Is it right to ask if I have children at a job interview?
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:34 pm
#16
Y Ddraig Goch
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Originally posted by MrsDagboy
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it?
What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it?
What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
Cheers
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:36 pm
#17
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Originally posted by MrsDagboy
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it? What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it?
What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
If the question is asked, then the response is taken into account when the decision to hire is made.
Having hired (over a hundred?) people, I know that you can't ask the questions to which you don't want to know the answers. If childcare is a problem, it shows up during the probationary period. If, during that three / six months, there's no problem with frequent absenteeism due to children's requirements, then there's no problem. If, on the other hand, I'd ASSUMED that there would be a problem, I could have lost a good employee.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:39 pm
#18
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Originally posted by MrsDagboy
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it? What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
I dont think you are answering my question.
Is there somewhere written down that says its against the law to ASK if someone has children. Why does it MATTER if they ask it?
What they DO with that information may be discriminatory if they chose not to employ someone because they have kids, but I dont think that the question itself is. Thats why I was asking about the law. My opinion, it wouldnt worry me if they asked, political correctness gone mad if they arent allowed to.
Personally I don't see the problem with asking such a question. The motives for asking it could be argued, but I think the employer has the right to make their own judgement on someone and choose the person that they think is most suitable for the job. If someone was vague in their answer then potentially it could make the employer think twice and justifiably; if a potential employee hasn't made arrangements for their children whilst they are at work what does it say about their attitude towards work.
I'm sure most employers would be understanding if someone had an emergency with their children.
BTW I think it would be very difficult to prove that you didn't get a job because you had children.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:43 pm
#19
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Originally posted by downunderpom
Having hired (over a hundred?) people, I know that you can't ask the questions to which you don't want to know the answers.
Having hired (over a hundred?) people, I know that you can't ask the questions to which you don't want to know the answers.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:45 pm
#20
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Originally posted by owieb
What happens if the person being interviewed tells you that they have children without being asked?
What happens if the person being interviewed tells you that they have children without being asked?
The whole political correctness thing is just stupid & bizarre
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:46 pm
#21
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Originally posted by owieb
Think I'd probably agree with you on that one MrsDagBoy. The question could be asked in any context, whether it's at the start of the interview giving the impression that it could affect your chances or whether it is asked during light conversation just out of interest.
Personally I don't see the problem with asking such a question. The motives for asking it could be argued, but I think the employer has the right to make their own judgement on someone and choose the person that they think is most suitable for the job. If someone was vague in their answer then potentially it could make the employer think twice and justifiably; if a potential employee hasn't made arrangements for their children whilst they are at work what does it say about their attitude towards work.
I'm sure most employers would be understanding if someone had an emergency with their children.
BTW I think it would be very difficult to prove that you didn't get a job because you had children.
Think I'd probably agree with you on that one MrsDagBoy. The question could be asked in any context, whether it's at the start of the interview giving the impression that it could affect your chances or whether it is asked during light conversation just out of interest.
Personally I don't see the problem with asking such a question. The motives for asking it could be argued, but I think the employer has the right to make their own judgement on someone and choose the person that they think is most suitable for the job. If someone was vague in their answer then potentially it could make the employer think twice and justifiably; if a potential employee hasn't made arrangements for their children whilst they are at work what does it say about their attitude towards work.
I'm sure most employers would be understanding if someone had an emergency with their children.
BTW I think it would be very difficult to prove that you didn't get a job because you had children.
The point is you can not ask the question.. by law
Do you ask what a persons religion is? and yes it's relevant.
you may think some people may not turn up for work on Friday, and women all rush off because they are a woman.
There are laws in place to protect people with children, men and women , religion, etc etc.
I've just given you the law in my above post
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:46 pm
#22
I like kittens.
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Originally posted by owieb
What happens if the person being interviewed tells you that they have children without being asked?
What happens if the person being interviewed tells you that they have children without being asked?
I have had a couple of occassions where the candidate said that they may have considerable problems working the hours I wanted them to work, due to commitments with their children. The last job I hired for (in December) there was one applicant who wanted to know if she could work a three day week for the first few years until her baby was older.
In those cases, the applicant pretty much blew themslelves out of the water.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:49 pm
#23
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In an ideal world it would not matter if they asked you or not. But most of us know the reason its being asked is because a woman without kids is going to get the job over a woman with kids IF the employer feels she may end up taking sickies to look after them. The employer is looking after no 1. Not nice but its true.
Well thats my experience from having been a mum with kids and as an employer. Most forms have a space on them for dependants, so often your simply asked what your childcare arrangements are. I'd say 90% of the time people say Family will be caring for the kids in an emergency, so thats why I think its a bit harder for Poms, they know you aint got a family!
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
Well thats my experience from having been a mum with kids and as an employer. Most forms have a space on them for dependants, so often your simply asked what your childcare arrangements are. I'd say 90% of the time people say Family will be caring for the kids in an emergency, so thats why I think its a bit harder for Poms, they know you aint got a family!
