Paul&Nic

Well after many phone calls today to all sorts of people inc DEFRA (which is the top of the tree in all of this I guess) we've spoke to a vet there who thinks that this Lepto vaccine is at it's strongest after 30 days. If we test him after 14 days of it going in we have a 'fair' (his words) chance it will not have risen. It WILL go thru the roof at 30 days, but this 'might' be just in time to catch it before it all kicks off!

Personally I still think the chances are VERY low so altho we will get the test done, and am considering taking another dog in for the jab! ... altho to be honest that would prob get us into more trouble so won't, but we have considered it!

We cross fingers for that, but if it's risen then it (according to the vet at EFRA) WILL start to drop by another 14 days after it's peaked!

How long before it drops to a level Australia is happy with is almost anyone's guess, but the general consensus is it WON'T be like 6 months! The EFRA bloke reckons (and only his opinion) the dog 'might' be ready to go end of April time, but he REALLY didn't see it as a 6 - 8 month wait!

We've considered allsorts EXCLUDING giving him away, or even putting him down.

We've considered putting the dog into local kennels for a week or so, all 4 of us go out there, find a house to live, buy a car and get everyone started at school except me and then I return to the UK, pick up the dog and live with my dad till the dog gets the blood test we require and THEN ship him and I come back over to Oz. I have my visa now and HAVE to enter Oz by the 27th of May so altho I will have to start the course later than expected, it 'might' work.

FAR from ideal, but we'd all be up for it if it meant mutley could come over! ...

Now since all that was said, I've phoned another pet shippers and have a 55 min conv with the bloke there. He is all aware of this Lepto prob and currently has 2 dogs kenneling with them till they're clear, and then they go.

I have to phone them tomorrow to speak to another guy there and 'hopefuly' if he fails this 2nd test, he can go kennel with them till ready and away he goes, obv letting us ll go now as planned.

Ok, a longer wait for the dog, but as the guy there said he'd put up with a year wait for his dog rather than not see him ever again!

More money, more agg, but I think someone up there must think I love all of this! ........... how wrong! ...

Still, if we can find a way we'll do it! ...

(2 smileys in one post, and I'm NOT giving in yet!!)

Cheetah7

Will you have to confine him in the meantime to avoid him being exposed outside which may affect his levels?

Actually talking of quarantine, Ive heard of dogs being kept in the kennels until they are able to fly. Happens quite a bit.

Paul&Nic

Yeah the bloke I spoke to today said (as another member said) there IS a course of tabs or something that 'might' lower the Lepto in him. I have to phone tomorrow and speak to another guy who is more informed about it. He DID say it has NO guarantee of working, but gotta be worth a shot!

I'd be happy to leave him with kennels for even 6 months if it means we get him back one day! ...

I've been recommended I try and get the local vets to pay for boarding fee's + extra blood tests as at least 2 people have told me the vet SHOULD'VE known if we was taking him to Oz that the Lepto vaccine CANNOT be used!

I can't get way from the fact that it WAS my responsibility to tell them, but others reckon 50 / 50 as I say, the vet should've been aware! We had told her we was emigrating, and where too!

I'm not worried about blame at this stage, and personally blame myself 100% but I just want to find a solution to the problem really.

sel

If the vet that gave the booster was an LVI you will be well within your rights to complain and get compensation. If not, then I'm afraid the responsibility would lie with yourself.

Paul&Nic

Hi Sel, yeah I will check later today to see if this vet is an LVI. To be honest Nic has phoned them and had a go and she said the person she spoke to almost knew this was coming, I think they know they've done wrong.

I still say I'm a percentage to blame as I WAS aware of this Lepto vaccination and NOT to have it, but at the same time we only asked for the Distemper, Hepatitis, Parovirus and Parainfluenza .... nothing more!

The bloke I spoke to at a pet shippers earlier said they've just given a booster as it DOES contain all of these, and is cheaper than making up the vaccine for the others separately! ... but at the same time if they knew it was Oz we was going (and we told her!) she should've known NOT to administer the Lepto!

I would've been happy to pay more for the RIGHT vaccines, but I didn't want this Lepto thrown in too!

Still, I have to phone him later today and see if the dog can board with them till his Lepto level is low enough to go and then send him out to us!

I'm going to phone DEFRA again later today to see if I can get clarification as to what is the absolute longest time it will take for the vaccine to have dropped to 1/100 I think it should be ?!?

He's currently positive 1/100, and negative 1/400. That 'might' mean something to you ?!?

ABCDiamond

Hi Paul
I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you

On the basis that you asked for the above only, and they gave something extra, they should be able to cover the costs to keep the dog there until it clears, at the very least.

And as they knew it was going to Australia, it appears more their responsibility for the error than yours.

Don't admit any responsibility to them, and make them fix it, one way or the other.

