Re: the drought
 

Water tanks are now compulsory with new builds in QLD.

The reason they were banned was due to the lack of maintenance by the home owner eg mossies, dead possums and the like. Current lifestyle is not, for most people, about home maintenance. "I'll do it next week".

When the rain returns and tank maintenance is forgotten about, I wonder if they are banned again?

WW

Re: the drought
 

I agree - any new houses built should have every water saving device available installed as they are being built

Re: the drought
 

i live in cairns and in the previous 12 months copperlode dam(main water supply for cairns) has been over the spillway 9 of those months. the population of cairns is exploding but the government fails to look at new dams although there has been talk of pipelines to carry water south.
we are on water restrictions in cairns although the dams are full!
we lose so much water each year that could be captured.

i must admit that we use water freely and dont give it a second thought and at the moment i cannot see the point of getting a water tank, water saving devices, a pool cover etc

another wet season around the corner, another couple of trillion litres over the spillway.

Re: the drought
 

thats it im off to cairns!! i was going to ask if anybody was on this site was living out there, just to see if they had probs.

what i want to know is, is there a section of the council/government that we can start complaining to? or do i just write to every one who works there as well as the people at melbourne water.

i go to food factories as i am a service engineer and you should see some of the water waste that goes on. i see so many hosepipes without the nozzle handle on them, water pouring out of the pipes while the guy is having a fag!!

i think its just not on that we get slated in the press and told that we are on restrictions when industry is wasting so much water.

i am thinking of leaving austrailia as i dont see any progress on any front concerning this issue. i would gladly pay extra in my taxes so that i know that when i want a shower i can have one and not worry if i go over 3 mins!!!

oh well i presume it will all work out and we will have either a very very dry aussie land in the next few years with people putting up with no water or we could have a completely desserted aussie land and everyone has gone to UK again!!!!!! or canada, europe. !!!!

Re: the drought
 

We are probably going to end up with Electricity restrictions as well, as the Government sold of these utilities a while back, and since then new infrastructure becomes bottom of the list... Bit like California.

What will the Greenies say... conserve electricity, oh but you cant have a wind farm there it will spoil the view, and mention Nuclear, and they will turn purple and explode.

Re: the drought
 

I'm surprised there isn't already a centre similar to the Centre for Alternative Technology in Machynlleth, Wales but with the emphasis on water. If it exists, I have found it yet. A kind of sustainable usage water centre with courses and demonstrations of collection techniques, treatment, recycling, innovative useage etc, etc. Just like CAT, it could be developed and promoted as not just a fun activity park for kids (and adults) but as a learning centre for sustainable and innovative practices.

Re: the drought
 

We have a similar enterprise that is quite well known here in Victoria, It's in the next suburb along from me in Brunswick, It's community based, and does courses in all sorts of enviormental areas. They are doing Bio Diesel courses at present.


I've love getting down there amongs the Hippies and chatting about Nuclear power ;)

http://www.ceres.org.au/index1024x768.htm

Re: the drought
 

Thanks but no thanks. I'll stay. :)
At least it will be quiet:D

WW

Re: the drought
 

this is what i found, i know its from 2003 but it does paint a bad picture. i am all for helping out other countries but is it not better to get your own country ok first.

http://www.ausaid.gov.au/hottopics/t...1736_6372_3373

i mean $31 million could have been spent here on water saving schemes. but oh no the government would rather tax me then give my money to another country.

do they not care about the place they live in?

i guess most people have heard the advert on the radio where the woman says that we can report people for dropping litter because this is our home!!!

its just a pity we cant report the toss pot in charge of our water to anyone else!!!! unless i convert my religion to a higher power!!!!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/6121288.stm

have a read about these people and we think we have it bad. imagine having a shower with your wife/husband turning the shower off cos its over 5 mins and you still have shampoo in your hair/eyes/bum!!!!

Re: the drought
 

Thanks for that link. They are quite general in their approach with water playing only a small part.

Re: the drought
 

The day that the following happens I will either move to another part of Aussie, or Move back to the UK.... I'm serious as well.

