peterh

OK, so you have decided to migrate to Oz. Well we have done it and can talk from personal experience. If you are not commited to turning your life upside down for 6-24months then dont even begin! The stress will blow your head off! However, there can be rewards in the longrun if you are commited and have done your research.

Immigration is probably financially easier than Migration. If you migrate
on a e457 visa there are lots of downsides:
1.you will have to pay for ANY hospital bills in the first year, even accidents
2. you will need private health cover (family of 4 about $250/month), even then it doesnt cover all the costs.
3. in some states you even pay for an ambulance!
4. healthcare is expensive and not free for uk citizens
5. some states(NSW) charge mandatory huge fees for your children to attend even state school (5.000 dollars per child per year!)
6. rental housing is in short supply and expensive in most states
7. you will not be eligible for permanent status before at least 1-2yrs,
and there are big fees for you to pay!
8. you will not eligible for ANY benefits, child, family credit whilst on a 457
9. you will pay full tax, but wont get ANY benefits on a 457
10. you get nothing from the UK gov' whilst in Oz
11. you have to stay fulltime employed with your chosen employer

So take this into account with expenditure! It mounts up to a LOT of money. There are fees for virtually everything here! It is however easy if you are single and have a sponsoring employer who pays a lot of the costs. If you are a family - be very careful - a 457 is not good for this group as it works out very expensive - you will get little or no financial help at all.

As for general living costs:

1. Food is quite expensive, not cheap
2. books are very expensive!
3. car fuel is cheap, but energy prices high
4. clothes are quite expensive
5. hotels and service industry are quite expensive
6. housing and rental is very expensive in NSW and all cities - can be grotty
7. wages are slightly lower than in the UK
8. Luxury items (nice cars) are very expensive
9. travel (back to UK - your relatives) very expensive!
10. things are generally not as progressed and advanced as Europe and the UK. Beurocracy and is prehistoric and often infuriating. A lot of the country is 'backward' and resistent to any change, or being informed.
11. The Ozzies can seem rude and aggressive at times.
12. Moving belongings to Oz can be an expensive nightmare
13. life is a lot easier if you have money

It will not seem like 'home' for a long time - 12-48 months some people say.

On the positive side:
1. people are generally happier than in the UK
2. people are genrally more sociable than in UK
3. the weather is generally warmer and sunnier than UK
4. your home will be slightly bigger than in the UK, for the same money.
5. pace of life is slower than in UK

There will not be kangaroos jumping down your street, and Oz isnt anything like 'Neighbours'.

Hope this helps! :-)

comet555

I'm not quite sure why you'd have to pay for hospital bills. If you hold a passport from the UK you should be able to take that into the Medicare office and get a reciprocal medicare card. Even on a 457 the reciprocal agreement between UK and Australia should cover any medically necessary treatment.

http://www.medicareaustralia.gov.au/...isitors/uk.jsp

I believe people even get money back for regular doctors visits. If you haven't looked into it you definitely should. Plus anyone reading this might want to know about it.

On the other hand, people with permanent visas are eligible for Medicare when they arrive. We're from Canada so if we didn't have PR we really would have had to pay for everything. Canada does NOT have a reciprocal agreement with Australia so we would have had to foot the bill completely plus have Private health care.

I should also mention that you do not NEED private health care necessarily. If you are on a temp visa and covered by the reciprocal agreement then you might be able to skip it. If you do have private health care on a temp visa it will be a lot more espensive.

If you are on a permanent visa you don't have to take out private health care at all if you don't want. Although if you make too much you'd get taxed if you don't so in some cases it makes more sense to get it. In our case private health care is only about $130 a month (hospital + extras) and that's because we have PR visas so it's cheaper.

Les Mighalls

I think that peterh's summation is reasonably accurate.

Have a few Aussie friends who might come looking for him with a cricket bat for one comment, though (#11).

The average Aussie discourse between friends is not for the precious or the thin skinned and will often seem abusive unless you understand the humour.

Depending on where you live, though, food is considerably cheaper than the UK almost to the point that it is cheaper to eat out in some restaurants than to buy and prepare your own meals if you are single or a working couple. At least in Melbourne.

I disagree with comet555's comment about not needing private health insurance in this country. If you are young and healthy, perhaps. However if you turn up at the average outpatients department of a public hospital here you may find yourself wishing for the NHS.

comet555

There is a difference between needs and wants. You might want private health care to have more options but the a lot of people manage just fine with just Medicare.

Less than half of Australians have private health care, so I don't really see how you can say that you NEED it.

