Just wondered if anyone knows if there are any laws that prevent employers forcing employees to work overtime?

Reason I ask is, for the last 6 weeks OH has been working 10 hour days. On Friday (while he was still working) he over hears boss telling all the other people that this week they'll be doing 12 hour days, oh "and you're working Saturday and Sunday".

He is ringing the apprentice people to see what his contract says but I just wondered if anyone knew if there was some sort of blanket law that stops employers doing this?

Thanks in advance

I dont think they can, however the way it works at Apost, if a Casual or contracted worker doesn't do overtime in the same way or ratio as his workmates. Then his/her contract will not be renewed. Also those most agreeable to doing "last minute overtime" are most likely to be offered permanent status and better shifts first.

Our workplace agreements states "a reasonable amount of overtime to be worked" which is highly contestable.

You've hit on a very pertinant topic in todays workplace climate with this issue.

It's issues like this, even with supposedly good employers like Apost, that make me wonder if working conditions really are better in the UK.

Aye, I am currently being sent from pillar to post on the phone trying to find out about this, latest info is "reasonable hours" - WTF that means I guess is open to interpretation.....

Just hoping there is something he can do otherwise the words "stick your f'in' job" will probably be uttered sometime this week (not good with a baby on the way and my work being dead as a dodo)

I'm curious as to what the rules are in the UK, as the same workplace issues must arise there. How do they handle this overtime issue there, I'm sure there is no way the employer could write something that covered all the possibilities, especially with somewhere with as fluid a workload as the postal service. The answer will come in useful for me, for next time we have a problem with OT at our workplace ?

This is all complete bollocks

In addition to the vagueness of the term "reasonable" I've got his award info and it says as follows:

Reasonable hours of work

Employees are not to be required or requested by an employer to work more than the ordinary hours of work specified in the relevant award or agreement, and reasonable additional hours of work.

If there is no relevant award or agreement that applies, employees are not to be required or requested to work more than 38 hours a week, and reasonable additional hours of work.

In determining whether additional hours of work are reasonable, factors that are to be taken into account include, but are not limited to, occupational health and safety risks to employees, employees’ personal circumstances including family responsibilities, the conduct of the business, any notice given by the employer of a requirement or request for employees to work additional hours and any notice given by employees of their intention to refuse to work additional hours, whether the additional hours are on a public holiday, and the employees’ hours of work in the preceding 4 week period.

WTF does that mean?

Who decides whether or not the hours are reasonable?

personally I cant understand how it is safe for a guy to be expected to work 60hrs per wk Mon-Fri PLUS all day Saturday and Sunday when the work involves being around live electricity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's an absolute disgrace. Hopefully Labor will win the election and tear up these so called workplace reforms. Unfortunately under Howard's brave new world most employers can do pretty much what they like, if you don't like it... there's the door. :curse:

I wouldn't have thought that was very safe. I had to attend a "fitness for work" session last week and they were saying 8 days straight should be the max etc. Apparently that sort of thing is enshrined in law in Tassie but only guidelines (that a good company would follow) elsewhere.

Is he still contracting though? It makes it very hard to object if so, as Ozzieeagle says.

Maybe if he slipped while tired and accidentally stabbed his boss?

Yes a real ambiguous and employer weighted statement. However beleive it or not, the ones that really complain about people not doing overtime, will be the other employees. If they are doing overtime, and someone amongst them continuously finishes on time, or does as little as possible, their views will be heard and noted by the employer and the errant performer will probably not have his contract renewed, after a couple of chats of course.

Once one is on permanent, whether they be full or part time, and covered by the award, then basically you can do what you like, although it takes so long to get offered permanent employment now, it's hard to imagine anyone being taken on that wouldn't be willing to tow the line, when circumstances arise. Unless they are 100 pct genuine in a reason for not doing overtime on a certain day.


I'd still love to know how they handle this in the UK. The only way I can think of is having the hours written in concrete, which if applied to our workplace would cause major disruption. IE: the mail would almost certainly be carried over quite often if people wern't "encouraged" to do overtime. The carrot being Permanent employment.

in UK there is the European Working Time Directive but a lot of employees sign out of this. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4536891.stm
OH (perm) contract in UK had hours necessary to do the work (and opted out of directive). The year he was there most time it was a normal working day.
Now (perm) he is doing about 8.5hrs in the office, when he flies off to another city then it 15 -17 hrs he is out of the house, if he stays over then working day generally longer, plus at the moment he is doing 1-3 calls a wk to Europe in the evening that last 1 or 1.5hrs. He is working longer than some, but there are many others working longer.
Do sympathies with you as it is not easy with bubs & a toddler.

He is permanent, not a contract worker. He is actually employed by the apprentice company and they put him with the host electrical company (who are the tossers)

Apparently the other sparks have said they're not doing the weekend, but since one of them is the bosses brother you kind of wonder how far they will push it.....

I am now waiting for another (bigger!) apprentice company to phone me back in the hope he can sign up with them and they can put him with another company.

Just so p'd off with it all, what with this and the fact that he's been working on shite money for six months and STILL no-one can tell him how long an apprenticeship he has to serve I really wonder why we bother..... :curse:

Dont get me wrong, I know there's rules and stuff and we knew it wouldnt be easy BUT never in a million years did we expect the hassle and stress we've had over the last few months.

I know very little about current working conditions in the UK, having been here for 26 years. However I reckon I know Aussie conditions fairly comprehensvely. I beleive that there is a way to get free time for yourself by adopting a practice that is probably more tolerated here than the UK. I think you will find that in general taking a sickie is less of a workplace crime here, than opting out of group overtime. So my advice would be, make sure your hubby isn't the front runner on the sickie stakes, being somewhere below the top 1/3rd of sickie takers, then he can have as much free time as that situation allows.

Sounds silly I know, but people not doing overtime, really is more frowned upon by workmates than workmates taking sickies. Mostly because the sickie is usually pre-arranged and warning given of more workload (amongst the group) whereas overtime is quite often a last minute imposition. Best I can come up with in your situation.

Thanks ozzieeagle

Yes, it's crazy isnt it.

Other apprentice company have said send in a letter and resume and they'll try their best

Just pisses me off really as one company he had an interview with 12 months ago said they'd fake his references to get him through TRA but we wanted to do it the proper way - wish we'd just done that now TBH cos doing it the proper way is turning into a bloody nightmare.

I think one way or another it will be decided this week as he is very close to telling them where to stick their job....

Welcome to the brave new world of John Howard's "Australian Workplace Agreements" (AWA/contract) reforms. To be permanent, he may have still had to sign one If he has signed a AWA contract, he would wold moust likely have two choices, stay or leave. As one new camping chain said before they opened, if they don't want to do it, there is others that will take their place.

[QUOTE=bridie;4533107]Just pisses me off really as one company he had an interview with 12 months ago said they'd fake his references to get him through TRA but we wanted to do it the proper way - wish we'd just done that now TBH cos doing it the proper way is turning into a bloody nightmare.
QUOTE]

And if DIMA/DIC had found out they would probably not have granted TRA or terminated the visa.

Last week I was told I would have to work Saturday and Sunday and past six pm instead of 4.30 because 'it was all hands on deck'.

I refused flatly because 7 days a week is ridiculous.

I am yet to find out if I pass the trial for the job but if I don't, then I wont lose sleep over it.

We need the money but I need my health more.