doggmeister

Hi Guys

I read this site for the first time and love all the information it has to offer..thanks so much for the posts!

I have a question though, in about 3 weeks I am making the move to NZ for what I hope will be a permanent move (1st time visit too!) and I wonder what the likely hood is of landing a job...but more importantly as an Asian would I suffer any racist issue swhen it came to applying for jobs??

Finally I am really curious as to those of you tha have made the move have any of you come back (for reasons such as inability to find a job..or to find the RIGHT job?) and if so why? Also are there any of you thinking about moving back to UK and if so again why?

Thanks for any responses..I'm a nervous wreck at the thought of going!!

S/pick

Hi Doggmeister my family and I live in Surrey. I am British with West Indian parents. I had concerns about going to NZ and racism and people staring and treating my family and I differently. Then I realised, if someone thinks you can do a good job and you are determined to succeed at whatever you do they will see that and employ you. There is a large Asian community in NZ and they seem to be succeeding. If you spoke hardly any english you may have a problem, but people can treat you differently in any country and under any circumstancves so I would'nt worry there are white, black and asian people struggling to get jobs in the Uk and everywhere else.

Wilf

There is a significant anti-Asian feeling in NZ, especially Auckland where all the jobs are. It is much worse than the UK and is very open - you will hear Asians criticised openly and rudely on the radio and in the newspapers, and will experience much anti-Asian prejudice when it comes to getting jobs unless you are very lucky or get employment from another Asian.

If you are from the UK, you will learn to appreciate how tolerant it is of other races, even if you do not believe that now.

Wilf

There are very few black people in NZ, even in Auckland the biggest city where all the jobs are, and yes, black people do get stared at openly and, in my opinion, treated like second class citizens. It is like going back 25 years compared to the UK and whatever anyone says, it is far from perfect but the UK is extremely tolerant of other races compared to NZ and Oz. You may be lucky, but I would say that you will definitely experience prejudice when it comes to getting jobs and your attitude of "if someone thinks you can do a good job and you are determined to succeed at whatever you do they will see that and employ you" is, I am afraid, too much idealism. It should be like that but it is certainly not.

Good luck.

Megalania

More Wiffly Waffle?

Proof

ACE

So Wilfy old chap, would you say my chances of getting a teaching job in the Northland region would be pretty slim ?

ACE

smithone

doggmeister/S/pick

Wilf doesn't even live in New Zealand so I'd question the validity of his comments. He generalises and relies on second hand information when posting about NZ.

The only people that can give you a first hand insight into racism here are representatives from the Asian and Black community.

I'm not naive enough to suggest that racism does not exist here in NZ but being a white European I can't give you advice about what its like to be Asian/Black.

Wilf - if its such a racist country then why are large numbers of Asians trying to make NZ their home. Surely if NZ is such a racist country then Asian migrants would consider a more racially tolerant place to migrate to.

S/pick

I grew up in a village in Lincolnshire in the 70"s and we were the only black family and trust me not a lot bothers me. I have experienced racism in the Uk the majority of my life and been turned down for jobs. To be honest I'm not bother by it. People will say and do has they please and so will I. If you believe you are a second class citizen then you should expect to be treated so. My grandparents came to the Uk in the 50's with money in their pockets and bought a property for the family to live in. My grandparents, uncle's, aunt's and my mother suffered serious racism and all are successful individuals in a society. Not everyone is a racist and has a brain as large as pip.

If I was bothered by what people think of me or my skin colour(that's all it is) I would'nt have achieved anything in life.

S/pick

When my husband sugguested NZ I wanted to do some research into the way blacks and other minorities were trated and was suprised. I posted an e-mail in a few website and got very positive reponses. All in all I recieved 6 and all the people said it was a good country. Yes people stared but after seeing you a few times would say hello. I'm 34 and live in Surrey and people still stare, so what the big deal. Racists are everywhere.

Megalania

People who look different will get "looks" if for no other reason than curiousity. The impolite stare, the rascist glare.

Kiwipaul

A lot depends on what job you are looking for, if you are highly skilled in a specialist field you might have problems as hi tech jobs are few and far between in NZ. If your a tradesman with the required papers it should be a breeze.

If you are pretty flexable about what you do, unemployment is low in NZ and so you shouldn't have a problem.

It also depends on where you are heading, but when I lived in Auckland I had no problems whatsoever picking up contract IT work. I found it eaiser to find jobs in NZ than I have in Australia.

Wilf

I would say that if you teach the teenagers, you may be fine because there is a shortage of teachers worldwide for the time being. The problems in Oz and NZ come (for all foreigners, whatever their race) when you are competing against the native ozzies or kiwis for a popular job or one for which there is no shortage. In that case, all poms would struggle. There is a shortage of people for teaching, nursing, trades, and so fewer problems with those jobs. I still believe, though, that you may encounter the other side which is that in isolated regions of an isolated land like NZ, you will be taken back in time to 1975 and it is your choice if that is where you want to live. I would not, but then I am an old left winger and would feel like I was living in a backward time warp in one of those places.

