Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Or just get your track and trace sorted. Such low numbers in Melbourne now, a good track and trace system should be able to track down this lot.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

We're dealing with ****wits, in terms of the spreaders in such cases.

And the infected ****wits, faced with $5000 fines, however richly deserved, will just clam up in a contact tracing interview unless assured that those fines are off the table. And it's worth far more, in health and economic benefit terms, **at the moment**, to have the ****wits' movement and contact data, than it is to have them clam up.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

I agree, I know it's hard for Dan to give away control, but "FREE VICTORIA" even it's for clam up sake.

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Yep likely receive no fine, and now the butcher shop manager where the Covid infected cleaner works is in intensive care:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/v...08-p56335.html

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Meanwhile The Feds continue to keep up as in the days of the convict colony. Near impossible to leave. Only advanced Western nation to do so. Good to see Victoria getting on top of their game. Especially seeing some statesmanship at such a time. Something very under appreciated on a forum as this. Obviously errors have been made but nothing along the lines of UK or USA.

QLD's handling of the virus looks set to ensure a continuation of same government. Same in WA. Just shows that the population respects statesmanship being displayed by leaders at such a time.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Mis-information unless New Zealand isn't a western country, however I do agree, keeping the borders shut, state and international is insular.

You can leave, on your form say 3 months or longer. Easy peasy.

Bit ironic you talk negatively about international borders then applaud state borders. No surprise I guess as a Labor party member.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Unlike some that appear on here I am not affiliated with any party. I consider both main parties differ little on important issues impacting this nation. All are beholden to vested interests and little if anything will stop the rot will get worse.
Not ironic. Countries in EU have closed sections and cities down. The difference being none have closed borders to leave.

Such a situation should hardly be surprising in a country with few guaranteed rights, I guess.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

So what's your stance? The EU model or the Australian model?

Obviously the EU model is not proving successful in fighting COVID and the Australian model is but there's many more facets to life than COVID.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Or it's the same old same old in that the opposition is poor. I'd happily see the back of Palaszczuk but the LNP are shite and Deb Frecklington is not someone I ever want to see in control of anything. Better the devil you know etc. Palaszczuk may have 'saved' us from COVID but it's impossible to tell what would have happened if she hadn't taken the steps she has. I think you're giving her more credit than she deserves.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Palaszczuk is just awful but as you rightly say, got to have some else worth voting for. I don't know why Gladys keeps getting drawn into discussion about her. If she wants to play politics with the borders and the QLD ecomomy let her. Maybe Gladys is sick and tired of being the only contributor towards jobkeeper/ seeker with Victoria off the grid.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

I see Deb is not offering up anything different on the border front. Both know there's too many voting rednecks in QLD who don't get how to balance COVID and life. Indeed better the devil you know.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

My stance being neither ALP nor Liberal in the run of things. If referring purely to Corona Virus then ALP State Governments have set a high bench mark.
But obviously coming from a WA state point of view somewhat colours perceptions, with this state being almost unrecognizable being in 'a crisis'.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Not really. Her stance is hardly unique among the ALP states. I have no real opinion of her outside of virus management but the LNP know, historically a few things about rounding up the redneck vote. QLD, by nature, if less so than past days, tends towards conservative politics. Palaszczuk has managed to harness, by appearances all sides of the QLD divide. Or enough to matter, that will allow a retention of power.
Politics in Australia is hardly a positive experience which ever way you chose to look at it. Hardly alone on that front

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

So how about the redneck Trump supporters that agree with Trump it is only akin to a 'little cold'? Have they the correct balance?

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

I am not sure what you are on about.

You were complaining about Australian international borders, praising state borders, commenting on country borders in Europe and referring to cities in lockdown in Europe.

It is still not clear what your stance is?

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

How about them?

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I'm not too sure (will have to check) but I think that 'redneck Trump supporters' don't get to vote in Australian State elections

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

My stance is what is appearing to be the correct procedure at the moment. But with the allowance of people to leave the country at will. They must, in doing so, face the consequences, if wanting to return.
It has been commented that Australia may well be entering negative growth in population, or even a decline. First time since 1916 I believe.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

But they do in their own jurisdiction (you may need to check that as well) which was obviously what I referred to.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

So you consider they possess 'the right balance'?

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

They have a better balance than a Chairman Dan lockdown.

The sad part is, the redneck general aligns with far right wing values and yet Palaszczuk is jumping on that bandwagon to secure votes leaving the values of her party behind.

She is a fake and a disgrace.

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A bit of a shame you are unable to articulate the problem beyond Murdoch terminology. Andrews is no Chairman. He is part and parcel of the overall rot overall where both parties are irrelevant
to the solution, as things stand. Hence the rise of far right wing and or red neck popularism.

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New Zealand does not have a travel ban for citizens or PRs. It just has a do not travel advisory like many others.

It has quarantine on arrival, but that's not what the troubadour was referring to.

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So it doesn't prevent people leaving. So that makes Australia the only country in the democratic world to have restrictions then. Quarantine, of course is
the procedure in numerous countries.

