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British Expats (https://britishexpats.com/forum/)
-   Australia (https://britishexpats.com/forum/australia-54/)
-   -   COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App (https://britishexpats.com/forum/australia-54/covid-19-coronavirus-aus-govt-tracing-app-932233/)

GarryP Apr 26th 2020 10:27 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844382)
Just get on it and be a part of the solution rather than the problem.
This app is more problem than solution and I don't think anyone should be installing it. Not only is it badly set up, a vector for things we don't want, its also way too late to have any meaningful effect. When you have zero new cases, what's it supposed to do exactly, other than allow government to gauge exactly how dumb the general public are?

I'm betting it will be hacked inside 24 hours as well

Beoz Apr 26th 2020 11:12 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12844384)
This app is more problem than solution and I don't think anyone should be installing it. Not only is it badly set up, a vector for things we don't want, its also way too late to have any meaningful effect. When you have zero new cases, what's it supposed to do exactly, other than allow government to gauge exactly how dumb the general public are?
Garry, you have criminal history on waiting to take down anything the Liberal party implement. This just another one of your propaganda stunts. And a selfish dangerous one at that.

Badly set up? Why do tell. I have just told you the validation works fine so your propaganda came unstuck there.

You tried to tell us a few weeks back we needed full lockdown . That was total incorrect propaganda and as a result you haven't been seen on here for a week.

We are virtually at 0 new cases. This is the perfect time to implement in case of a wave 2. Is it really going to hurt you to receive a phone call telling you someone in Coles had the virus and you should have a test, perhaps to protect someone elderly close to you?

Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12844384)
I'm betting it will be hacked inside 24 hours as well
So? So can any app on your phone. Ever do internet banking?

GarryP Apr 26th 2020 11:29 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844402)
Garry, you have criminal history on waiting to take down anything the Liberal party implement. This just another one of your propaganda stunts. And a selfish dangerous one at that.
Sigh. Why is it the liberal/libertarian types are always the one to trust governments, provided they agree with the ideology? Usually of governments with fascist tendencies. This would be extremely dangerous for people to support no matter their politics. Which is I guess why you fall for it hook line and sinker.

Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844402)
Badly set up? Why do tell. I have just told you the validation works fine so your propaganda came unstuck there.
Bollocks. Just go and look at the people taking this app apart. It's very much amateur hour, which makes me think it will be perverted very quicky.

Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844402)
You tried to tell us a few weeks back we needed full lockdown . That was total incorrect propaganda and as a result you haven't been seen on here for a week.
You think I was wrong? You really haven't been paying attention, the only solution is eradication, as I said. Still is, even more so with the understanding that's been gained on reinfection and ventilators. Oh, and I've been on a different computer which is why I didn't bother to log in.

Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844402)
We are virtually at 0 new cases. This is the perfect time to implement in case of a wave 2.
Yep, focus on eradication and that's it. This app has nothing to do with that target.

the troubadour Apr 26th 2020 11:32 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Don't be a lemming. It'll be a hard sell, I expect anyway. The Lib's certainly cannot be trusted . I have given an example previously. If you feel it is in your interest to get the app, by all means do so. Those of us that won't be getting it have ample concerns outlined already around the matter.


Beoz Apr 26th 2020 11:39 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12844412)
Sigh. Why is it the liberal/libertarian types are always the one to trust governments, provided they agree with the ideology? Usually of governments with fascist tendencies. This would be extremely dangerous for people to support no matter their politics. Which is I guess why you fall for it hook line and sinker.
It's got nothing to do with trusting governments. It's got everything to do with adopting a tool which will pin point some people a positive person has been in contact with.

You have been attempting to social distance right? That's the governments message. It's an easier message to sell because it's all about you you you. This one is all about everyone. It's just a slight re-adjustment for you.

Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12844412)
You think I was wrong? You really haven't been paying attention, the only solution is eradication, as I said. Still is, even more so with the understanding that's been gained on reinfection and ventilators. Oh, and I've been on a different computer which is why I didn't bother to log in.