Quite frankly, we have private health care but really don't ever want to have to use it in a hospital for fear of the gap fees I might be charged. So far my daughter has had a one day stay in a public hospital and I had no problems with it at all. It is nice have the option but I wouldn't go so far as to say it's necessary.

peterh

It is a statutory requirement of a 457 that you have private health insurance.
You have to pay it yourself. State hospitals are pretty grim at the moment and lack of funding is a huge issue. If a member of your family becomes seriously ill or has a serious accident and you are not insured you WILL end up with a huge bill, if you are on a 457 - thats why it is mandaory on a 457 -see immigration website. If you dont have it you are breaking the terms of the visa, and if you or your family are unlucky enough to have serious illness they will charge you dearly. You are lucky so far. The UK reciprical agreement is ONLY FOR IMMEDIATE medical attention, not aftercare, further treatment or drugs, anaesthetists, specialist nursing etc.

comet555

You're right about the reciprocal agreement. Although I've seen people on here use it for doctors visits, hospital visits, etc. I'm not on a temp visa nor would I be eligible for the reciprocal agreement (from Canada), I'm only going by what I've seen on here. I was merely pointing out that your statement about having to pay for ANY medical costs was sort of inaccurate.

Also,while on the 457 visa it's the EMPLOYER who is obligated for your medical costs while in the country. The employers usually don't want to pay for this so try and pass off the costs of private health care onto the employee. Perhaps you should have a look on the immigration website:
http://www.immi.gov.au/skilled/skill...s-employer.htm

Here's the interesting part, notice this is under the employers obligations:

Employer Obligations

Pay all medical or hospital expenses for an employee (and accompanying family member/s) for treatment in a public hospital (other than expenses that are met by health insurance or reciprocal health care arrangements)
this undertaking continues until all expenses are paid

Repay the Australian Government for money it spends as a result of the employee's stay in Australia
these costs may include those relating to locating and detaining the employee (and accompanying family member) if they become unlawful, removing them from Australia and processing any application that they make for a protection visa
this undertaking continues until all costs are paid.

Pollyana

The one point that you haven't mentioned, Peter, is that if you arrive on a 457 you are not actually migrating. You are here on a temporary visa. Which is why many of these rules apply.

For poeple who are actually migrating - ie leaving their home country to live permanently elsewhere - many things are different from those described in your list.

Pollyana

We do have a section in the BE Wiki on 457 restrictions - if anyone feel you can add to this then please do, we always welcome contributions

ABCDiamond

Isn't all that normal in any country on a Temporary visa ? I would have expected that Migration would be different though.

I do agree that they will be turning their lives upside down for some months...

But:

Education

Medical
That includes 457 Visa holders. and the term "immediately necessary treatment" is very open ! and many 457'ers pay next to nothing in medical costs. You can check exact details at: http://www.health.nsw.gov.au/policie...PD2005_398.pdf

Wages Although wages vary a lot, the average is actually a little higher in Australia.
Some new arrivals seem to do very well in the wages stakes, but some do not do very well at all.
Those arriving on a 457 normally have the figure agreed in advance don't they ?

peterh

The immigration site wording for Employer Obligations is frankly fiction, in practice. You WILL have to pay ALL your own hospital bills on a 457 (I have worked for a hospital and a university and it was the same for both). The buck is passed fully onto the employee - written plainly in your employment contract as a requirement. You will not get a penny out of most employers (unless perhaps you work for a big multinational like BP, or a government, or have a highly specialist job where they really cannot do without you and you have the clout to negotiate a deal). And don't forget, you will also have to pay for:

1. all medical exam costs associated with migration on a 457
1.b. all medical costs associated with employment
2. your air fare, of course (most employers dont help)
3. all immigration fees
4. all immigration agent fees, if you use one
5. removals fees, storage and duties and immigration inspection fees, fees and more fees....

comet555: I did not say you will have to pay ALL your medical costs , I said you will have to pay ALL your hospital bills if you have no reciprical. You will however have to pay some, or all, of your other hospital costs(&non-hospital costs) also even if you have reciprical and health insurance.

You will have to pay all your hospital bills, whether state or private hospitals. The reciprical arrangement (if you have it) is only for "immediately necessary care" (they will pick you off the pavement for free I guess is what they are saying). You WILL be charged for an ambulance (NSW), drugs, specialist nursing, overnight stays, doctors, specialists, anaesthetists, sanitary towels! etc. etc. if you do not have private health insurance and you have a serious accident, illness or pregnancy problem. It may even take you some time to work out whether you are actually attending a public or private, or independent hospital - it is not always obvious! You will also be charged if you have a routine operation and it goes wrong and you need further emergency or unexpected treatment. You will also not be able to claim for any medical condition which the insurance company considers as pre-existing, for a whole year even if you have full hospital insurance i.e. if you have a medical condition in the UK, and you have to be admitted into a hosptal in Oz you will have to pay the FULL costs in the first year, even if you have private health insurance!

