DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
May 13th 2009, 6:25 pm
#241
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,708
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Hitler introduced identification documents under the premise of security etc. He ended up using it to identify Jews and trying to wipe them out.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Last edited by Deancm; May 13th 2009 at 6:28 pm.
May 13th 2009, 6:33 pm
#242
Demi-God
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 2,812
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Hitler introduced identification documents under the premise of security etc. He ended up using it to identify Jews and trying to wipe them out.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Fearmongering always precedes the introduction of any new technology. There was a time when people like you feared that travelling at more than 12 miles an hour would be exceedingly dangerous to the health. Before that people feared that they would fall over the edge of the world if they sailed too far from land.
The simple always fear new technology. It's only recently, with the advent of democracy, that anyone has had to listen to them.
May 13th 2009, 6:54 pm
#243
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,188
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
A DNA fingerprint database is useless for racial categorisation. Currently the three original human races that could be identified are so mixed that all markers appear everywhere. In 50 years time the races will be even more mixed.
Fearmongering always precedes the introduction of any new technology. There was a time when people like you feared that travelling at more than 12 miles an hour would be exceedingly dangerous to the health. Before that people feared that they would fall over the edge of the world if they sailed too far from land.
The simple always fear new technology. It's only recently, with the advent of democracy, that anyone has had to listen to them.
Fearmongering always precedes the introduction of any new technology. There was a time when people like you feared that travelling at more than 12 miles an hour would be exceedingly dangerous to the health. Before that people feared that they would fall over the edge of the world if they sailed too far from land.
The simple always fear new technology. It's only recently, with the advent of democracy, that anyone has had to listen to them.
As for eliminating people on race grounds based on DNA then your right probably a non-starter.... but how about eliminating poor 'breeding stock' based on their DNA?.
May 13th 2009, 6:55 pm
#244
Demi-God
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 2,812
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
This has nothing to do with a fear of new technology. Its the sleepwalking into a nationwide system of 'tagging' people that I can't see as something the State should be doing to its citizens that's at issue here...
As for eliminating people on race grounds based on DNA then your right probably a non-starter.... but how about eliminating poor 'breeding stock' based on their DNA?.
As for eliminating people on race grounds based on DNA then your right probably a non-starter.... but how about eliminating poor 'breeding stock' based on their DNA?.
May 13th 2009, 7:09 pm
#246
Account Closed
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,708
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Fearmongering always precedes the introduction of any new technology. There was a time when people like you feared that travelling at more than 12 miles an hour would be exceedingly dangerous to the health. Before that people feared that they would fall over the edge of the world if they sailed too far from land.
It's the intelligent who question these new techs and future possible applications.
Scientists believed that the world was flat until it was proven otherwise. I wonder how science will view DNA in 50 years time.
The simple always fear new technology. It's only recently, with the advent of democracy, that anyone has had to listen to them.
Right now a DNA fingerprint database may be useless for racial categorisation but it is certainly laying the foundations towards a totalitarianism regime.
Last edited by Deancm; May 13th 2009 at 7:21 pm.
May 13th 2009, 7:13 pm
#247
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,397
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Who's this 'we'?. You?. Even if that were the case, and as DNA/Gene testing is still developing would that always be the case?.
As for life insurance regardless of most conditions that's simply not the case. You would be refused by many life insurance companies now if you presented with a whole host of ailments and those that would offer it to you would make it punitively expensive to get... if they had your DNA profile that said you MIGHT go on to develop a life threatening disease do you think it reasonable that you should then pay double, treble, ten times the premiums?.
As for life insurance regardless of most conditions that's simply not the case. You would be refused by many life insurance companies now if you presented with a whole host of ailments and those that would offer it to you would make it punitively expensive to get... if they had your DNA profile that said you MIGHT go on to develop a life threatening disease do you think it reasonable that you should then pay double, treble, ten times the premiums?.
May 13th 2009, 7:22 pm
#248
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,397
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
If you are both suggesting that you can't be convicted on DNA evidence alone then here's a case closer to home. Review the conviction of Bradley Murdoch for the murder of Peter Falconio...