Yep, focus on eradication and that's it. This app has nothing to do with that target.
Find me a country that has eradicated the virus? It doesn't exist.

Find me a teacher that has been infected by a student? Again it doesn't exist.

Propaganda

Beoz Apr 26th 2020 11:42 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by the troubadour (Post 12844414)
Don't be a lemming. It'll be a hard sell, I expect anyway. The Lib's certainly cannot be trusted . I have given an example previously. If you feel it is in your interest to get the app, by all means do so. Those of us that won't be getting it have ample concerns outlined already around the matter.
Yep. Let's trust Aderns method of seeking a non existent zero over a Morrison way of flattening the curve which as a by product has done better than Adern, with still a bit of an economy left. Yep ...... the left wingers fooled again.

Amazulu Apr 26th 2020 1:03 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12844412)
Usually of governments with fascist tendencies.
:rofl:

moneypenny20 Apr 26th 2020 1:06 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Can we keep not resort yet again to personal insults and political nonsense? Discuss the app rationally and politely. Let's see if you can manage that.

abner May 4th 2020 2:00 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
The real problem with the app is that its contact-tracing use case is basically trivial until mass-transit utilisation gets back above the 10 - 15% of normal patronage that it currently sits at now, or dining and entertainment venues are allowed to become crowded again. Neither of those things is going to happen soon.

That leaves plenty of time to see the promised source-code release, the promised privacy legislation, and solutions to the usability bugs the app presents, before any thinking person needs to consider adopting it.

Beoz May 5th 2020 1:44 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by abner (Post 12848137)
The real problem with the app is that its contact-tracing use case is basically trivial until mass-transit utilisation gets back above the 10 - 15% of normal patronage that it currently sits at now, or dining and entertainment venues are allowed to become crowded again. Neither of those things is going to happen soon.

That leaves plenty of time to see the promised source-code release, the promised privacy legislation, and solutions to the usability bugs the app presents, before any thinking person needs to consider adopting it.
Chicken and egg situation. The app needs adoption before mass-transit, dining or entertainment venues are allowed to be back in business.

the troubadour May 6th 2020 3:20 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12848457)
Chicken and egg situation. The app needs adoption before mass-transit, dining or entertainment venues are allowed to be back in business.
No it doesn't. Already places around the world are 'opening up' sans app. No where has achieved the numbers required to my knowledge to even begin to make this work. With such safe guards unlikely anywhere will either. What is needed is a clear indication that the virus is in decline as appears the case in certain Australian states and a managed return to some degree of normalcy over time.

the troubadour May 6th 2020 3:25 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12844419)
Yep. Let's trust Aderns method of seeking a non existent zero over a Morrison way of flattening the curve which as a by product has done better than Adern, with still a bit of an economy left. Yep ...... the left wingers fooled again.
Best leave out the political ideology. If you prefer the right's take that has cost countless lives in UK, USA , Brazil to name a few then your choice. NZ done, as I explained exceptionally well. Nobody knew just how bad this virus would be in the early stages, and many unknowns are still out there. Adern done the right thing.
Not sure how politics can be divorced from matters around virus. It is as witnessed around the world an extremely political matter just as scietific.


Beoz May 8th 2020 2:44 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by the troubadour (Post 12848973)
Best leave out the political ideology. If you prefer the right's take that has cost countless lives in UK, USA , Brazil to name a few then your choice. NZ done, as I explained exceptionally well. Nobody knew just how bad this virus would be in the early stages, and many unknowns are still out there. Adern done the right thing.
Not sure how politics can be divorced from matters around virus. It is as witnessed around the world an extremely political matter just as scietific.
There's very few things the UK, USA, and Brazil have in common with New Zealand and the way to play virus control. Land size, Population, Density of living, Methods of movement, all those things which can make a viral epidemic better or worse have no relevance between New Zealand and the countries you mention. You would be better off doing your research around places like Iceland and Taiwan. As for how they knew how bad it would be in the early stages, true to a degree, but a lot of countries had to the head start, Ardern could have looked at Iceland and Taiwan. See was probably looking at Italy and thinking, "how can I grab a few headlines in amongst this". That's the way she rolls.