"Obviously with the showering, we have to time the shower," says Joanne. "You have to be really careful with the washing machine. Clothes that aren't too dirty just go back in the drawer. And then there's a garden. Well, we haven't got a garden any more. We've just accepted the fact that we will never again have a nice green lush lawn."


I've got Aussie freinds here, that are proud of their mulch covered brown gardens. You go around for a BBQ and there is hardly anything Green in sight, whilst they bang on about how they dont have to water anything. Problem is with that kind of outlook, along comes Dust and flies. Anyone that thinks dust and flies accompanied by copious amounts of heat is attractive has a totally different outlook to me. You walk around in one of these gardens and create a dust trail behind you... Fair dinkum. It's bloody horrible. Problem is I think it's the way of the future here in the Dry Northern subs of Melbourne at least.

There is a New development here called Highlands on the Hume just north of Craigeburn, it's full of really big luxurious houses on large large blocks on a hill with clear expansive city views. It was this development that brought home to me the effect of this dry part of Aussie. If it were in California where they manage to capture the water particuarly around LA where rain is a novelty, it would be a paradise with lush palms and hedges, bit like a part of Beverly hills, What do we get, Brown brown barren bloody brown. It looks so bloody barren that its upsetting to drive past.

WAKE UP AUSTRALIA.

Probably rains a lot less in LA than it does here in Melbourne, yet apparently it's as green as eden.

Re: the drought
 

Believe it or not it rains less in London than it does in Melbourne!

:beer:

Buzzy

Re: the drought
 

just another quick point to all the people who MIGHT have read this post.

after reading on what people have posted about this topic, i would have thought it would have had more views and more posts seeing how this affects all of us.!!!

i mean people are still asking questions about how much much money they will get for a job, how much money they need to survive on, like $70000 is not enough!!!

what the weather is like here, what kind of spiders are going to eat them in the night!!!!,

it just doesnt matter what happens if there is no water and we all have to leave or we have to have a shower every 3 days or there is no water to drink and we have a tap at the end of the road.

its like we went to look at building a house in a section of point cook and when i asked about the grass at the front i was told in no certain terms that i had to have one, even if we went to level 4. once i started to build my house i had to a green lawn.

now it didnt matter that i couldnt water it so long as there was a bit of green at the front and im not talking about the council strip either.

i would have to pay for a bit of green grass that would have only lasted a few weeks till it got burnt, how stupid are the planners to insist this.? thats why we didnt build there and are still renting. i would have preferred a rock garden at the front!!!!

Re: the drought
 

Obviously the water shortage is an extremely serious problem, and worries those living there and those planning on living there.

However, to suggest that it should be the only topic of conversation on this forum, and that those who do discuss other things (which may be incredibly important to them too - no good finding a worthwhile and feasible solution to the drought if you can't afford to live there, can't transport your family about or you get eaten in the night by a giant spider, is there?) are somehow.. lacking.. is a bit... hmmm.

There's also a limit to how much an individual can do, AS an individual. It would be marvellous if the entire population of Australia started being water aware - but it is probably going to take a major Government initiative to produce definable results.

Lynne

Re: the drought
 

i never did suggest that this should be the only post on here, all im saying is that people dont seem to have an idea whats going on here. we all know that there are questions on this website that should never be asked, that to be honest, are very stupid ones.

what im saying is that the water situation is so dire at the moment that people should be asking where the water is coming from instead of what car they should get cos they want a really big one and they are bringing lots of money over here so they can get the biggest house. as someone else has said whats the point of coming over if we all have to have 2 showers a week and all the parks are brown. etc etc.

from what i have read on this website from this post nobody seems to be bothered to much about it. i thought, when i wrote this, i would have gotten a lot of questions/answers but not that many people came forward.

but i must say thanks to the people who actually came and said sensible things. its made me think my position in this country as i write this.

Re: the drought
 

Apparently there is a strong theory that El Nino (the mechanism that drives the drought) has peaked, and there could be a lot of rain after the end of February.... Mind you I'll beleive that when I see it. So hang in there TD.

