sunny_samantha

hi
any input on this would be really appreciated
My husband and i are about to start the whole process of applying for visas (skilled independent). I currently work as a primary teacher and have no intention of changing career unless i have to. i've spent years becoming more and more disillusioned with the whole system of test, test, test combined with poorer pay and even greater lack of respect/status in the uk regardless of results achieved by the children i teach. i've looked at a few job sites and the emphasis in australia (particularly adelaide where we intend to settle, although this changes by the minute!!!!) seems to be on a christian school with a christian upbringing...is this indeed the case as i have never worked in a church orientated school before and wish to prepare myself for this if i have to!
as i said Adelaide is only an idea at the moment...we wished perth last week! but we know we have a lot of time to decide!
Good Luck to you all
Thanks for any help/advice
Susan and Rod

pommie bastard

You are right in somethings you say best schools here are church run but all are private have fees about $2600 per year per child ,state schools just as good/ poor as UK in fact most kids who come from UK are a year a head of local kids.
The local paper in Perth has UK teaching Jobs in it most weeks giving out rates of pay in UK, which seem to locals to be far higher than in Australia. Best of Luck

sydneyrose

susan
if you don't know of it already try chatroom of www.teacher.co.za
south african based but australians talk on it. I don't think however they are from Adelaide but could tell you general oz teaching info.
"Christian" usually means "Christian lite"! More about values and discipline. Badly behaved kids can be expelled from private schools more readily (but as a last resort) than state schools. Many parents in NSW choose state for primary then private for high when discipline becomes more of an issue. Big catholic system throughout oz, subsidised by church and has many kids attending who are not catholic. Many migrants like this system as it is affordable and fits their perceptions of stricter environment.
good luck

tinaj

Hi Sam,

I am a fellow teacher, but I work in the private sector over here. I was so disillusioned by bad working conditions that I entered a prep school last year and I love it.
I have no intention of going back to the state sector in Oz I think it is just as bad as over here.
We looked at some lovely private schools in Queensland and they are so much cheaper than over here. I have every intention of sending my kids private when we get out there, all 3 can go for the price you would pay for 1 child over here!!
Most of the private schools have a Christian ethos, I think the state primaries are mostly neutral.

I have checked out slaries and I would basically earn about double that I do here about $59,000 for a top notch teacher - I don't know if your experience in Uk is counted though - it had better be !!
In real terms I should earn triple the amount, but I suppose it costs a lot less to live out there.

Check out this site it gives you all the salaries
WWW.education.Qld.Gov.au/schools
wages are different across the states so this relates to Queensland only.
The site also gives you the term times which are split into 4 semesters, the holidays work out about the same though.

Best of luck

Tina

pommie bastard

Just a few points .
1.$50k to$60k put you in top tax bracket 48% tax

2.Private shools are good but just a small step from state still 30 to a class, not in same league as UK

3. if convert 3 to 1 somethings are cheaper Housing , fuel (bigger cars longer trips could take that away), also some meat and junk food.

Dearer Health care , beer , most food in shops loaf of bread $3.00 , car parts double price here , Water rates charge twice yearly and on use, higher interest rates,on the whole its about what you earn and spend we find that most have less disposible income also debt far higher here.

You are right about the state sysytem, here kids can leave school at 15 years old and a lot do , its worth paying private.Sounds like you have a good life now make sure the move is what you want , kids are kids the world over can not see your job here being that different?

sunny_samantha

Thanks a lot for the advice...to answer your question, yes, kids are kids the world over and i don't expect very different...in fact given that the school in which I work has a definite drive towards the importance of behavior and manners, i probably expect them to be a lot worse! i have to look at the bigger picture of my job combined with my husbands and the quality of life that we have now...i refuse to believe that as a teacher in australia i would start teaching at 8 a.m. and finish at 4p.m. (not counting the two nights we have meetings until 5.30p.m.) together with going home ( a five minute commute!) and then working until 7p.m. four nights a week together with working for a minimum of one afternoon a weekend. This is my week as a teacher in the UK...and i'm not even mentioning report writing time and other times of the year when the workload increases. In fact being realistic i often work until 11 p.m. marking books and planning lessons. I am responsible for English across my school and this requires me to produce 180 lesson plans (which are between 1 and 2 pages long in length and typed!) every six weeks. These have to be altered significantly and cannot remain the same from year to year. The teaching is the part of my job which I love and i don't see that changing regardless of the country which i am resident in! I have been offered the post of Deputy Head in my school and turned it down as the increase in workload for the tiny increase in pay would simply not be worth it! The quality of life has to be better elsewhere...and I look forward to finding it in Australia. The move is what we both want and i think we'll have a good life in Australia and can't wait!!!!
Susan

pommie bastard

This is what most on this forum think , all I can say is be careful what you wish for the grass is not always greener



Teachers rapped for pupil assaults in WA

By Ben Harvey



THE Education Department has disciplined or sacked 34 teachers over 81 allegations of sexual or physical abuse of students in four years.