paulry May 8th 2020 10:34 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12849926)
There's very few things the UK, USA, and Brazil have in common with New Zealand and the way to play virus control. Land size, Population, Density of living, Methods of movement, all those things which can make a viral epidemic better or worse have no relevance between New Zealand and the countries you mention. You would be better off doing your research around places like Iceland and Taiwan. As for how they knew how bad it would be in the early stages, true to a degree, but a lot of countries had to the head start, Ardern could have looked at Iceland and Taiwan. See was probably looking at Italy and thinking, "how can I grab a few headlines in amongst this". That's the way she rolls.
:goodpost:

spouse of scouse May 19th 2020 7:13 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12848457)
Chicken and egg situation. The app needs adoption before mass-transit, dining or entertainment venues are allowed to be back in business.
Well that's what the Federal government told us. But they lied.

The federal government sold the app to the public as the key to easing restrictions across the country, however last week when the Senate debated the legislation for the app, foreign minister Marise Payne admitted the number of downloads of the app was not a consideration for national cabinet in the easing of restrictions.

“The approach to easing of restrictions, as you will have seen through the national cabinet process, is based on the health advice that’s received through the [Australian Health Protection Principal Committee], where it’s possible for Australia and Australians to do.

“And the states and territories are using that as the premise, not based on the number of people who have downloaded the app.”
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...ontact-tracing

Beoz May 20th 2020 1:10 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12855361)
Well that's what the Federal government told us. But they lied.

The federal government sold the app to the public as the key to easing restrictions across the country, however last week when the Senate debated the legislation for the app, foreign minister Marise Payne admitted the number of downloads of the app was not a consideration for national cabinet in the easing of restrictions.

“The approach to easing of restrictions, as you will have seen through the national cabinet process, is based on the health advice that’s received through the [Australian Health Protection Principal Committee], where it’s possible for Australia and Australians to do.

“And the states and territories are using that as the premise, not based on the number of people who have downloaded the app.”
https://www.theguardian.com/australi...ontact-tracing
Why bother fighting it? If it helps in anyway shape or form to speed up the contact tracing abilities just install it. This morning the NSW CMO said their analysis of the data shows excellent results on Android and poorer results on Apple but they are tweaking the app to perform better on Apple. Like all software the first release is never the final. Just install it and stop being a hindrance.

moneypenny20 May 20th 2020 8:16 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Woman at work asked me how the app was supposed to work because it just kept closing on her. I asked if she had an iPhone and she does. Told her to leave the app open when she locked the phone. She looked later and found her battery nearly dead. Not an Apple user so don't look at me for help!

Beoz May 20th 2020 8:35 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12855559)
Woman at work asked me how the app was supposed to work because it just kept closing on her. I asked if she had an iPhone and she does. Told her to leave the app open when she locked the phone. She looked later and found her battery nearly dead. Not an Apple user so don't look at me for help!
Another fine advertisment for Apple.

Pollyana May 20th 2020 11:40 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12855559)
Woman at work asked me how the app was supposed to work because it just kept closing on her. I asked if she had an iPhone and she does. Told her to leave the app open when she locked the phone. She looked later and found her battery nearly dead. Not an Apple user so don't look at me for help!
It wlll kill the battery.
She needs to keep the app open, phone unlocked bluetooth running .... as you said. But she will also need to keep the phone on charge or running off portable power packs. Just insane. Why design an app of such potential importance that drains phone batteries?

Beoz May 20th 2020 8:23 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Pollyana (Post 12855620)
It wlll kill the battery.
She needs to keep the app open, phone unlocked bluetooth running .... as you said. But she will also need to keep the phone on charge or running off portable power packs. Just insane. Why design an app of such potential importance that drains phone batteries?
Ha ha. Why design an app that uses Bluetooth? Ha ha. I think you meant to day "Why design a phone that drains your battery using Bluetooth".

