Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
Aug 24th 2007, 2:36 am
#48
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
we seem to celebrate scotland and ireland more I have worked in many places where both st andrews day and st patricks day have been celebrated but st george completely forgotten about and thats in England
Aug 24th 2007, 2:40 am
#49
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
Aug 24th 2007, 2:42 am
#50
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
You should be in your bed big yin! 
Aug 24th 2007, 12:48 pm
#55
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
Hey Soapy, its probably because Britains split but together.
I believe I'm Scottish/Irish and have little time for England or Wales.(to a lesser degree). Before you all jump in and abuse me, let me explain. I believe English ppl think Britain is England and it has been said over here although not intentionally. An apology soon follows when I look at them with a disgusted look.
Scotland has a religious problem and many of the guys I know would rather support Ireland as they look at Scotland as a country which has shown blatant discrimination towards their fore-fathers. This has changed somewhat over the years but still does go on. If Scotland could get rid of the secterianism and all live as one then just maybe. I think if Scotland gained independence then you would see a rise in pride towards their country. Go on the SNP.
I believe I'm Scottish/Irish and have little time for England or Wales.(to a lesser degree). Before you all jump in and abuse me, let me explain. I believe English ppl think Britain is England and it has been said over here although not intentionally. An apology soon follows when I look at them with a disgusted look. Scotland has a religious problem and many of the guys I know would rather support Ireland as they look at Scotland as a country which has shown blatant discrimination towards their fore-fathers. This has changed somewhat over the years but still does go on. If Scotland could get rid of the secterianism and all live as one then just maybe. I think if Scotland gained independence then you would see a rise in pride towards their country. Go on the SNP.
Aug 24th 2007, 7:57 pm
#56
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
I am also well educated, and I have a 1930s facsimile edition of Boswell's Life of Johnson on my bookshelf. Nuff said?
The Bierce quote did require Google, though. I'm a Bierce fan, but I don't make a habit of memorising his work.
The Bierce quote did require Google, though. I'm a Bierce fan, but I don't make a habit of memorising his work.
Aug 24th 2007, 10:59 pm
#57
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,555
Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
On the contrary, Cronulla was about racism; not patriotism. Yes, a few idiots people waved Aussie flags. So what? All this means is that Mr Johnson's was dead right.
Villains cry "patriotism" when they wish to disguise their true motivation.
I'd be interested to hear your definition of "right".
Serious question.
Villains cry "patriotism" when they wish to disguise their true motivation.
I'd be interested to hear your definition of "right".
Serious question.
As you point out the racists and nationalists associate themselves with patriotism. Wouldn't it be great if the racists like Pauline Hanson, the BNP and the Nazis didn't have patriotism as a recruitment tool.
As what to what is the right level of patriotism. I've not ever seen it. I find the notion of nationhood an artificial making of man. Compared to community I find patriotism irrelevant. My country of birth and passport is of no importance compared to what I do.
Aug 24th 2007, 11:21 pm
#58
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
Hey Soapy, its probably because Britains split but together. I believe I'm Scottish/Irish and have little time for England or Wales.(to a lesser degree). Before you all jump in and abuse me, let me explain. I believe English ppl think Britain is England and it has been said over here although not intentionally. An apology soon follows when I look at them with a disgusted look. Scotland has a religious problem and many of the guys I know would rather support Ireland as they look at Scotland as a country which has shown blatant discrimination towards their fore-fathers. This has changed somewhat over the years but still does go on. If Scotland could get rid of the secterianism and all live as one then just maybe. I think if Scotland gained independence then you would see a rise in pride towards their country. Go on the SNP.
I believe I'm Scottish/Irish and have little time for England or Wales.(to a lesser degree). Before you all jump in and abuse me, let me explain. I believe English ppl think Britain is England and it has been said over here although not intentionally. An apology soon follows when I look at them with a disgusted look. Scotland has a religious problem and many of the guys I know would rather support Ireland as they look at Scotland as a country which has shown blatant discrimination towards their fore-fathers. This has changed somewhat over the years but still does go on. If Scotland could get rid of the secterianism and all live as one then just maybe. I think if Scotland gained independence then you would see a rise in pride towards their country. Go on the SNP.As for England being Britain, we are probably a bit ignorant sometimes, but we are 80+% of the British population.
Last edited by adiestubbs; Aug 24th 2007 at 11:23 pm.
Aug 24th 2007, 11:22 pm
#59
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
Aug 24th 2007, 11:30 pm
#60
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Re: Do we celebrate our nationality enough?
The racism, of course. Patriotism is irrelevant to the issue, while nationalism is often little more than a convenient façade for xenophobia. It is most frequently employed by racists and bigots to coat their views with a veneer of respectability.
Of course I did. But it's no reflection on the general Australian patriotism ethic; these people are mere aberrations. They do not represent the majority.
In any case, waving a flag doesn't make you a patriot. It simply makes you a person with a flag. There was nothing patriotic about the behaviour of the lunatics at Cronulla. The moment you start believing that they were motivated by patriotism, you fall for the lie and they have won.
They didn't use patriotism; they used nationalism, which is patriotism gone bad.
But let's indulge your hypothetical... Can you imagine the London Blitz without British patriotism to maintain morale? Can you imagine WWII without the support of Commonwealth nations who felt a patriotic duty to support the mother country? Can you imagine Churchill without patriotism?
Patriotism is like fire; a good servant, but a bad master. In the right hands and the right context, it has tremendous and positive inspirational force. When misused, it tends towards nationalism and becomes the tool of rogues. Either way, it's a fact of life and will always be there.
Interesting. Would you call yourself an existentialist?
I guess you heard about the yobs dressed in the southern cross at the big day out bashing people that would not join in with their "Aussie Aussie Aussie oi oi oi" chants.
In any case, waving a flag doesn't make you a patriot. It simply makes you a person with a flag. There was nothing patriotic about the behaviour of the lunatics at Cronulla. The moment you start believing that they were motivated by patriotism, you fall for the lie and they have won.
As you point out the racists and nationalists associate themselves with patriotism. Wouldn't it be great if the racists like Pauline Hanson, the BNP and the Nazis didn't have patriotism as a recruitment tool.
But let's indulge your hypothetical... Can you imagine the London Blitz without British patriotism to maintain morale? Can you imagine WWII without the support of Commonwealth nations who felt a patriotic duty to support the mother country? Can you imagine Churchill without patriotism?
Patriotism is like fire; a good servant, but a bad master. In the right hands and the right context, it has tremendous and positive inspirational force. When misused, it tends towards nationalism and becomes the tool of rogues. Either way, it's a fact of life and will always be there.
As what to what is the right level of patriotism. I've not ever seen it. I find the notion of nationhood an artificial making of man. Compared to community I find patriotism irrelevant. My country of birth and passport is of no importance compared to what I do.
