Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Jan 24th 2006, 9:16 pm
#16
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 11,948
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by annqldau
Plus the fact that they use our UK pension crap as we should get what we are due there plus what we have paid for here... 
I don't know if it's the same for civvy pensions, but I would certainly hope that both states aren't obliged to support British ex-pats simultaneously.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:22 pm
#17
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 423
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Vash the Stampede
You don't have an option to opt out, but OTOH you don't pay anything towards it in the first place - unlike National Insurance in the UK, which costs an awful lot during your earning years and gives you virtually nothing back in your declining years.
As I said, most Australians don't bother with the state pension anyway; why would you, when superannuation makes so much more sense?
And with the pension so low, there is no incentive to "be a waster"; I can assure you that you'd have plenty to worry about if you chose to rely on the state to feed you when you're 70+.
As I said, most Australians don't bother with the state pension anyway; why would you, when superannuation makes so much more sense?
And with the pension so low, there is no incentive to "be a waster"; I can assure you that you'd have plenty to worry about if you chose to rely on the state to feed you when you're 70+.
But what about self employed people? They pay into a superann. fund? Is that the same thing in Oz as a private pension?
Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
The 9% that the employer pays is for something very different to the Government Aged pension, and we get that no matter what.
I think it is the terminology that is confusing.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:24 pm
#18
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Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Adelaide
Posts: 716
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
There is a bit of truth in it, relating to the Asset test for the Aged Pension.
An individual, claimig the pension, is allowed to own a residential property, without it being included in that persons assets.
However, there is a limit to the size of land that they can class as being residential (i'm not sure exactly what the size is), and anything over that is classed as an investment, and would be valued by the government valuer, and added to the persons total assets. If the total assets then exceed the threshold, the pension can be reduced or cancelled.
The Aged Pension is aimed to help the less well off, and this test helps to keep it within its aims.
An individual, claimig the pension, is allowed to own a residential property, without it being included in that persons assets.
However, there is a limit to the size of land that they can class as being residential (i'm not sure exactly what the size is), and anything over that is classed as an investment, and would be valued by the government valuer, and added to the persons total assets. If the total assets then exceed the threshold, the pension can be reduced or cancelled.
The Aged Pension is aimed to help the less well off, and this test helps to keep it within its aims.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:24 pm
#19
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Posts: n/a
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
A little extra info that people may not be aware of, and may help in the understanding of this.
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
Jan 24th 2006, 9:28 pm
#20
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 9,066
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Mmmm... was talking to an expat the other day of retirement wage and she gets her uk pension paid via USA something to do with exchange rate then to Centerlink who then take into account her UK pension then cough up the Australian one.
Must admit all this what to do with the dosh is so confusing. Have ended up leaving all my UK stuff in UK and just starting again and will take what ever pittance the UK send over.
Must admit all this what to do with the dosh is so confusing. Have ended up leaving all my UK stuff in UK and just starting again and will take what ever pittance the UK send over.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:28 pm
#21
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 423
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
A little extra info that people may not be aware of, and may help in the understanding of this.
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
If that is the case, why then are taxes not so much lower in Oz then?
Jan 24th 2006, 9:30 pm
#22
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Stephen
I think it is the terminology that is confusing.
Originally Posted by Stephen
But what about self employed people? They pay into a superann. fund? Is that the same thing in Oz as a private pension?
It goes into an individiual plan in your name, and is yours.
Self employed effectively have the option not to have one, but should consider the consequences, unless of course, they sell their business when they retire, and use the lump sum for an annuity, etc.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:33 pm
#23
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Posts: n/a
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Stephen
If that is the case, why then are taxes not so much lower in Oz then?
So much space to look after, not enough population (taxpayers) to pay for it all easily.
No easy answers.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:33 pm
#24
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 423
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
Yes, I agree
Australian Super is the same as a UK Private pension Plan, but employers must contribute at least 9% into it for you.
It goes into an individiual plan in your name, and is yours.
Self employed effectively have the option not to have one, but should consider the consequences, unless of course, they sell their business when they retire, and use the lump sum for an annuity, etc.
Australian Super is the same as a UK Private pension Plan, but employers must contribute at least 9% into it for you.
It goes into an individiual plan in your name, and is yours.
Self employed effectively have the option not to have one, but should consider the consequences, unless of course, they sell their business when they retire, and use the lump sum for an annuity, etc.
That makes things much clearer, thanks. What kind of tax relief do you get on contributions?
Jan 24th 2006, 9:41 pm
#25
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 11,948
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Stephen
Ahhhhh! This makes more sense. So the Aged Pension is a saftey net only (equiv. Income support), and what you call superannuation in Australia is what we would call any pension in the UK?