It's a bit like saying my web browser is so slow because I refuse to upgrade from a dial up modem.

Oh Apple. Thankfully the iPhone is nearly dead and buried.

PS (I suspect and hope the later models are not such a drain on battery when using Bluetooth.)

spouse of scouse May 24th 2020 12:29 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12855476)
Why bother fighting it? If it helps in anyway shape or form to speed up the contact tracing abilities just install it. This morning the NSW CMO said their analysis of the data shows excellent results on Android and poorer results on Apple but they are tweaking the app to perform better on Apple. Like all software the first release is never the final. Just install it and stop being a hindrance.
Who's fighting what? :confused: And I have no idea what relevance the rest of your post has to what I posted. I was simply pointing out that what we'd been told about the numbers downloading the app being necessary before restrictions could be eased wasn't true.

Beoz May 25th 2020 6:01 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12857262)
Who's fighting what? :confused: And I have no idea what relevance the rest of your post has to what I posted. I was simply pointing out that what we'd been told about the numbers downloading the app being necessary before restrictions could be eased wasn't true.
They also said lockdown would be in place until September. They also said free child care was for 6 months - they changed it. Victoria said school would not resume until term 3. Queensland want closed borders until September. NSW bought 1200 ventilators - they are currently using 3. They said 6 million people are on job seeker - due to some dumb employers putting in 1500 rather than 1 it turns out to be 3 million.

I don't think there is a rule book on COVID 19 even for the medical professionals who give the guidance here.

spouse of scouse May 25th 2020 7:49 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12857516)
They also said lockdown would be in place until September. They also said free child care was for 6 months - they changed it. Victoria said school would not resume until term 3. Queensland want closed borders until September. NSW bought 1200 ventilators - they are currently using 3. They said 6 million people are on job seeker - due to some dumb employers putting in 1500 rather than 1 it turns out to be 3 million.

I don't think there is a rule book on COVID 19 even for the medical professionals who give the guidance here.
I really think if someone said 'it's a nice day' you'd turn it into a rant :lol: You know, sometimes people just post something for information without an ulterior motive in mind.

Beoz May 25th 2020 7:56 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by spouse of scouse (Post 12857537)
I really think if someone said 'it's a nice day' you'd turn it into a rant :lol: You know, sometimes people just post something for information without an ulterior motive in mind.
Its not a nice day, in Perth or Sydney. Right? :)

GarryP May 26th 2020 10:51 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
<snip>

On an alternative track, what is it with it the idiots in Victoria that they can't deal with the infectious and potentially infectious? Who the hell lets someone get on a domestic aircraft after an international arrival without testing them before FFS? Looks like it's not luck that means Victoria still has cases - it's incompetence.

Beoz May 26th 2020 9:14 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 12857986)
<snip>

On an alternative track, what is it with it the idiots in Victoria that they can't deal with the infectious and potentially infectious? Who the hell lets someone get on a domestic aircraft after an international arrival without testing them before FFS? Looks like it's not luck that means Victoria still has cases - it's incompetence.
Not aware of this story. Isn't everyone entering from abroad supposed to be 2 week hotel quarrentined in their arrival city?

moneypenny20 Jun 19th 2020 3:57 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Got in the car yesterday and was confused why Spotify didn't start up. Forgot about it until I was reading a FB post from a friend saying he'd found the COVID app had been put on his phone without his knowledge. Checked and found it on mine. I must have missed the memo saying they were doing that. Not impressed.

Beoz Jun 19th 2020 8:46 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869062)
Got in the car yesterday and was confused why Spotify didn't start up. Forgot about it until I was reading a FB post from a friend saying he'd found the COVID app had been put on his phone without his knowledge. Checked and found it on mine. I must have missed the memo saying they were doing that. Not impressed.
Are you saying the Australian government has forced Apple or Android to install an app on your phone?

scrubbedexpat098 Jun 19th 2020 11:49 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12869125)
Are you saying the Australian government has forced Apple or Android to install an app on your phone?
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...5b132f93b.jpeg

moneypenny20 Jun 19th 2020 2:07 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12869125)
Are you saying the Australian government has forced Apple or Android to install an app on your phone?
I'm saying I didn't download the app on my Android but yesterday it was on my Android. I've never even looked the app up.

