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Future for kids in Oz v UK

Future for kids in Oz v UK

Old Oct 26th 2010, 8:17 am
  #31  
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

I think Australia is going to look a lot different in 10 years time from an economic point of view. Hopefully for the better. It's worth noting that Australia ranked 13th for education in the recent Newsweek study of the best countries versus joint 8th for the United Kingdom and Ireland.

http://www.newsweek.com/2010/08/15/i...countries.html

Originally Posted by Damson View Post
I never went to uni (although hubbie did) so haven't considered it essential but the way things are competition is going to be so fierce for jobs that degees are going to be more important than ever.
I doubt that this is ever really the case, you could have said the same at many other junctures in the past but the pace of technological change always seems rapid for the times we live in. You also have to question how many students study courses which will not directly and substantially benefit their careers and how that correlates with the strength of the economy / cost of their education.

Last edited by Steve2009; Oct 26th 2010 at 8:27 am.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 8:54 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

I do think that too many people go to university and do courses that are not going to help them get jobs. I used to work in powergen in the call centre and the whole placed was full of graduates. A lot were not realy well educated. They had dodgy A level results and had done a useless course and a ex poly just to say they had a degree

But education should be free. Not only should there be no course fees, but the cost of living should be funded. We are already on the slipery slope to the USA system where only the rich go to Uni.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 9:10 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by verystormy View Post
But education should be free. Not only should there be no course fees, but the cost of living should be funded. We are already on the slipery slope to the USA system where only the rich go to Uni.

I went to university late 80's early 90's, student loans were coming into existence around that time. They were not available in my first year but were in my second year although to a very limited amount. As somebody from an extremely unprivileged background (I swear on my life that I did not meet another student who was as hard up as me) the student loan was an absolute god send and in fact I would probably have had to leave university without it.

I would not be in the position I am today without my university education and my student loan was paid off a long time ago. I know my debt would not be as big as it might be today as there were no tuition fees back then, but even if I had borrowed substantially more it would have been paid off a long time ago.

And why not. Why should I not repay the debt when my education has provided me with opportunities I would never have had otherwise.

In utopia perhaps education should be free but in reality, lecturers need to be paid, buildings need to be maintained, bills need to be paid. There is no such thing as free. Somebody always has to pay.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 11:14 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by JAJ View Post
A "cushie life in Oz?"

Most migrants - including those from the United Kingdom - have had to work hard to build lives in Australia. Those that haven't, mainly when house prices and exchange rate aligned a certain way, have been very much the exception not the rule. If your mindset is not focused towards hard work, then perhaps migration is not the best option for you.

Nah, I was referring to the heady days of when it was $2.70/£1 which is what it was when we first set out on this journey god knows how long ago (we got our visa in January 2009). Since then as you know everything this end has gone belly up including the gulf between housing prices here and there. I wouldn't have needed to work and hubbie could just have gone contract, but now this wouldn't be an option, particularly as our business is starting to show signs of slowing down - grrr.

Last edited by Damson; Oct 26th 2010 at 11:18 am.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 11:24 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

My kids are 10 and 7 and whilst I would love them to go to uni (both top in their classes and get excellent reports) and get fantastic jobs I realise that this is my dream for them and not necessarily theirs. You might find that they are better suited to trades rather than a job that requires them to go Uni.

Trades seem to be pretty well covered in high school and when I went to visit our local high school I was amazed to find that they actually build a house from scratch every year and then demolish it so that the next years students can do the same!

I truly believe that there is a better future for my kids here than in the UK and by getting Citizenship here I am also providing them with the choices of a future here, the UK, Europe and I also think they can work in New Zealand with an Australian passport (someone please correct me if I am wrong).

Oh and for now they are having a great time being kids, playing out with their scooters, AFL ball and basketball with other kids and having some of the freedoms that I enjoyed as a child but would not have let them had in the UK.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 11:50 am
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Post Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by Tellyaddict View Post
My kids are 10 and 7 and whilst I would love them to go to uni (both top in their classes and get excellent reports) and get fantastic jobs I realise that this is my dream for them and not necessarily theirs. You might find that they are better suited to trades rather than a job that requires them to go Uni.
Agreed - the money might be better, besides.

Originally Posted by verystormy View Post
I do think that too many people go to university and do courses that are not going to help them get jobs. I used to work in powergen in the call centre and the whole placed was full of graduates. A lot were not realy well educated. They had dodgy A level results and had done a useless course and a ex poly just to say they had a degree
Agreed too - a uni degree has been devalued since the 80s or since our parent's days. I've often been quite suprised at how little rounded grads can be. Employers know this and tier all the good ones accordingly - they were not born yesterday! A degree in the main though does get you across the line...so many people will win...
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 11:56 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

[
Oh and for now they are having a great time being kids, playing out with their scooters, AFL ball and basketball with other kids and having some of the freedoms that I enjoyed as a child but would not have let them had in the UK.[/QUOTE]


I am really sorry but unless you lived in the roughest area in the uk why could your children not play on their scooter, basketball or AFL ball in the UK ?