Governments also tend to react to this kind of problem very slowly, I'm sure in the long term there will be a solution to the water shortage, problem is that solution could be over 10 years away.

Re: the drought
 

Yup, Sydney has way more too, 48" pa against 29" pa...

Re: the drought
 

There are trigger points at which the different restriction levels are introduced.

:)

Re: the drought
 

The article I read said that the water loss was for all fresh water not for that which is under management.

:)

Re: the drought
 

They probably ignored the cost of nuclear power which is only cheap and clean if you ignore some of the major costs and the radioactive waste. It would also take a long time to build.

The money would be better spent on better storage, loss reduction and recycling.

:)

Re: the drought
 

I'm not sure in what way the government is discouraging the idea?

I though all new builds in Victoria either had to have a rainwater tank or a solar water heater. The Vic government also provides grants for rainwater tanks to be used for greywater systems.

:)

Re: the drought
 

You realise the California electricity problems were caused my Enron? They were manipulating the supply so they could make money on their electricity exchange.

It's worth taking a look at the documentary file "Smartest Guys in the Room".

:)

Re: the drought
 

Is that why London has a hosepipe ban and Melbourne doesn't? :D

I've just checked and I'm still allowed to use my hosepipe to water my veggie patch as long as it's on Wednesdays and Sundays. However I've got to use a bucket to top up the pool something for which Londoners can use a hose :confused:

:)

Re: the drought
 

I realise that, but to be honest if I was in charge and saw that we only had 39% full dams I would be a bit more strict with what stage we are at.

To be honest, I would rather have to take my car to a car wash and have brown grass to save some water, rather than being told I cant wash everyday!!

Re: the drought
 

I agree with you, but they have to set the level at something which the public can stomach. Until Australians experience the shortage of water experienced in the UK 30 years ago I don't think much will change. It came as a surprise to me when I arrived, that level 2 water restrictions here is fairly much the same as UK business as usual.

:)

Re: the drought
 

Sorry, I was referring to WA governments. There is (or was, maybe I'm out of touch here) a ban on rainwater tanks being installed in the metro area.

Re: the drought
 

Fair enough. Melbourne used to have something similar. It was originally instigated in the 1800s to avoid lowering the tone of the neighbourhood.

:)

Re: the drought
 

Where we are tank ownership is almost obligatory in order to establish any sort of credibility and is worn as a badge of pride - regardless of water restrictions. Not having a tank would mean you're too thick to install one lol.

Re: the drought
 

I remember the year your talking about, 1977, I was In Milton Keynes, which was basically just a huge development. There were fires along verges etc everyday. The UK also experienced the one and only bush fire that I can ever recall when the New Forest had a Major blaze.

What I dont remember is Water restrictions though ? Certainly no impact from them.

Re: the drought
 

We have friends who live very close to CAT and they described it as a "Hippy run Chicken Farm". ...and when I went that was exactly what it looked like. :)

Re: the drought
 

Sounds exactly like Ceres here in Melbourne, one thing I was going to add before but will now, its worth a visit as it has something for everyone.

Including multitudes of Braless dread locked semi attractive women.....

With hairy armpits ;)

Re: the drought
 

Wow...39% full!!! You're bleeding well spoilt down your way then....

We've got 23.74% as of a few moments ago....

Bathing in Hahn's is going to be fun though.....

Re: the drought
 

Not being pedantic but I think the really hot summer was 76, however my memory may be slipping. During that time a few places had their water cut off and people had to get their water from stand pipes in the street. I think it was about this time that people (in those areas) started to accept recycled water.

Note that even today in places like Pembrokeshire, people are not keen on the thought of drinking recycled water.

Being a New Town, Milton Keynes probably didn't have a supply problem as its population at that time would have been small in comparison to what its infrastructure could support.

:)

Re: the drought
 

Yes it was 1976.

For the record, here in the UK I currently catch, store and recycle 600 litres of water. I don't have the space to store any more.

In Australia I intend to catch, store and recycle 5000 - 10000 litres.