Here we have no witnesses.. no body... no definitive evidence a crime ever took place... and no proof that Bradley Murdoch was ever at the scene other than a discredited method of extrapolating DNA... which was enough to get him a life sentence.
Here we have no witnesses.. no body... no definitive evidence a crime ever took place... and no proof that Bradley Murdoch was ever at the scene other than a discredited method of extrapolating DNA... which was enough to get him a life sentence.
May 13th 2009, 7:33 pm
#249
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,188
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
My point is that I don't see why everybody on the bloody globe should be 'bagged and tagged' just because the more gullible in society think its a good idea that we should because it might reduce crime.
May 13th 2009, 7:40 pm
#250
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,397
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Hitler introduced identification documents under the premise of security etc. He ended up using it to identify Jews and trying to wipe them out.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Who knows what the world will be like in 10, 20 or 50 years time. What if there is a military coup and some despot dictator takes control and decides to expand on the DNA information contained in the database and then decides to do a bit of ethic cleansing?
Don't say it will never happen. History has a tendency to repeat itself. As archaelogists say, if you want to see the future, look to the past.
Herr Hitler was able to cause a little mayhem without anything approaching DNA technology.
Another Hitler would do the same with or without DNA. It's the desire that's the critical thing: that and the acquiescence of the population. DNA - or any other technology - is irrelevant.
May 13th 2009, 7:48 pm
#251
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,397
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
As - I'm obviously gullible - a personal thing I don't mind at all. But equally obviously it's of more limited use if only volunteers participate so either it is legally required or it isn't. Up to the government of the day - like taxes and car registration. Thinking of which, doesn't your car numberplate put you in a location at a certain time? Another "infringement of liberty"?
May 13th 2009, 7:54 pm
#252
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,708
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Another Hitler would do the same with or without DNA. It's the desire that's the critical thing: that and the acquiescence of the population. DNA - or any other technology - is irrelevant.
May 14th 2009, 10:36 am
#253
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 9,316
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Exactly what is your source for this inaccurate statement?
In the Murdoch case the defense didn't even try to say it wasn't Murdoch's DNA. They were obviously convinced.
We've already been through this. DNA fingerprints in a database will be enough to reduce the suspects to a small number. Once you have your suspects you can definitively say who the DNA came from because you can do further testing.
Even if we discount the usefulness of a DNA fingerprint database, the technology has been responsible for letting more innocent people out of prison than it has been for putting innocent people into prison. This would suggest that on balance DNA technology is better at catching crims than the cops.
In the Murdoch case the defense didn't even try to say it wasn't Murdoch's DNA. They were obviously convinced.
We've already been through this. DNA fingerprints in a database will be enough to reduce the suspects to a small number. Once you have your suspects you can definitively say who the DNA came from because you can do further testing.
Even if we discount the usefulness of a DNA fingerprint database, the technology has been responsible for letting more innocent people out of prison than it has been for putting innocent people into prison. This would suggest that on balance DNA technology is better at catching crims than the cops.
This is a serious hole in the knowledge of an expert! So what? Did I say he was innocent? No! Did I say that he should be let off. No! I said that I don't know much about the case. I do know that LCN has been called into doubt. I know that the Omagh bomber has been released because of this.
We've been through this before because you repeat it all the time regardless of whether it is relevant to what I wrote or not. Usually not.
That's a rather poor conclusion. It only shows that DNA is better at letting people out of prison than cops. But running with your conclusion why do they not release prisoners on DNA evidence alone?
Last edited by MartinLuther; May 14th 2009 at 10:43 am.
May 14th 2009, 12:21 pm
#255
Demi-God
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 2,812
Re: DNA.....Stored>>>>>Or Not ???
Those of you who cannot see this will simply have to wait until it is done to be proved wrong. It will happen for two reasons:
1. There is no danger of it being used for any other purpose than for identification.
2. It is an effective method of identifying ciminals.
Any further questions you have please refer to my previous answers. They cover everything you been able to think of. If you want cover every single individual case where DNA evidence has been used then we're going to be here forever.