Teachers have been accused of 47 physical and 34 sexual assaults on pupils since 1999.

Five staff have been disciplined this year, but none sacked, over six accusations of sexual abuse and 16 of physical abuse.

Last year, a record 19 teachers were accused of sexually abusing pupils. A further 10 were accused of physical abuse. Of those 29, six were disciplined and two were sacked.

Ten staff were disciplined and five sacked over 22 allegations of physical or sexual abuse in 2000.

Independent MLA Liz Constable got the figures through questions in the Legislative Assembly.

Earlier this year, Dr Constable revealed that students at State schools attacked teachers 70 times in 2001. Parents were involved in two assaults on teachers in the year to November 8, 2001.

Knives and razors were found on students 27 times in 2001, up from eight in 2000.

Scissors were used in six attacks, rocks and bricks in five assaults and chairs, desks and bins in three attacks.

Six firearms, including replicas and home-made guns, were confiscated from students between 1999 and 2001.

.

Sandra

50 - 60K does not put you in the top bracket - the rates are often quoted here incorrectly by people trying to justify a point, and sorry Pommie I like fact not fiction (I am not against all your points!!!)

Current information from the ATO website - http://www.ato.gov.au/content.asp?do...uals/12333.htm
Tax rates 2001-02 and 2002-03
Taxable income
Tax on this income

$0 – $6,000
Nil

$6,001 – $20,000
17c for each $1 over $6,000

$20,001 - $50,000
$2,380 plus 30c for each $1 over $20,000

$50,001 – $60,000
$11,380 plus 42c for each $1 over $50,000

Over $60,000
$15,580 plus 47c for each $1 over $60,000


The above rates DO NOT include another 1.5% medicare levy

so 47% plus deduction does not start until you are earning over 60K and only the bit between 50 - 60K is taxed at 42% the majority of earnings are tax at the much lower 30% for some one earning 50-60K

There is a tax calculator on this ATO site as well.

I am still exploring other taxation rules etc - cause it is my job here in aus!!

Cheers

dotty

I must be lost here. If $59 000 is double the english teaching wage that means an english teacher earns about 11 000 quid a year!

pommie bastard

[QUOTE][SIZE=1]Originally posted by Sandra
50 - 60K does not put you in the top bracket - the rates are often quoted here incorrectly by people trying to justify a point, and sorry Pommie I like fact not fiction (I am not against all your points!!!)

Current information from the ATO website - http://www.ato.gov.au/content.asp?do...uals/12333.htm
Tax rates 2001-02 and 2002-03
Taxable income
Tax on this income

$0 – $6,000
Nil

$6,001 – $20,000
17c for each $1 over $6,000

$20,001 - $50,000
$2,380 plus 30c for each $1 over $20,000

$50,001 – $60,000
$11,380 plus 42c for each $1 over $50,000

Over $60,000
$15,580 plus 47c for each $1 over $60,000


The above rates DO NOT include another 1.5% medicare levy

so 47% plus deduction does not start until you are earning over 60K and only the bit between 50 - 60K is taxed at 42% the majority of earnings are tax at the much lower 30% for some one earning 50-60K

There is a tax calculator on this ATO site as well.

I am still exploring other taxation rules etc - cause it is my job here in aus!!


I stand corrected 42% is very low , yet to get over $60,000 mark yet ,but love to pay more .

tinaj

Thanks Sandra for all your info on the tax brackets. I didn't think that it would be exactly as PB put it !!

With NI going up and no more discount for children's tax credit, due to them lowering the income level, I still think I would come out o.k in Oz.

Thanks again

Tina

Bernard

I'm ex-UK and have been teaching here for a couple of years.