Pollyana Jun 19th 2020 10:56 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869253)
I'm saying I didn't download the app on my Android but yesterday it was on my Android. I've never even looked the app up.
Well, a few questions and a lot of digging around overnight....... no evidence at all of any plans to force the app onto people's phones. Its a mystery.

Pollyana Jun 20th 2020 3:19 pm
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869253)
I'm saying I didn't download the app on my Android but yesterday it was on my Android. I've never even looked the app up.
Seems it isn't the Govt app, its the phone company.....https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53120290A Covid-19 tracing software tool has appeared in the settings of both Android phones and iPhones as part of an update of their operating systems.

The "exposure notification" tool is switched off by default, and is not a tracing app itself.

It enables an app to run in the background while still using Bluetooth.

This lets the app measure the distance between two handsets - and then alert the phone owner if someone near them later tests positive for Covid-19.

Beoz Jun 21st 2020 12:11 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869253)
I'm saying I didn't download the app on my Android but yesterday it was on my Android. I've never even looked the app up.
Was it the COVIDSafe app? As Polly pointed out Apple and Google have been working on their own apps.

moneypenny20 Jun 21st 2020 12:46 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by Pollyana (Post 12869694)
Seems it isn't the Govt app, its the phone company.....https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53120290A Covid-19 tracing software tool has appeared in the settings of both Android phones and iPhones as part of an update of their operating systems.

The "exposure notification" tool is switched off by default, and is not a tracing app itself.

It enables an app to run in the background while still using Bluetooth.

This lets the app measure the distance between two handsets - and then alert the phone owner if someone near them later tests positive for Covid-19.
Interesting, thanks Poll.

Originally Posted by Beoz (Post 12869845)
Was it the COVIDSafe app? As Polly pointed out Apple and Google have been working on their own apps.
Can't remember, I deleted it after seeing COVID app. Updates are one thing, installing random apps during an update, and turning off Bluetooth at the same time is something else entirely. No matter, in future I' might actually read what's going to be updated before clicking the 'Update now' button so I'm not taken by surprise when something odd happens! :D

scrubbedexpat098 Jun 21st 2020 12:58 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869857)
Interesting, thanks Poll.



Can't remember, I deleted it after seeing COVID app. Updates are one thing, installing random apps during an update, and turning off Bluetooth at the same time is something else entirely. No matter, in future I' might actually read what's going to be updated before clicking the 'Update now' button so I'm not taken by surprise when something odd happens! :D
I learnt my lesson when a U2 album downloaded itself to my iPod some years ago, horrific it was :lol:

moneypenny20 Jun 21st 2020 1:52 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by stevenglish1 (Post 12869861)
I learnt my lesson when a U2 album downloaded itself to my iPod some years ago, horrific it was :lol:
I remember feeling very smug about having a Samsung at the time! Oops, payback is a definitely a bitch. :D

scrubbedexpat098 Jun 21st 2020 2:24 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869878)
I remember feeling very smug about having a Samsung at the time! Oops, payback is a definitely a bitch. :D
:rofl:, haha they'll all get us in the end

moneypenny20 Jun 21st 2020 4:57 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by stevenglish1 (Post 12869889)
:rofl:, haha they'll all get us in the end
Mind you, a COVID app is still preferable to a not great U2 album so Samsung are still winning. ;)

scrubbedexpat098 Jun 21st 2020 5:01 am
Re: COVID-19 / Coronavirus - Aus Govt Tracing App
 
Originally Posted by moneypenny20 (Post 12869918)
Mind you, a COVID app is still preferable to a not great U2 album so Samsung are still winning. ;)
it's a toss up between the U2 album and the actual virus for me haha


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