spouse of scouse

Oh Caroline, is there anything worse than an incompetent dentist? It's bad enough having to go there in the first place, but to have it botched and then pay for the privilege - horrible, I feel for you and your husband.

I'm not too worried if the nerve doesn't recover, although it's only been 8 days and the surgeon told me it could take 6 - 8 months. The front of my right thigh is already numb from spinal surgery, so a little patch won't bother me too much. Teeth - who'd have 'em? Oh...

spouse of scouse

I said at the beginning of this thread that I'd share any info I had, in case someone is thinking about dental implants in the future.

Might as well get the bad stuff out of the way first. It hurts. More than that, it bloody hurts! Was ok while everything was still numb, but have had quite a bit of pain for the last 4 days. So much so that I got an emergency appointment with the surgeon today, because I'd convinced myself that I'd contracted an infection.

He said everything's looking great, which made me glad that I've followed the aftercare plan religiously, including alternating rinses of Savacol and warm salt water a dozen times a day.

He went on to explain the reasons why I'm feeling so much pain now, in excruciating detail. I switched off when he got to 'peeling back layers of muscle' and 'stripping nerves'. I also have a lot of stiches from the extractions. All that will hopefully subside, and I should be feeling at least relatively comfortable at the 2 week mark.

I still can't do anything resembling normal chewing of food. I've been eating lots of mashed up veggies (thanks Caroline!), smooth soups, creamed rice and soggy Weetbix. Can't wait to get my fangs into a proper meal again.

Now for the good bits. As mentioned before, although I had all my teeth extracted, my surgeon would only place implants in my lower jaw this surgery - he said he'll do the upper jaw in 6 months. The temporary prosthesis I had bolted onto the implants the second day after the surgery look MEGA! As well as taking the time to track down a good oral-maxillofacial surgeon, I searched for a dental prosthetist with lots of experience and a really good reputation.

So although the temporary on my lower jaw is only acrylic (the permanent will be porcelain), the shape and shade is exactly right. Of necessity, I have to make do with a full upper denture until I can get implants there. There's no getting around the fact that it's not a pleasant thing to wear, at least not in the early days. The plastic plate on the roof of my mouth is really annoying, and taking the plate out for those dozen rinses a day kills as I have to drag it over raw, stitched tissue. But it too looks fantastic!

I had two long and one short appointment with the prosthetist prior to the surgery. As well as taking moulds of my mouth, he spent a lot of time with me discussing exactly what 'look' I was going for. He replicated that perfectly, both with the temporary and the denture. Some small imperfections as I requested, and a shade of white that just looks like natural teeth, albeit very carefully looked after ones.

So, lessons to date which I stress are only from my experiences so far, both with specialists and with 'ordinary' dentists:

Who you get to perform your surgery and make your temporary and permanent prostheses is all important. There's nothing to stop a general trained dentist from doing a course in implants, and then hanging a shingle as an 'Implant Expert'. Although some of them may do a good job, they are certainly not 'experts'. The one I spoke to about doing my implants was my usual dentist who had done the course. She was going to do them in the dentist's chair under local anaesthetic. Since I needed my jaw bone shaved to have this done, I'm not sure how she thought she'd manage that

I found that the cost of having an oral-maxillofacial surgeon do my implant surgery was not that much different from a general dentist. And in vast contrast to a general dentist who's 'done a course', my surgeon trained for 14 years for his qualifications. He spent 3 hours with me over two appointments prior to my surgery, to make sure I understood the risks as well as to address the impact of my RA drugs on my chances of a successful surgery.

In choosing the guy who makes the teeth (tired of the correct terminology!), I relied on my surgeon for a recommendation. The guy I have owns his own dental lab and has been an absolute delight.

Cost is a huge factor in deciding to have this surgery. For myself, it's only now that I can afford it, and I've needed it for at least 15 years. I said before that the cost of a top OM surgeon isn't much different to having a dentist. I'll go further than that, and say it could well work out cheaper. The quote I got from my surgeon includes everything - pre-surgery appointments, the surgery itself, all the aftercare appointments (including unscheduled ones if you're worried about anything) and then a general check every 6 months. He guarantees his work against implant failure for 5 years, and since it's not that uncommon for at least one to fail, that means that he'll do the surgery to replace that at no additional cost. I was quite surprised at my first meeting with both the surgeon and the prosthetist, they were very upfront about the costs and I discovered that the prosthetist is paid 2/3 of the all up cost, while the surgeon gets the other 1/3.

The prosthetist also guarantees his work for 5 years and will replace/crown any tooth that breaks, and will also see me every 6 months for check ups at no additional cost. As many alignments of the dreaded denture that are necessary is also included.

As well as getting top of the range specialists to do your surgery and make your new fangs (because you're worth it ), be realistic about your recovery rate. I thought I'd be fanging away in a few days, not the case.

Finally - please think long and hard about having this surgery done very cheaply overseas (medical tourism), in some countries at 1/10th of the cost to have it here. Countries that are regulated such as the UK aren't heaps cheaper than here, although you'll save a bit. If you have a great recommendation from someone you trust, then that's good. But make very sure that the person who will be cutting into your jaw muscles, moving nerves out of the way, and screwing titanium (hopefully!) rods into your jaw bone knows what they're doing. Also consider what will happen if one or more of your implants fail - what guarantees do you get? You also need to factor in the airfares necessary, accommodation and the like. Don't believe the web sites that promise you a holiday at the same time as getting this done - you'll be in no shape to enjoy a holiday!

