AllyKev

I put this in another thread - but may get missed due to other questions in that thread.

We are coming out for a hols in March 08, to visit a few areas to try and decide on where to settle. Obviously it will depend on my OH getting an IT job but also good schools. Is there the equivalent to OFSTED and performance tables for each school over there? If so, can anyone point me in the right direction please. I have seen info on each school but not in the way of performance etc..

Many thanks

Allison

Rosscarbery

I've been told that they don't have league tables for schools in Oz, certainly not in NSW, but I'm no expert so someone may say different. We did a recce trip in November and one of our big issues was schools. With three kids with a 10 year age gap we need primary, scondary and possibly pre-school. We have pretty much decided on Sydney North Shore as an area to live, so I looked at all the websites and e-mailed schools I liked the look of. It was interesting that the majority of schools replied quickly and were very friendly and welcoming, only one took the "we're too busy" approach - possibly because it's supposed to be the most high-flying high school on the North Shore! in the end we visited just one high school and one primary, both of which we liked a lot (particularly the primary) so we didn't really bother looking further. When we get there we will look at some others, but I really just wanted to know that there were ok schools out there rather than deciding on specific ones. I presume you are aware that if you live in the catchment are of a particular school, they have to give you a place. Don't know how that works in reality, but it's true! I'll be looking at other responses with interest!

AllyKev

Because there doesn't seem to be any kind of performance stats/Ofsted. Can those of you already in Oz, with children tell me what you think of your childrens schools compared to the schools they went to in the UK?

Any info./opinion warmly welcomed.

Thanks

Allison

Vash the Stampede

Australia has no equivalent of Ofsted, and no national league table system.

Some states publish a general overview of performance results; others (like South Australia) do not. In the past, league tables have always been vigorously resisted by various groups representing parents and teachers alike; very few people actually want them, so the current situation represents majority preference.

My wife is a high school teacher (inner city Birmingham), and says she is looking forward to teaching in Australia without the fear of Ofsted inspections hanging over her head.

However, it does appear that the Australian federal government is moving in the direction of league tables (click here) so we could be in for a shakeup further down the line.

Fardell

I am not sure that people generally don't want them - but the teaching unions certainly don't. I think the problem is that they become the only focus of attention rather than whether the school is a good fit for your child, and they are necessarily backward looking. Both Victoria and Western Australia publish final years results by school. Some states like South Australia collect the data and then let the individual schools see their results projected against State norms - which is not ideal for a parent at least.

See www.exfin.com/education-whichprivate.php for Victorian and WA results.

There's nothing like actually visiting a school though to get a good view though!

NKSK version 2

I've seen no evidence that parents don't want them. The unions like to think that parents don't want them.

I suspect that most parents do want them.

In WA there is a league table of sorts produced but it is very crude and of little benefit.
At primary level it simply tells you what percentage of students hit the benchmarks in reading, maths and science.

Like most crude tables, this tells you absolutely nothing in terms of how good the teachers are.

Australia - certainly WA - has not looked at the key issue - value added.
Anyone can get a 7 year old who has been encouraged by successful, affluent, parents to read since an early age to pass a simple reading test designed for the whole population.

It takes someone much more skilled altogether to get a child from an impoverished, unsupportive background with few literacy skills to pass the test.
A value added component helps identify who these teachers and where these schools are.
Currently the unions are resisting any attempts to measure how effective their members are. And the state government is too weak (and in WA's case too mired in in its own corruption) to do anything about it.

BAck to your question, I'm afraid that you will most probably do what most parents do (me included), choose a school which has the least disruptive elements with a strong discipline policy. These schools tend to be found in affluent areas.

BadgeIsBack

Wise words! And/or pay the relative small change for church private. That's the route we'll go.

NKSK version 2

Yes, us too at secondary level.

The trouble with this approach for migrants is that - again certainly in WA - waiting lists are so long that you have little chance of getting your kids in to private schools for an immediate start.

We have our children down for private school commencing in 4 years time and apparently there is "a chance" and the head is "hopeful" that they will get in!

Amazulu

WA has league tables of sorts for both private and state schools. I think it's based on TEE results, so does not include primary schools.
I'm not happy with the Intelligent Design agenda that some Church schools push and a lot of state schools are crap so send my son to a non-Church private school.

NickyC

Most of the long established church schools are fine - ie. the ones related to churches that you've heard of! Mine went to a (nominally) presbyterian school and there was hardly any religion there.

It's the ambiguous 'christian' schools that you want to avoid. When they call themselves 'christ-centred' and 'parent-controlled' then you should be very wary. Some of them are seriously fundamentalist and I wouldn't have wanted them anywhere near my kids.

Amazulu

Sure. We went to have a look at a Catholic school in the hills. All seemed well. Their results were good, the children were well behaved etc. I started asking questions about Intelligent Design and the Headmaster (who realised where I was coming from) tried to fudge the issue and skirt round it. I think they rely on parental ignorance or willing parental compliance to be able to teach this crap.

I declined their offer of a place for my son.

AllyKev

Thanks for the response - the link is very useful - thank you. I agree with you about visiting the schools and we were hoping to narrow our school list down and then try and visit a few when we come out March 08 - but that is also proving difficult. I understand why teachers don't appreciate the league tables etc.. but as a parent it does make life a little easier when choosing a decent school.

moneypenny20

I personally don't think the UK tables help but that's me. We are on the Gold Coast. I am really impressed with both schools, one primary and one high school that my girls attend. Very similar to the UK and the teaching seems on a par but the suburb we are in is very similar in size and demograpic to our old town.

If I were you I wouldn't pressurise yourself in trying to narrow the schools down. Wait until you are here. You probably don't know 100% where you will be and until you have worked out the best area to live for hubby's work, you have other things to worry about for the time being.

We thought we had sorted the area we were going to live and had sort of narrowed down schools. We got here, hated the area and ended up buying 40 minutes down the coast.

The kids schooling is too important to make a decision, even vaguely, from 12,000 miles away.

Good luck.

steve`o

which state are you planning to move to??

AllyKev

We have no idea yet? Never been to Oz - hence the trip next March. I am researching as much as possible but finding it hard to make a decision, although must say that this forum is proving to be extremely useful.

Al