I have been in both countries with my kids and there is no difference - drugs here drugs there, pervs here pervs there, rain here rain there - why can they not have freedom here. My two children have their freedom and we get so many comments on how confident and rounded they seem to be.

Just my opinion.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 12:26 pm
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by Reading fan View Post
[
Oh and for now they are having a great time being kids, playing out with their scooters, AFL ball and basketball with other kids and having some of the freedoms that I enjoyed as a child but would not have let them had in the UK.

I am really sorry but unless you lived in the roughest area in the uk why could your children not play on their scooter, basketball or AFL ball in the UK ?

I have been in both countries with my kids and there is no difference - drugs here drugs there, pervs here pervs there, rain here rain there - why can they not have freedom here. My two children have their freedom and we get so many comments on how confident and rounded they seem to be.

Just my opinion.[/QUOTE]

Personally I did not feel comfortable about letting my kids play out in England. I appreciate that there are drugs and pervs in both countries but I feel more more relaxed here. Possibly because these issues are not so in your face and in the media constantly or possibly because I live in a nicer area here (in the suburbs) than I did in the UK (on the outskirts of a large city).
The main reasons for not letting them play out in England was because of the amount of traffic and the lack of space for them to play safely.
Yes we have hoons here but they don't tend to come out until it gets dark and my kids are indoors by this time.
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Old Oct 26th 2010, 1:43 pm
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Don't forget the 'wealth' provided by a loving extended family and a solid support network in the form of long term friendships.....only 'home' can provide that.

No quotes/facts/figures from me, but from our perspective the future seems far brighter here for our kids......almost as if anything is possible if you are willing to put in the hard work and have an ounce of common sense.

Too many variables in this equation to which no-one except yourself can decide the answer and it's worth.
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 1:51 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Personally I did not feel comfortable about letting my kids play out in England. I appreciate that there are drugs and pervs in both countries but I feel more more relaxed here. Possibly because these issues are not so in your face and in the media constantly or possibly because I live in a nicer area here (in the suburbs) than I did in the UK (on the outskirts of a large city).
The main reasons for not letting them play out in England was because of the amount of traffic and the lack of space for them to play safely.
Yes we have hoons here but they don't tend to come out until it gets dark and my kids are indoors by this time.[/QUOTE]

I think that is the only valid reason you can have, having also seen both sides of the pond I would agree. But, more importantly, I feel that the space, weather, and amount of FREE activities encourages me as a father to do more with my son. In UK, it is dark, cold and wet/foggy for a lot longer than here, so being a miserable curmudgeon I was loathe to take my son out to a usually wet and muddy park full of graffiti and broken swings.
I find a lack of vandalism in the parks and reserves here helps to encourage whole families to go out and enjoy the open space much more so than UK. Maybe the older kids, normally prone to mischief in UK, are too busy with nippers/after school sports and a myriad of other activities that they are too tired to be bothered with breaking something!
One other important thing, safety, Australia is some years behind UK in the way things are reported and handled. Do not think for one moment that there are not the same problems with peadophiles and perverts existing here as in UK. There have been some horrific things reported recently, truly horrific, and more people are becoming aware of the dangers that is out there. I prefer it here, but I would say to anyone, take off your rose tinted spectacles and see it objectively and then you can truly judge.
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 1:58 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by paddyo View Post
Personally I did not feel comfortable about letting my kids play out in England. I appreciate that there are drugs and pervs in both countries but I feel more more relaxed here. Possibly because these issues are not so in your face and in the media constantly or possibly because I live in a nicer area here (in the suburbs) than I did in the UK (on the outskirts of a large city).
The main reasons for not letting them play out in England was because of the amount of traffic and the lack of space for them to play safely.
Yes we have hoons here but they don't tend to come out until it gets dark and my kids are indoors by this time.
I think that is the only valid reason you can have, having also seen both sides of the pond I would agree. But, more importantly, I feel that the space, weather, and amount of FREE activities encourages me as a father to do more with my son. In UK, it is dark, cold and wet/foggy for a lot longer than here, so being a miserable curmudgeon I was loathe to take my son out to a usually wet and muddy park full of graffiti and broken swings.
I find a lack of vandalism in the parks and reserves here helps to encourage whole families to go out and enjoy the open space much more so than UK. Maybe the older kids, normally prone to mischief in UK, are too busy with nippers/after school sports and a myriad of other activities that they are too tired to be bothered with breaking something!
One other important thing, safety, Australia is some years behind UK in the way things are reported and handled. Do not think for one moment that there are not the same problems with peadophiles and perverts existing here as in UK. There have been some horrific things reported recently, truly horrific, and more people are becoming aware of the dangers that is out there. I prefer it here, but I would say to anyone, take off your rose tinted spectacles and see it objectively and then you can truly judge
I see a lot of graffiti in Australia - but then it's the city, but take that out and actually the city streets are incredibly clean compared with even average town in the UK. And parks in Australia are kept much cleaner. I watch the council truck sweep the path along the beach every week, and sometimes I see people cleaning the pavements with those machines. I have never seen anything like this in the UK.