The situation is really quite mixed and not that different from the UK. There are some very tough state schools and some 'nice' ones. As you would expect its easier to get a job in one of the rougher schools - vacancies in the better schools attract a lot of applicants!

Teachers in Australia get no more respect than in the UK - salaries are not very good (you would be doing well to get $60k !). Working conditions and working hours are not very much different, I'm afraid.
Relative to Oz, teachers in the UK are very well paid. In the UK, education has a high political profile and the NUT has (relatively) a lot of power. Education in Australia has a much lower profile and things are not as rosy as you might imagine (the Oz universities have taken a real bashing in recent years!).

Many middle class parents send their kids to private high schools - the standard is similar to a reasonable UK state school in a decent suburban area. The majority of students in Australian universities have been privately educated. Universities are quite difficult to get into (relative to the UK) and charge high fees.
There is generally less pressure on kids here than in the UK, but attainment levels are a bit lower, age-for-age. Kids here are around 12 - 18 months behind kids in the UK, I would say.

Living costs are lower than UK; but don't forget to budget for private health care and higher mortgage interest rate. Pension scheme is also not a generous as good old TSS ! Overall, you will not be as *materially* well-off as in the UK, but the weather helps compensate!

HTH

Bernie

pommie bastard

This post is far too near the truth for most they need more fairy stories , just saying the weathers better will not do come on tart it up a bit give the hopeless hope .
The dreamers on this forum are looking for the promised land hardley the way you are painting it , anyway nice to see someone who tells it straight.Best Wishes PB

dotty

Great honesty from Bernie, lets hope he does not get slagged off because of it.

To be fair my kids did go to a State school, eldest left with a very high OP (score) and did get in University in Brisbane. But she was one of the very few, the competition for places in the Few Universities in the Cities, Bris Melb etc are incredibly high. Most of her friends got offered places in Woop Woop (Australian for boghole in the middle of nowhere). If your kids want UNI here they had better be V Smart.

Bernard

Hope I've not upset anyone - just trying to give an objective picture. Sometimes its easier to see more clearly from a distance (i.e. when in the UK things can seem dreadful, but from a foreign perspective one sees also the many good things about Blighty!).

I know teachers in the UK think they are underpaid, but most UK primary school teachers with a few years' experience will be earning more than a University professor earns in Australia - even allowing for the somewhat lower cost of living that is still a big difference! The UK's TSS (teachers pension) is also brilliant!

Personally, I've done OK out here - nice school to work in and I'm single, no kids, so medical fees, school fees, big mortgage etc. are not such an issue. My sister (also a teacher, single) came over but only stayed one year. She was working in a bad school and had to deal with some pretty violent and agressive parents, some racial tension - she hated it and went home.

A lot depends upon your situation in the UK. If you're living in a terrace in Leeds, Manchester, B'ham and working in a sink school then a move to Aus. could be very good indeed. If, on the other hand, you live in a nice house in a rural or suburban area and teach in a pleasant school with 'middle class' kids, take a foreign holiday each year etc., then you need to consider what you will gain/lose from a move to Oz.

If you like sports, the sea and outdoor lifestyle (I do!) then it has many advantages and you will love it here; if you are interested in architecture, country villages, old churches, holidays in France, Spain, Italy etc. then you will miss those aspects more than perhaps you realise. Think it over - maybe come here for a month's holiday and visit some schools, talk to some teachers.

As regards the Australian university situation - well, this is my understanding:
The government here have cut back HE funding quite sharply. Universities are struggling to make ends meet. A big income stream for them is overseas students from Asia (Singapore, Taiwan, HK, S. Korea etc.). These are mainly from rich families and their parents can afford to pay the high 'overseas' fees charged by Australian universities. Hence they go straight to the front of the queue. Australian 'home' students attract a much lower fee and hence then go nearer the back of the queue, filling up any remaining places. It is not a very fair system and I'm surprised that its allowed to endure.

If I had children then the HE aspects of the Aus. education system are what I'd look at most closely. The UK system is really very very good - access is largely on merit, universities are 'cheap' (compared to Oz) and standards (even at those which are at the bottom of the 'league table') are excellent compared to Australia. If you have children and you think they might be university material then think this aspect over very carefully indeed. Another alternative would be to move here but keep 'one foot' in the UK so that the children can enter a UK university as a UK 'home' student (not sure how you would do this - maybe others can advise?).

HTH

Bernie