Wilf

I agree staring is not such a big deal. I would not even call that racist, just childlike, as long as remarks are not made. To some extent, it does not matter what people in the street are like, but it very much does matter what employers and institutions are like.

NZ and Oz institutions and especially employers are backward looking and prejudiced against all foreigners to some extent. I think that unless you work in an area of high demand and shortage, there may be difficulties getting the first job. You do not have to convince anyone on the forum that you are determined. So what if you are if you hit a brick wall? You are used to the UK where you have found that ignoring prejudice and working hard pays off. The UK is not like Oz and NZ. All I am saying is that you may not find the same in Oz and NZ. Please do not bother to act like I am the problem standing in your way and if you make determined noises then what I am saying becomes false. If I am wrong, I am wrong. If I am right, I am right. It will not be changed by telling me that there are racists everywhere. Oz and NZ are not the UK. The UK is very "progressive" in comparison and full of legislation to counter prejudice, even if it is not always followed. Oz and Nz are backward in comparison. You have heard stuff to the contrary. I believe they are wrong and being unrealistic. For what it is worth, that is my opinion.

doggmeister

Hi Guys
Thanks for all the valuable input..and Wilf even you have to admit reading the posts that your cometns seem to be the most strongly worded..though I appreciate your point all the same, one thing that surpises me though is with the large tourism industry NZ has how come people haven't gotten used to seeing tourists of different races and what is even more shocking is that for a country so tolerent of it's indigineous (sp?) people how can it be so backward in it's racism to others? Is it just a 'they gonna take my job away' mentally that has gotten them concerned?

ACE

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Wilf

This is a very interesting thread. I have worked in Perth, all over Japan, Alaska, Hong kong, Singapore, the Carribean, Europe and the UK. This was when I was in show business so I suppose that could be considered specialised skill. As far as racism is concerned attitude does have a lot to do with how it affects your life on a day to day basis, as you can imagine I was stared at in many of these places and not subtly either people would stop in their tracks and stare until I was out of sight. However it never really bothered me as I realised some people had never seen a black person before. In such situations I could have aggressively asked what they were looking at or smiled and said good morning, I chose the latter course of action and still do.

I live in a very upmarket totally white area of Ashingdon and a lot of curtains were twitching the day we moved in. I went round to all of my new neighbours, introduced myself and invited them over for a barbecue. I was greeted by some suprised and in some cases terrified people but 5 years on I cannot walk to the corner shop without being stopped or greeted by one of my neighbours or business owners around here. My neighbours bring fresh produce from their gardens and bring christmas and easter gifts for my children and it has been pretty much my experience where ever I have lived.


As far as OZ being behind the times I can only comment on Perth when I first visited in the 1980's. I was made to feel very welcome although a bit of a novelty, I thought it was utopia and then one day my friends took the company to a bar in the centre of Perth, it seemed like a nice place. I very gradually became aware that I was being stared at and sensed an atmosphere. Eventually an big six foot Ozzie came up to me stared at me for a while then with a huge grin on his face said "sorry mate, I thought you was an Abbo, we don't allow them in here but you're alright" he then offered to buy me a drink, needless to say I was shocked and left. Threre I was 19 and thougt i knew it all and I had spent an evening in a seggregated bar and I didn't even know such things existed outside of SA and the USA in the 'enlightened' 1980's.

Living in a county on a permanant basis and competing in an already over subscribed job market is another matter I am in my third year of a BSc hons in Computing, my specialism is WAN and LAN installation, IP configuration and Internet security, I know these skills are in demand but I don't intend to look for work in this field in Perth teaching would be more condusive to the lifestyle we would like to enjoy. I will be a qualified TESOL adult tutor and a Montessori early years educator it won't be easy but I can only try.

I have been physically attacked twice here in the UK, once by two skinheads in Romford and once by two black men when I was in a West Indian take away in London with my white husband. It is a ghastly thing to experience but I don't for one second imagine that such incidence are limited to the UK.

I worry for my children though we are stared at even here in Ashingdon, Essex but I think that is because my boys are unusually beautiful. Seriously I do fear that they will be descriminated against but then that could happen anywhere.

So yes I agree, Oz is probably behind the times and yes racism is everywhere, (belive it or not this is a fact)yes attitude does make a difference, no Wilf you are not the problem, you are always willing to voice your opinions in no uncertain terms regardless of the inevitable backlash.

People fear the unknown it's human nature and although the UK is progressive in many ways and a great place to live legislation makes very little difference and ignoring racism and working hard does not always work here or anywhere else. When it comes to employment it is people's attitude towards you that count and I'm afraid to say that if the person interviewing you does not like you for any reason it is very difficult to accept and indeed, hard to prove that it is descrimination why you didn't get the job.

S/Pick has a good attitude and I know from experience that it does sometimes pay off to have a positive attitude. It may seem idealistic to some but I see it as optimistic and positive admirable qualities indeed.

Kind Regards
ACE