If you can get Permanent Residency from the UK first (big fees apply) it is a lot easier on the wallet once you get here, and life is generally a bit easier with the Oz beurocracy. In this case you get full (as full as it gets) Medicare cover. Be warned! -You do not have this level of cover with a 457 visa. It could be very very expensive, especially for a family. There is some state culture of what is called 'bulk billing' where the patient pays only some or none of the fees - this is still very patchy in most areas and confusing for a non-national. Often it depends who you are, what your Medicare Card says and what you get presented with at the end of your consultation. The Drs & dentists are quite sneeky and will often order something for you which is probably unnecessary (e.g. a blood test check/tooth polish which can sometimes be charged for)

Pollyana: Migration is moving to a job in another country, not necessarily leaving their home country citizenship. Emigration is moving to live and be a permanent citizen, or permanent resident of the new country. The 457 is therefore usually a migration with temporary residency status.

I am just saying guys...if you are young, single and carefree then a 457 is OK. But if you have a family and a basic employer then it is going to be VERY expensive on a 457 visa - you will get no benefits, tax breaks, family credit, child allowances at all. NOTHING! (But the buggers in Oz tax system make you pay full income tax whilst you are here though! argghh!!). Get Permanant Residency if you can before you come out because the 457 is really a low risk/low cost way for Oz gov' to get skilled people (usually young) into Oz to do work in skill shortage areas. Some enjoy the experience and go on to get Permanent status which makes things easier.

Be warned! - ACT and NSW rip you off for educating your kids at a basic state school! $5000per year, per child! but QLD are free!!

Food is a little expensive, you will be quickly broke if you eat out with a family too often. We left the UK 12 months ago so we can compare prices.
Lots of goods are much cheaper in the UK.

The immi' rules in Oz are wierd and often 'anal' and 'colloqial'. They seem really rigid and overly detailed & verbose, and nobobdy from the gov will expain them to you, but if you get a migration agent working for you, you can probably get whatever you want (within reason) but you will have to pay fees to get there.

A good book to read is Bill Brysons' Down Under' in which he shoots from the hip. The good bits - beaches & lifestyle, & the not so good bits - beurocracy, emptiness and isolation and [quote] 'backwards'[ness] of australians esp QLD generally which you will probably only notice if you are from parts of the EU and USA.

comet555

For the most part I don't disagree with anything you're saying. My only issue is that you say you have to pay ALL your hospital bills. I'm sure Medicare would cover at least some of that under the reciprocal medical agreement.

My only real question to you is, did you research this visa type at all before you went over? For the most part people are aware that they will have to pay for expensive private health care and possibly school fees depending on which state. From the way you're explaining things I get the sense you had no idea about any of that.

Also, where you eligible for a permanent visa before you left? I ask because either people don't qualify for people at all and use the 457 as a route to PR, or they are in a hurry so go for the 457 first (or possibly want security of a job). I'm just wondering which category you fall into. Also you stated that in #7 that people would not be eligible for PR for 1-2 years after arrived. That's might not be entirely accurate. Some people come over on a 457 even though they qualify already for PR. For those people there's no need to wait for a year or two, they can apply for PR at any time (before or after they arrive). For these people that are eligible to apply on their own the only downside is that they'd be paying for it themselves rather than waiting for the employer to pay for it down the line. But in my opinion paying a few grand for your application offsets the amount you'd pay for the expensive private health care (it's cheaper once you have PR) and savings for schooling, medical stuff, etc.

adamlt1972

Just an issue in relation to the statement that you pay "full tax" on a 457 visa. The LAFHA tax break provides you with some relief if you're on a 457 and can get your employer to agree to apply it.

Pommy Dan

for a 'Hard Facts' this list seems to be heavy on subjective opinion...

No mention of LAFHA?
If you have a good accountant you can claim $$$$ at tax time?

I did pay for private health care inc medical repatriation, but took it on the chin.

ABCDiamond

Some people come here on the 457, and prefer it due to the massive tax breaks that they are able to get under the 457 Visa.
LAFHA is not quite nothing.

Les Mighalls

Thank you so much, Dan, for posting that.

In another thread I have just written about the dangers inherent in people posting without a proper understanding of the facts.

That you've written this, albeit with question marks, is pure serendipity.

LAFHA is not something that allows you to claim big dollars from the ATO when you lodge your tax return. It is part of the salary package that you, the employee, negotiate with your employer before you start work in Australia.

Its effect is that you may less tax than you may otherwise have done.