Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Apr 28th 2011 | 4:33 pm
#1
Thread Starter
I'm Old Gregg!
Joined: Mar 2009
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From: A Former Bogan Colony in QLD
Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Apr 28th 2011 | 4:51 pm
#2
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 11,948
From: Adelaide, South Australia
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
The wedding of William and Kate on Friday will be a joke, a hopelessly overhyped celebration of an absurdly undemocratic system, writes SPIEGEL London correspondent Marco Evers.
This was wrong, though:
there are no citizens, just subjects.
On 1 January 1983, upon the coming into force of the British Nationality Act 1981, every Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies became either a British Citizen, British Dependent Territories Citizen or British Overseas Citizen.
The use of the term "British subject" was discontinued for all persons who fell into these categories, or who had a national citizenship of any other part of the Commonwealth. The category of "British subjects" now includes only those people formerly known as "British subjects without citizenship", and no other. In statutes passed before 1 January 1983, however, references to "British subjects" continue to be read as if they referred to "Commonwealth citizens".
British citizens are not British subjects under the 1981 Act. The only circumstance where a person may be both a British subject and British citizen simultaneously is a case where a British subject connected with Ireland (s. 31 of the 1981 Act) acquires British citizenship by naturalisation or registration. In this case only, British subject status is not lost upon acquiring British citizenship.
The status of British subject cannot now be transmitted by descent, and will become extinct when all existing British subjects are dead.
The use of the term "British subject" was discontinued for all persons who fell into these categories, or who had a national citizenship of any other part of the Commonwealth. The category of "British subjects" now includes only those people formerly known as "British subjects without citizenship", and no other. In statutes passed before 1 January 1983, however, references to "British subjects" continue to be read as if they referred to "Commonwealth citizens".
British citizens are not British subjects under the 1981 Act. The only circumstance where a person may be both a British subject and British citizen simultaneously is a case where a British subject connected with Ireland (s. 31 of the 1981 Act) acquires British citizenship by naturalisation or registration. In this case only, British subject status is not lost upon acquiring British citizenship.
The status of British subject cannot now be transmitted by descent, and will become extinct when all existing British subjects are dead.
Last edited by Vash the Stampede; Apr 28th 2011 at 4:53 pm.
Apr 28th 2011 | 5:12 pm
#3
Rhino with a big horn!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,117
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Apart from the actual insanity of the whole thing I think it's a stretch to say that Diana wasn't sane when she got married. 
Apr 28th 2011 | 5:16 pm
#4
Rhino with a big horn!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,117
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Not sure what axe you think he was grinding. He made some good points. Whether he was wrong on the subject citizenship thing depends on whether you think the UK immigration department controls the definition for general usage beyond its remit.
Apr 28th 2011 | 6:24 pm
#5
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 11,948
From: Adelaide, South Australia
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
No it doesn't. He was wrong on the subject/citizenship thing, full stop. It doesn't depend on anything, and it has nothing to do with the immigration department. He was just plain wrong. British citizens are not subjects. They're citizens.
Apr 28th 2011 | 6:50 pm
#6
Rhino with a big horn!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,117
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
I think it's a stretch to say she was ever sane at all. The woman was a complete basket case, and a hopelessly bad example to her children.
No it doesn't. He was wrong on the subject/citizenship thing, full stop. It doesn't depend on anything, and it has nothing to do with the immigration department. He was just plain wrong. British citizens are not subjects. They're citizens.
No it doesn't. He was wrong on the subject/citizenship thing, full stop. It doesn't depend on anything, and it has nothing to do with the immigration department. He was just plain wrong. British citizens are not subjects. They're citizens.
Semantics. The UK immigration defines subjects and citizens on a time basis. Why should time make a difference? The change was obviously the result of a technical difficulty they were having. Especially re Hong Kong. Traditionally monarchs have subjects.
Last edited by Rambi; Apr 28th 2011 at 6:56 pm.
Apr 28th 2011 | 9:14 pm
#7
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Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
I now live in the UK;but it is all driving me bonkers--I'm going to cut the grass and drink tea in protest.Though I do wish the couple every happiness.
Apr 28th 2011 | 9:59 pm
#8
Lost in BE Cyberspace
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From: Somewhere South... Not Telling YOU
Apr 29th 2011 | 1:43 am
#9
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Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Excellent article, thanks for posting it Broad Shoulders. Although, I do wish the couple all the best.
Apr 29th 2011 | 6:25 pm
#10
Rhino with a big horn!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,117
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
I never thought about it before but someone pointed it out in an article the other day that it's now extremely likely the next head of state will be a man. I guess that's a big plus for system that it gives priority to men. 
Apr 29th 2011 | 7:53 pm
#11
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 10,959
From: Somewhere South... Not Telling YOU
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Yep, men have been hard done by in todays politically corrwct gone mad climate... Lets hope a male head of state allows all our men to man up and grow a spine....
Apr 29th 2011 | 8:27 pm
#12
Rhino with a big horn!
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,117
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
Thank fook she's kept away from meddling with Aus.
Apr 29th 2011 | 9:23 pm
#13
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 9,668
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
As for the article, even without the semantics about citizens or subjects, I agree with it all.
Having some dictator at my child's wedding because it is 'politic' to do so would enrage me.
Apr 29th 2011 | 9:56 pm
#14
Thread Starter
I'm Old Gregg!
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 8,460
From: A Former Bogan Colony in QLD
Apr 29th 2011 | 10:42 pm
#15
Lost in BE Cyberspace
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From: Hill overlooking the SE Melbourne suburbs
Re: Geez, someone's got an axe to grind!
I think that's a bit harsh. She was an excellent example to her kids, her landmine cause and other charity work, her patience and dedication as a mother, her support of the arts, holding the hand of AIDS patients etc.... her kids had a good mother by all accounts and I imagine they're fairly stable because of their upbringing. And I think she was certainly sane, but she had her issues. It's hard to see how someone from her background could have come through childhood without them.
She was a sloane teenager when she got married. I don't think she was any saint and quite manipulative. And people who single her out as the 'good Royal' out of a bad bunch and then put the knife into less glamourous rivals seem a bit star-struck, especially when it suits their Royal politics.
I don't think she was even particularly beautiful - perhaps striking.