Good luck

ddm

i've just read 5 pages - any word on the doggy prob yet - hope its worked out for you

sarahge

Hi
Just been reading through all this and got hubby (vet) out of bed to ask him about it
He sympathises and says the levels will gradually reduce and its worth having him tested every month as it could only take 2-3 months for them to reach an acceptable level, but it depends on the dog
He also said you can't give para-influenza without giving Lepto (it doesn't come separately) so if you asked for one you automatically have to have the other. Unless you specifically asked for one without the other beforehand, they wouldn't actually be able to do it
Its nice to hear you're not blaming the vet - makes a refreshing change! There are so many different rules for different countries that the vet can't possibly be expected to know them all, especially as they change too.
I really hope you can find someone to look after him for a few months until he can fly out and join you.

Good Luck

Hutch

What a 'mare Paul. Just had the wife check our dog's vaccination record - and she had the all-in-one in November - including the Lepto. I phoned Golden Arrow and since we're not planning to leave until June-ish - he reckoned we'd be fine - but believe me when I tell you that your post lead to a sudden flurry of activity in the Hutchinson household!!! And I'm supposed to be Mr Organised too!!

Anyway... I have a plan B for you that might be worth considering. When we go to Oz for our long two month trips, we leave Cally with this lady in Bristol who runs a kind of dog hotel called Pawz 4 Thought. She's an absolutely lovely woman and all the dogs she looks after, live in her house with her - they choose where they want to sleep (sofa, basket whatever) and they all go out twice a day for a walk on the heath. It would, of course, cost a fair bit (round about 10 quid a day) but she's probably open to negotiation for longer periods and it would certainly be preferable to putting her in a standard boarding kennel - they get lots of love and all the comforts of home with her. Anyway - hope you get it sorted soon.

BillBart1

Sent you a PM mate

Bill

Nicky & Dave

Paul, sorry to hear about all the hassle you're having - can't add anything useful to the advice that's already been offered, but just to say I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this is resolved quickly,and your beloved pooch can wing his merry way to Oz sooner rather than later!

Hang in there - this is all rich fodder for some wonderful stories to tell about all the obstacles you had to overcome to get yourselves - and your dog - to Oz!

Nicky

Paul&Nic

Replied, and cheers.

Yeah a 'mare' indeed!

That's a good call, but as I explained to Bill just now, the dog is fine, he LOVES humans, but the odd dog he simply doesn't like. It's a long story, but was attacked by a Scottie terrier at about 6 months and altho there was no blood drawn or any marks, this dog did bite our Max and ever since that day, with certain dogs he'll growl as soon as they get close and I wouldn't like to think what would happen if he wasn't held back ...

I just can't see him getting on with EVERY dog that was staying there!

He spent time in kennels for 3 weeks in July when we did the reccy and they say he was absolutely no prob. As Staffies do he would get very excited with them, but overall he WAS fine.

I'd sooner him be with someone as he really does love company, but at the same time maybe a few months in kennels would be the best option!

NOW tho the problems ...

I've been speaking to allsorts of people from Vets, to DEFRA, to pet shippers and it's just not looking good. This 2nd blood test is almost def gonna be higher, and the last estimation I got for how long before the Lepto will be low enough to go is a YEAR!! ... :scared:

A few months maybe, but if we have to kennel him for a year then 1) can't afford it! ... and 2) it wouldn't be right for him and would send him round the bend ...

I just can't get a definitive answer as to how long before this damn level will take to drop.

As I say last estimate was a year, yet the vet at this DEFRA said he reckons Max could go as soon as April! ...

Extremely

I'm tempted to try and track down another Staffie the same colour and take HIM along for the 2nd blood test. Tell the vet (who don't know us really) that this dog is Max and as long as he also hasn't had a recent Lepto jab, it will give a low reading!

Clutching at straws again tho! ... story of my life!

sme

Keep on clutching.......you have all journeyed so far to get to this point.........there must be a way forward, these things somehow seem to right themselves.
I wish you all the luck in sorting this one.
Gillian

Paul&Nic

Thanks Gill, and everyone for their advice and best wishes ...

I just wish I could find the answer! ...

Still, onwards and up eh! ...

What about a 'brown envelope' to the blood tester? ...

Oh I've thought of everything I think ...lol

snowbunny

Which test is being used on the dog? MAT? ELISA?

It should be possible to identify which serovar was in the vaccine and possibly identify which antibodies are being produced. Also, everything I've read says that an attenuated strain is used. It should technically be possible to identify live virus in the blood and serotype it.

All of this may be exorbitantly expensive but I would start looking for *experts* in this field. Here in the US the state universities specialising in agriculture are the places to go; are there similar institutions in the UK?

I wouldn't take a second dog in for testing. The vet might insist on repeating the test if the dog wasn't showing expected results of having been recently vaccinated.