What I was contemplating was the lack of A Bill of Rights in Australia does make us potentially experiencing less freedoms than most the democratic world,
if the powers that be, will it to be so.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

OK then Australia looks like the only country where a reason needs to be submitted. We should be free to travel without filling out the forms, which is very expansive and really just eliminates the month long holiday in Europe or the week long piss up in Bali. Still it should be our choice.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

I believe they call him Dictator Dan, either way its correct. They guy is a control freak and protecting the police against having to manage zones differently and their role in advising for private security. Can't see him surviving.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

We mustn't forget that Australia used to be a penal colony. Welcome to the good prison ship Australia! :eek:

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If the states remove the cap capper then we can leave with filling out forms.

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??????

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Too many people wanting to get back, not enough flights because of state caps, creating lots of hardship. Govt are making it harder to leave for short trips not to bombard the "getting back" situation.

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The travel ban was in place before hotel quarantine was a thing and months before the arrival caps were introduced. So no, that's not the reason it exists.

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Yep. The travel ban was one of the first things introduced and the caps are just another reason to keep it in place. Remove the caps, which are as crazy as the travel ban, then those reasons to keep the travel ban in place diminish.

The caps also give airlines are reason to reduce international service, killing airline jobs, and making hard, almost impossible for people to get back from places like Europe.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

I assumed that was what you had been trying to say, but always better to clarify than assume.

With quarantining in hotels and the need to monitor returning travellers, I can understand the need to cap the number of returnees. Hopefully, some of the new rapid testing with prove reliable enough to increase caps / reduce the need for quarantining. Unfortunately, as people cannot be trusted to do the right thing without enforced quarantine, I cannot see that changing for the near future (particularly with the increasing levels of infection being seen in Europe and elsewhere).

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

BinaxNow being tested on Trump. Looks like he's the guinea pig for Regeneron too. $5 a pop results in 15 minutes. A far better short term investment than the vaccine.

There is plenty more scope for quarantine in Australia. Time to open up Melbourne to carry the quarantine load - I am sure they have learned from their mistakes.

Its all about risk management, not risk avoidance. Too many upsides to outward and inward overseas travel not to move forward NOW.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Considering the infection rate the paramount task was prevention of losing control of numbers. This appears to have been achieved. Who can tell over the longer period if this situation prevails? He's no more a control freak than all too many in position these days.
I have already brought to attention the ease that 'rights' can be eroded and worse for the individual, within the context of the lack of any proclaimed rights set down in writing in Australia.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Great advertising for that product. Trust Trump is on a retainer. Hardly the man to allow a business opportunity to slip away surely? Time to open up Melbourne? Not quite. Time returning travellers could be gradually increased.
'Opening up' should be a distant point. Melbourne deserves a breather from population growth excess of the preceding years.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Now his chief of staff (not sure correct term) has quit after it was found out that after denying it at the hotel quarantine enquiry, phone records on the day the decision was made to use private guards show that he did call the chief of police.

Interesting that even though he doesn't remember calling the chief of police, he does remember that he never talked to the chief of police at all about using private securty guards. Selective memory right there.

As for Andrews it seems that he doesn't have a Covid plan other than his 'road map' which set unrealistic targets of not easing restrictions until we get under 5 new cases a day in Melbourne. That doesn't look like happening anytime soon, so for want of any better plan he just keeps the stage 4 lockdown going. The new health minister early on after he was put in was spruiking a new "whizz bang" contact tracing system. However I have seen/heard him being asked about it a couple of times since, and he just does that politician speak thing of evading the question.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

The truth is the Chairman is going for elimination. Somehow the concept of juggling COVID without destroying everything else is unthinkable for this guy.

We saw his ambition in wave 1. It failed. He doesn't learn.

Re: Melbourne Metro restrictions
 

Not quite. Dan Andrews, please lets get over the Murdoch terminology, has stated clearly, elimination may indeed not be viable. .He certainly has learnt. But best remembered Victoria is unlike elsewhere in Australia, both in fatalities and virus numbers.

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Surely repeated memory failure on the part of a senior politician or a senior bureaucrat, in the face of questioning from "counsel assisting" a Royal Commission or an ICAC-like body, and in particular in the face of compromising evidence, should be decisively career-ending. At least Eccles did the decent thing in the end, and resigned.

Now on to Gladys Berejiklian. The legal argument in her defence is apparently that she was never "intimate" with Daryl even when they were bumping uglies, and even though he was trafficking alleged access to her (office) to his mates. But hey presto, Gladys and Daryl never 'commingled' their bank accounts, therefore they were never 'intimate' in ICAC legal terms.

Only in NSW, but hey, whatever.

However, the truly excrutiating part of Gladys' testimony to ICAC was not her denial of "intimacy" with Daryl.. Instead, it was her absolutely astounding and relentlessly repeated loss of memory, when faced with questions about her knowledge of Daryl's financial situation, and his endless schemes to improve upon it, and her potential intersection with those schemes as Premier.

Truly love made her blind (and more conveniently, deaf and forgetful), even though ICAC's counsel assisting did his best to jog her memory with actual recordings of the calls...