:beer:

Buzzy

Re: the drought
 

Agree it was 76.

I remember standpipes in Walthamstow!

Also, we too used to collect our rainwater and recycle water in the UK and we did it in Aus in NSW in 2000 - 2003. Now, here in NZ they look at us like we're mad if we suggest it and 'why the heck would we want to water the garden from our washing machine water?'. Theyjust dont' get it. It's just habit with us. It's unlikely i nthis part of the world we're ever gonna run out of water but that doens't mean you just go bonkers and use it, use it, use it does it?

Re: the drought
 

I believe the true Sydney figure is below 30% of capacity.

The Iemma "government" (my quotes <g>) redefined the levels a little while ago so that the previously uncounted "bottom supply" water was included in the %age capacity statistics. The figure previous to this was around 30%.

The bottom supply water is water that was previously deemed unavailable/unfit for use.

Go figure!

Re: the drought
 

sorry but really their are far more important things than a green lawn:rolleyes: . Come live in the country, were much of your town water is transported from, come have a look at the farmlands were your food is grown, come see the meat markets overloaded with cattle that are getting thinner by the second, and no feed to feed to them as the irrigation rights have been removed or reduced for the farmers so that the'city folks' can wash their dam cars and water their lawns. Have a read of the rural papers, horse mags, see how many stock are being sold, given away sent to the markets for meat, or left in the paddock to die.Their is no hay/grain pasture left for them and what is available costs so much they just can't do it:(
They would all love a bit of 'green' grass, but they don't get it.
If you want lush rolling green hills move to wales, yorkshire, the cotswolds. We will probaly get green lawns again when it rains, as I am sure it will, but probaly not before many country people have gone under.
So next time your invited to a BBQ in the brown dusty flie ridden backyard of a firend...dont wear white, take the areoguard..........and have abloody good weekend:beer:
As for LA and London getting less rain than Melbouren.re-equate that to size of land............the whole of England and Ireland can fit into Victoria alone..the amount of arrable land is huge compared to London, which has none, and LA which has none.Oh they also don't have the fly population either:D

Re: the drought
 

I'd be going back if it looked like Beverly Hills...

in our part of the world - extreme south of Dandenongs we get slightly more rainful which I am glad for. I'd forgotten the North gets less.

Re: the drought
 

Australia has so many diverse environments, it ranges from lush tropical rain forest to dry arid dessert and thats in most states, the cities have been established around the nearest water ways and the best'at the time' land for developing. These towns have spread,they now converge into areas that are not as hospitable to development. Australia has always been a drier country than most. Put into it its been a profitable country for most of its time, people do not like to 'economise' om anything, its the way they have developed. We as a nation are a wasteful lot especially with our natural resources. We do not make the most of them and take them for granted. especially those of us who live in the city were it all seem to 'just happen'. :rolleyes:

Re: the drought
 

My wife was born in Parkes, outback NSW, and grew up in Bendigo, I've been here for 27 years. I've got family (in law) all over Northern Victoria. The drought was far worse in 83 as there were dust storms almost daily, so I've been reliably informed and reminded of by my Wifes country relations. I know about the bush problems, and would not live there, neither would my wife. I do however have sympathy for the people that "choose" to live in those areas.

My point is, that this country if prompted can afford to build the infrastructure to make most of the decent arrable land as green as it wants. There is no need to put up with the effect of drought if some decent money goes into building the infrastructure to provide this. Whether that be from desalnation, recycling sewage, or pipelines from other parts of Aussie who knows. I'm more than willing to pay a premium on my water rates, I'd far rather that option than long winded restrictions, which will end up necessitating what I'm banging on about anyway.

I'm damn annoyed that I've not got the choice now, to use townwater on my grass, as I would have paid whatever cost the powers that be wanted to charge me.

It's more than the simple issue of a green lawn, it's a restriction of freedom of choice, due to poor government planning.


I will install tanks, I will continue to use grey water, but I wish i could pay a premium on my water rates to ensure the long term viabilty of abundant water for the whole of Australia.