I think that's enough for now

spuddyo

Was there much change out of $30k ?

Molly Coddle

Spouse, it sounds like pure hell. I feel for you having to go through that pain.
It'll be worth it in the end I'm sure. Hope you're feeling better soon

carolinephillips

OH had his large filling taken out yesterday, and there wasn't much tooth left. The dentist had to put 4 posts into the tooth to hold the new one, but has said it will need an implant and crown in the near future. The work on his teeth is progressing, but hasn't got to the major implants and crowns at the front. He was in quite a bit of pain yesterday poor love. So out came the panadene forte, and he had to lie down while I made roasted butternut squash and carrot soup.

Hopefully SOS your pain will reduce quite quickly. I dread the day I have to have all my teeth out!! OH's dad had them all taken out as a 21st birthday present. (Welsh mining valley man,) which seems peculiar now, but at least modern dentistry has anaesthetic!

spouse of scouse

Thanks Molly xx I should have been a bit clearer in my previous, rambling post - I think the extractions have actually been more painful than the implants. Getting it all done together has made me feel a bit miserable, but on the other hand it was (nearly) all over in one go.

Spud, the total cost for my lower jaw, from go to whoa, is $25,000. Of that, the surgeon gets $10,000 and the teeth guy gets $15,000. I haven't tried to claim any of the cost back from Medicare yet, but I'm not hopeful as dental isn't usually covered. I'll get $1,500 back from my private health insurance for the dental surgery - again, not sure yet if they'll pay anything for the teeth (prosthesis). My private health insurance fully covered the hospital stay, anesthetist, theatre fees etc.

Your poor husband, Caroline. If you do have to get all your teeth extracted in the future, I'd strongly advise a general anesthetic, health permitting. If you/I are still on BE, I'll be your coach

Molly Coddle

Hey, it all sounds painful to me but it will be so worth it in the end

Incidentally, you can buy a house in Burnley in Lancashire for $25,000. (seriously) not that that has anything to do with anything but I'd thought I'd mention it. Lol


I keep trying to coax my youngest to go into the dentist industry, those guys make serious money.

spouse of scouse

Totally agree Molly, dentists in Australia can make mad money. It's a great career to steer your kids towards, as long as they're not squeamish

By the way, I seem to have acquired a black tongue. Yes, a black, jet black tongue. Haven't eaten anything that could even remotely cause that.

A quick look on Mr Google cites the most likely culprits in my case as too much use of antiseptic mouthwash, and too many strong antibiotics. Strips all the good bacteria from your mouth, apparently. "It's not harmful". It was bloody harmful when I looked in the mirror as I was rinsing - I nearly bloody died!

carolinephillips

Or you have eaten too many licorice allsorts!!
Take some live yoghurt and probiotics to help your poor tongue recover, and also benefit your gut.

Molly Coddle

Yeah, it's good money alright. I had a brace on as an adult and it cost me a fortune. Just the initial consultation cost me £150, I was only in there for five minutes!




Caroline made some good suggestions regarding the black tongue. Good luck with it.

kitty4

Oh the black tongue!! It's from mouthwash containing chlorhexidine. I had that when I had the implant process - been through almost exactly the same as you Spouse and empathise completely, except I only had two implants in the lower jaw. I think it's the hardest thing I have ever done and it was the extractions and immediate temporary dentures that were the killer part, the implants were a breeze. However, it's worth it, I'm nearly 18 months done now.

carolinephillips

Try Colgate neutroflor, which DD had to use for a month after her wisdom teeth were removed. It doesn't have any of the stuff that turns your tongue black.

spouse of scouse

Nothing about dental work is cheap, is it Molly? Thanks Caroline, I'm taking probiotics so hope to avoid the dreaded 'you know what'.

The black is slowly disappearing, I ditched the mouthwash completely and have just been using warm salty water. Much less pain now as well - I'm starting to think I'll live

spouse of scouse

Kitty, thanks so much for posting, it's great to hear from others that have had the same procedure. Also good to know that the black tongue isn't uncommon - I was thinking I had the bubonic plague for a while there! The surgeon gave me an information sheet, but that wasn't on it - I might suggest that he make a few additions to warn people what they may be in for.

It isn't pleasant, is it? I so agree about the extractions and temporaries being the worst bit - I'm usually pretty good with pain but the first time I dragged the temp over my poor battered gums - I nearly went into shock, it hurt that much

You sound like you're doing great now and I'm so pleased to hear you say it was worth it. Thanks again for posting - much appreciated

kitty4

I would think you are over the worst now Scouse, nearly two weeks?
I had no idea what it was going to be like and only booked the day off work after having the implants and ended up having to take two weeks off. I had to dose myself up with pain killers and anti-inflammatories up to an hour before removing the temp dentures to do the rinsing - really had to psych myself up for the process it was that painful and I too have a pretty high pain tolerance. I went back several ++ times for adjustments to the dentures which make an incredible difference when they smooth a bit off here and there and the prosthetist and dentist expect to see a lot of you over those first weeks. I thought it was just me being a wimp but apparently, it was all normal. Think it was about three weeks plus before I tried to eat ''normally''. I remember having fish and chips as I was out with colleagues on a work related lunch and I couldn't see anything else on the menu that I thought would be attemptable. Took me about an hour and I could only manage the fish - the chips were impossible. However, after that, recovery seemed to come on in leaps and bounds. All the best to you, the confidence having decent teeth gives you in the long run is more than worth the pain