The irritating thing about graffiti is that the little bastards even leave their names behind. It would be so easy to find them and make them break rocks in the Simpson for a year = no more graffiti either.
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 2:07 am
  #42  
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by Tellyaddict View Post
My kids are 10 and 7 and whilst I would love them to go to uni (both top in their classes and get excellent reports) and get fantastic jobs I realise that this is my dream for them and not necessarily theirs. You might find that they are better suited to trades rather than a job that requires them to go Uni.

Trades seem to be pretty well covered in high school and when I went to visit our local high school I was amazed to find that they actually build a house from scratch every year and then demolish it so that the next years students can do the same!

I truly believe that there is a better future for my kids here than in the UK and by getting Citizenship here I am also providing them with the choices of a future here, the UK, Europe and I also think they can work in New Zealand with an Australian passport (someone please correct me if I am wrong).

Oh and for now they are having a great time being kids, playing out with their scooters, AFL ball and basketball with other kids and having some of the freedoms that I enjoyed as a child but would not have let them had in the UK.
100% agree with all of that. Let them live out their own dreams rather than yours!!
My eldest gaughter is 18 and getting ready to sort out Uni for next year, studying psycology (sic) and is well down the 'Uni is the only way ahead for you' path dictated by her mother.
Its the only thing that her mother and I disagree about. Neither of us had further education, both of us were in the Armed Forces, her for 6 years and me for 23. Since then she has now got an extremely successful and lucrative Hairdressing business and I have a good reputation as a Training Consultant earning a 6 figure salary here in Oz.
I would like to think that our daughter, who is very hard working juggling both school and work plus the ever increasing social life, would make a success of whatever she decides to do. I suggested she work with her mother in the business, develop business and accounting skills, like her mother did, and then start her own business. Of course, those two working together was the complete opposite to what either of them wanted!!
I dunno, yes some people and employers still niaively see a degree as the bench mark for a hard working person who can learn. I totally disagree with that but thats my opinion and I am sure others will argue different. To me its all about attitude, being able to listen and having an ability to 'get on with the job'. That last criteria sounds so old fashioned and rather dismissive, but a young person who can be trusted to work without total supervision is a godsend.

Oh, as for the OP concerns......no worries, plenty of time to worry about your kids future when the time comes, don't worry now about stuff years away, it will only depress you!
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 2:20 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Well, if my son can survive the daily bullying from his feral pier group and the apathetic 'support' from the school staff to both his aspergers and his daily assaults, he will have a better life than the UK as at least he can access an apprentiship and become a tradie.

Maybe it's just me, but having had another call asking to pick him up as he has a headwound from an assault but is suspended for fighting back, i'm not having a very good morning
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 2:26 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by TheRutters View Post
Well, if my son can survive the daily bullying from his feral pier group and the apathetic 'support' from the school staff to both his aspergers and his daily assaults, he will have a better life than the UK as at least he can access an apprentiship and become a tradie.

Maybe it's just me, but having had another call asking to pick him up as he has a headwound from an assault but is suspended for fighting back, i'm not having a very good morning
They're liable for the assault - talk to a solicitor about it if they're not taking it seriously. Go to the local press.
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Old Oct 27th 2010, 2:47 am
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Default Re: Future for kids in Oz v UK

Originally Posted by TheRutters View Post
Well, if my son can survive the daily bullying from his feral pier group and the apathetic 'support' from the school staff to both his aspergers and his daily assaults, he will have a better life than the UK as at least he can access an apprentiship and become a tradie.

Maybe it's just me, but having had another call asking to pick him up as he has a headwound from an assault but is suspended for fighting back, i'm not having a very good morning
Arggghhh!! That is my pet peeve!! Teachers or school assistants not helping a kid being bullied, yet when the kids fight back they are in trouble!! It is a basic human right to defend yourself.
Throw the book at them, ascertain the full facts first though!!!
Then threaten them with the press, the Ombudsman, the Aspergers Research Council, the law!!! Get your rights as a parent sorted and then also threaten them with charging the parents of the children doing the bullying, really go to town on them and do not for one moment let them fob you off or bully you either! Remember a squeaky wheel always get fixed so make as much noise as possible!
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