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:53 pm
#24
Y Ddraig Goch
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Originally posted by dotty
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
, and do they clean pools
Last edited by Ceri; Feb 2nd 2004 at 2:55 pm.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:54 pm
#25
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I have a lot of sympathy with employers on this one. For larger organisations, it is a very difficult process recruiting, interviewing, getting references, getting background checks etc. They need to do everything they can to establish that whoever they offer the job to is suitable to do the job.
Once in a permanent role, it is almost impossible to get rid of someone without going through due process of evaluation, education, training which can take months or years. If you make them redundant, then you can’t employ someone else to that position.
Employment law makes it very difficult to hire and fire as employers would like, hence the emphasis on getting the right fit in the first place.
I would agree that the original question as phrased is at best not politically correct, but not answering the question won’t get you the job (double negative!). A question like “do you have any external commitments that would prevent you from meeting your contractual obligations?� would be better and equally appropriate to males and females – If I need you to press a button at 5.30pm every night, but you have to leave a 5pm every night to pick up a child (or whatever the commitment is) you may satisfy the employment criteria, but you won’t be much use in the job.
If it turns out that they can’t meet their obligations you can fire them for lying at the interview assuming you have corroborating evidence. It’s a nasty litigious world out there and in an ideal world you could hire and fire on the basis of how good or bad people are at their jobs. It doesn’t work that way though.
Once in a permanent role, it is almost impossible to get rid of someone without going through due process of evaluation, education, training which can take months or years. If you make them redundant, then you can’t employ someone else to that position.
Employment law makes it very difficult to hire and fire as employers would like, hence the emphasis on getting the right fit in the first place.
I would agree that the original question as phrased is at best not politically correct, but not answering the question won’t get you the job (double negative!). A question like “do you have any external commitments that would prevent you from meeting your contractual obligations?� would be better and equally appropriate to males and females – If I need you to press a button at 5.30pm every night, but you have to leave a 5pm every night to pick up a child (or whatever the commitment is) you may satisfy the employment criteria, but you won’t be much use in the job.
If it turns out that they can’t meet their obligations you can fire them for lying at the interview assuming you have corroborating evidence. It’s a nasty litigious world out there and in an ideal world you could hire and fire on the basis of how good or bad people are at their jobs. It doesn’t work that way though.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:58 pm
#26
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Originally posted by Ceri
Also ask them if they are married..., and do they clean pools
Also ask them if they are married...
, and do they clean pools
I only do that to the attractive ones
Is that sexual harrassment??
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:58 pm
#27
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Originally posted by downunderpom
Why would I be interested? Why just blurt it out? It would make me wonder why they wanted me to know.
Why would I be interested? Why just blurt it out? It would make me wonder why they wanted me to know.
Feb 2nd 2004, 2:59 pm
#28
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Originally posted by dotty
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
From now on I shall ask every bloke I interview what his childcare arrangements are, I can just picture the reaction
I'm not sure what i'd do. I'd go umm ahh, err, Then say something like "I take it I don't get the job then ?"
But then again, thats another reason I'm not working. My wife wants to work. So she does.
I can play at working from home, and take it or leave it if nothing happens. I'm always here for my daughter. ...... I've just realised how much I have changed over the last decade.
Feb 2nd 2004, 3:02 pm
#29
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Joined: Nov 2003
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Originally posted by ABCDiamond
Ceri, legally you may be right. I must admit that I haven't read up on it.
However, sometimes the law does not always work in the way that it was intended. And anti discriminatiojn laws sometimes will work against those that they are intended to help.
Let us take a hypothetical:
3 Job applicants. A man and two women.
The employer wants someone that is going to be reliable, that is THEIR RIGHT as an employer.
The women MAY have children, but they cant ask !
The women MAY have child care under control, but they dont know !
The women may NOT have child care under control. Who knows, you are not allowed too find out !!!
Most men are used to working all hours, as normally someone else is looking after the children, whether politically right or wrong, thats a fact.
If the employer is not allowed to ask and find out, what do they do ?
Ceri, legally you may be right. I must admit that I haven't read up on it.
However, sometimes the law does not always work in the way that it was intended. And anti discriminatiojn laws sometimes will work against those that they are intended to help.
Let us take a hypothetical:
3 Job applicants. A man and two women.
The employer wants someone that is going to be reliable, that is THEIR RIGHT as an employer.
The women MAY have children, but they cant ask !
The women MAY have child care under control, but they dont know !
The women may NOT have child care under control. Who knows, you are not allowed too find out !!!
Most men are used to working all hours, as normally someone else is looking after the children, whether politically right or wrong, thats a fact.
If the employer is not allowed to ask and find out, what do they do ?
I would say that the employer is just taking another business risk in not asking that question. I can understand their concerns regarding the time and money they have to invest in hiring people, but he/she has to decide on hiring the employee based on skills and not based on discriminatory questions like this. They should hire the person and then if need be fire that person if they start taking their job lightly. Other than that, its purely discriminatory.
Thats just my opinion though.
Keyur
Keyur.
Feb 2nd 2004, 3:05 pm
#30
Y Ddraig Goch
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Originally posted by dotty
I only do that to the attractive ones Is that sexual harrassment??
I only do that to the attractive ones
Is that sexual harrassment??
That is discriminating against the men who are .. well lets just say inadequately equipped .
Now fairs fair .. you must ask that question to all men, or you are discriminating.
cheers
