lots and lots of people have SUVs here. They have them because they WANT them - not because they NEED them. I have a Hyundai Elantra. When the warranty runs out I am probably going to trade it on a Hyunda Santa Fe. I need an SUV like a hole in the head. But I will still probably get one, just because I fancy one.

That being said, last winter I was sliding all over the place. Had almost brand new all season radials on the Elantra. I couldn't stop at intersections in the ice. I couldn't get through deep snow. I went to Bell Tire and got myself a set of Cavalier - I think they said they are made by Michelin - winter tires. $318 installed for all four tires. It was like night and day. I think it was the best $300 I have ever spent.

In southern Sask last winter we got at least three big dumps of snow - deep enough that I couldn't get the car out of the garage without shovelling. It was at least 2 feet deep in front of the garage door.

Subarus are great. Its just that lots of people in Regina don't like the Auto Gallery dealership. They got done for rolling back odometers years ago. I am sure they don't do that any more, its just that they are high pressure and lots of people wont buy from them. My son's bro in law went to Castlegar or somewhere to buy his Sabaru Outback because he wouldn't buy from Auto Gallery. Don't know who the dealer is in Saskatoon.

If you fancy an SUV, the Toyota RAV4 is nice and the 4 Runner or whatever its called now. The Nissan is nice - I think they have the X-trail and the X-terra. I personally like the Hyundai Santa Fe. I had wonderful service from the Hyundai dealer so that affects my opinion. If you thought you NEED an SUV in Saskatoon but would be happy with a car - then get winter tires put on and change to your regular all seasons in the spring.

iaink

The Automotive makers just LOVE SUVs. They cant believe there luck that so many people will pay so much for what is basically a truck with a body instead of a bed. Every Lincoln Navigator sold makes Ford ~$20k in profit! Its probably the single most profitable vehicle in history.

In the case of the "cute utes" they are basically rebodied small/ midsize car platforms with raised suspensions, and a sticker price raised to match, so not only are you paying more for insurance and gas, the purchase price is out of line too, and the cost to the environment is going to be pretty steep too as they are classified more often than not as light trucks, so do not have to meet the emmisions standards of cars. Thats another reason the car makers love them. My main concern though was over road holding and manouverability to get out of imminent trouble. Even a Porsche Cayenne struggles to get close to the handling of a regular run of the mill car. You cant argue with a high center of gravity.

Personally I wouldnt give them the pleasure, I've had my SUV experience and have moved on to smaller and better things.

MikeUK

totally agree.... mine handles like a brick... stops like hot sh1t on a greased shovel....

mind you I did hunt for a manual and that helps...

but then again I did spend my time in the UK driving around in a sup'ed up mini so comparisions aren't allways fair....

But In my opinion they handle a lot like a mid sized bedford van

but having said that they do go where I couldn't take a car before...

perkinsgap

right i asked what 4wd should i buy not why i should not

iaink

Suit yourself. Hopefully you got the message that its totaly unnessessary to have one, but its your money, even if its everyones environment. Just hope you dont hit me in it. Cant really pick one for best overall value as none of them are good value IMO.

How much $$$$$$ do you have to spend on it?

Is fuel economy at all important?

Will it just be for show or for real off road use?

4x4, 4WD, AWD?

How many people/ how much stuff will you be moving in it?

Does image matter as much as value for money?

Tell us something usefull about what you want it for and Ill throw some names out there. Could be anything from a Hummer at one end of the scale through Range Rovers, Ford Explorers, Jimmys, Cute Utes, Jeep TJs, 4x4 pickup trucks down to the humble Yugo, although I dont think there are any circumstances to recomend one of them!