But what about self employed people? They pay into a superann. fund? Is that the same thing in Oz as a private pension?
Jan 24th 2006, 9:43 pm
#26
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Stephen
That makes things much clearer, thanks. What kind of tax relief do you get on contributions?
Example
Sally makes two contributions totalling $31 000 to a complying superannuation fund on 2 February 2005 and 12 May 2005. Sally was born on 31 May 1968, so she is over 35 years of age on 12 May 2005.
The deduction she can claim is limited to the lesser of:
$5,000 + (75% x $26,000) = $24,500
and
$38,702 (Sally's age based limit)
Therefore, Sally can claim a deduction of $24,500.
Jan 24th 2006, 9:46 pm
#27
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2003
Location: Scotland
Posts: 7,949
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by ABCDiamond
A little extra info that people may not be aware of, and may help in the understanding of this.
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
In the UK the contributions, towards government benefits, medical , pensions etc, can total 23.8% of a person wage
11% Employees’ primary Class 1 rate between primary threshold (£97) and upper earnings limit (£645)
12.8% Employers’ secondary Class 1 rate above secondary threshold (£97)
Whilst in Australia it is 1.5% with nothing from the employer.
Bottom line is. Expect nothing from the Government for your retirement. Retirement funds should be taken care of with our individual Super plans, paid for by the employer, and topped up with extra contributions if we so desire.
Comparing it to the UK system, you could actually say that we have all opted out
No doubt ABCD will be able to quote the comparative total tax burden as a % of income to shed light on my gut feeling that the tax burden is heavier in the UK.
Why has no one commented on the thread title which goes into the 'Classic Typos' databank - or is it just me?
OzTennis
Jan 24th 2006, 9:51 pm
#28
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by OzTennis
No doubt ABCD will be able to quote the comparative total tax burden as a % of income to shed light on my gut feeling that the tax burden is heavier in the UK.
I'm not going to work that out
Too complex, I only do the easy stuff.
Jan 24th 2006, 10:04 pm
#29
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 11,948
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by Stephen
If that is the case, why then are taxes not so much lower in Oz then?
I'm finally earning the same here in the UK that I did back home in Australia, but losing the same amount in tax and NI. The NI component is particularly annoying, since (a) it is so obscenely large, and (b) I will never benefit from it.
I have also noticed that VAT in the UK (17.5%) is a lot higher than GST in Australia (10%.) So I'm actually paying nearly twice as much sales tax here, than I did back home.
When comparing Australia with other countries, the ATO (Australian Taxation Office) employs the following criteria:
For the purposes of comparison, countries have been
chosen that import capital, are potential destinations for permanent Australian emigrants, have comparable welfare systems, and whose governments provide similar services.
That sounds pretty reasonable to me.
The Australian taxation system also has many more grades than the UK system:
This table also shows that the Australian personal income tax system, in comparison with these particular countries, is unique, in that it features a zero tax rate for the first $6 000 and has more steps in its scale.
Within the OECD only Luxembourg, Portugal, Switzerland and the United States have more steps in their personal income tax scales than Australia. It is difficult to assess the impact of these tax structures from such a table, but one can gain an appreciation of this impact by observing the average percentage of income paid as tax at various incomes levels.
For example:
Australia
0% tax up to $6000
16.5% tax up to $21 600
31.5% tax up to $63 000
43.5% tax up to $95 000
48.5% on $95 000+
Compared with:
UK
10% tax up to $4990
22% tax up to $77 381
40% on $77 381+
So we see that the lowest earners actually pay less tax in Australia than in the UK.
Jan 24th 2006, 10:12 pm
#30
Fighting my corner
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 11,948
Re: Buying over a certain Acreage stops Penison???
Originally Posted by OzTennis
That's why I have a quiet chuckle to myself when I read all the claims on here that taxation is more burdensome in Australia than the UK. Yes, if you look at the upper marginal rate of income taxation in both countries that might lead you to come to this conclusion but it is the overall taxation burden which is relevant. When you factor in National Insurance contributions, VAT at 17.5% (GST 10%), TV licence, heavy excise on petrol, tobacco etc, council taxes far higher than council rates and so on the UK is not as lightly taxed as people would lead you to believe.
No doubt ABCD will be able to quote the comparative total tax burden as a % of income to shed light on my gut feeling that the tax burden is heavier in the UK.
No doubt ABCD will be able to quote the comparative total tax burden as a % of income to shed light on my gut feeling that the tax burden is heavier in the UK.
