fa0019

Hi all expats

At the initial stages of potentially emigrating to Cape Town from London and was hoping for some advice on certain issues I have.

I have been to the city and SA many times as my partner is an Afrikaner from Kaapstad but after many years in the UK she is yearning for us to ‘give living in SA a shot’.

I was hoping some people may be able to give me a better idea on certain aspects about living in SA. I fear that my partner is slightly de-sensitised of much of the problems in the city/country and wanted to get a unbiased viewpoint.

We are currently looking to make the move in Spring/Summer of 2009. We are both in our mid/late 20s and have no dependants (yet…though this may complicate the issue further down the line).

Job opportunities

I’m a FO investment banker for a tier 1 IB in the city and want to know what opportunities there would be for me. Whilst I know my skills are more suited to Jo’burg it’s not really an option for us and I have heard that there are quite a few asset management firms such as Investec in CT which I could be suited to.

I know I’ll be taking a substantial pay cut moving to the city but what sort of salaries should I be looking at? Is BEE a problem for migrants such as ourselves?

Differences in Law

Is there any significant differences in British/SA law that I should be aware of/concerned about?

Rights as a permanent resident

Are they similar to that of citizen? Whilst I know that many choose not to, are firearms licences permitted to PR?

Property

We would be looking to live/buy in a secure facility such as the Island Club in Century City (we have stayed they many times before).
I have been slightly put off areas such as Claremont, Llandudno and Constantia as whilst they seem very beautiful I have been told that the crime rates are higher in these parts then some due to its affluence. Are their more secure housing in these areas like the island club in CC???

Security Issues

How far should people be go in protecting themselves, their family etc. Is hijacking a issue in the city. My partner has been hi-jacked mugged in her car twice (although each time they were unarmed) when she lived in CT before. Is bullet-proof cars an option/pure fantasy/viable.
How much should I put aside to secure my home/cars/lifestyle???

Finally I guess that there is an expats club, community within the city. As my partner is Afrikaans I have never really seen that part (if it exists). Would someone be able to enlighten me on the options… Expat football teams, clubs et al.

Thanks all for reading

Fa0019

Mitzyboy

Welcome to the forum FA0019









Be gentle everyone

Tegwyn

You're no fun at all.....

Tegwyn

I hope you both do some serious soul searching before packing up everything to move over. Leave your property/investments/cash in the UK until you have had enough time in SA to determine whether this is a good move for you. Good luck.

Daxk

She's been hijacked twice and is missing it so much.....?
Please....
This is a setup
INMHO.

Tegwyn

Well, maybe she's looking for adventure???

fa0019

Unfortunately this is true. One of the times I would mention that she accidently drove into Khayelitsha but you can understand why I said I wanted opinions/advice from those with less biased view points.

In some ways I find Afrikaans more attached to the land and more reluctant to leave then other European SA's.... no disrespect intended.
I do like the city and do believe that we could lead a good lifestyle as least whilst we have no dependants but I fear my attitudes will change once they arrive. Thanks for the reply though. Fa0019.

fa0019

Thanks for the reply Tegwyn.

We go back to CT around twice a year so we are kept well up speed with national/city developments. However I would admit that spending two weeks every six months in a seapoint 4/5* hotel does not allow you to see the real picture.

We will be keeping as much property/investments as possible and think I will have enough to at least be able to keep up with the rises in property value if we were to return to the UK. By looks of it if you want to live in a safe and pleasant environment you would have to spend R2MM on a property.... I may be mistaken though and with IR of 15%+ its a big penalty to hold a mortgage at least... I certainly won't be putting money from the UK into SA as the return is greater and safer

We are not married yet and I would be slightly reluctant about getting married for a visa alone (bit of a old romantic really - sanctity of marriage et al). However I have already spoken to some investment firms in CT and was told with my qualifications MSc, BA and investment banking experience this would problem.
I will however not be moving with a job that is for certain and would want to have all in order before we left.

I do believe we can make a go at things for a few years at least, I admit that if were totally up to me we would not go but my partner has very strong family ties in SA and being Afrikaans they can't just up-root to the UK like she and I (she has a highly skilled UK visa herself).

Thanks for the reply. Fa0019

sa2oz

This is not true from experience in Australia. The English speaking South Africans are outnumbered about 8 or 10 to 1.
A guy I know moved to JHB because of better prospects. He was from Capetown. His wife from JHB wants to return to Capetown but also wants the great lifestyle she has in JHB.
banks are all affecte by BEE, and in fact have made big moves in getting this going. It was so bad going into the bank to sort out a few issues, as my personal banker, went from being a highly experienced clever white lady, to a young stupid arrogant black, more concerned about her new BMW and the fashion she could afford. Eventually I had to raise a few complains to speak to someone who was competent.
Good luck to you

fa0019

Hi Sa2oz

This is just what I have experienced through the SA's I know in the UK and in SA itself. Perhaps its because Afrikaners have more difficulty in leaving...i.e. lack of heritage/highly skilled visa's, EU passports etc. Thanks, Fa0019

Juggernaut

fa0019, unfortunately a lot of S.A's in the UK you might come across, Afrikaans and English speaking do themselves and the people they advise a great disservice by painting every one in S.A with the same brush. As in the post above you would notice that the clever "white" lady was replaced by the stupid "black"... (No mention of whether she qualifies to be called a lady or not ). I do still live in S.A , more than can be said for most of the detractors on here and too often as in the case above one might be judged as stupid, or arrogant ,concerned about your BMW (how the hell does that factor into the equation ?) before you even open your mouth. And he is surprised he ran into some hostility ?

Does the banks have BEE policies in place .They do and rightly so .Does that mean you wont get employed .Of course not ! You mentioned you spoke to some investment firms already ...did they seem averse to employing someone as skilled and qualified as you ?

Keeping assets abroad is the prudent thing to do not only as a exit strategy but for sound investment reasons.

You have been made more than aware of the security situation .Having family here in S.A is ideal, simply to help you settle and for local advise.

I'm no legal expert but I do believe that S.A law is based on the British system down the silly wigs they wear

If you do decide to take the plunge... Enjoy !

guest5234

Am I missing something? You say your girlfriend is Afrikaans; surely she has family and relatives still living out there who could give an honest opinion of the state of the Country at the moment, you also say you have been many times to za, you would surely get a “feel” about the place…hmmmm call me cynical.

fa0019

guest5234 in reply to your email

you are correct, my partner is afrikaans and moved over here a few years back. All her family and many friends are in CT.

However if you read my original comment I said that I believed her judgement to be clouded due to national pride, a sense of nostalgia and becoming de-sensitised by growing up and getting used to a country in somewhat difficult circumstances.

Whilst my partner knows of my concerns should I go behind her back and voice my concerns to her friends (note- her) over my worries, reluctance to make the move. Especially as there is an obvious underlining agenda behind all of their answers.. i.e. they miss their daughter, friend etc and want her/us to come 'home'.
I don't begrudge them for this but I don't trust them either under these circumstances.

As you can see I am slightly concerned about the move which is not definite yet likely within the next 12-18months.
I have been to CT about half a dozen times over the last few years and have spent the majority of it in 5* hotels oblivious to the real issues of the country.

Does visiting a country, watching Whales in Hermanes, dining in Franschoek et al really build someones real awareness of the job climate, security issues in the country???

It seems rather obtuse in my mind that you wouldn't see the reasons behind posting genuine questions onto this forum...especially as they're pretty much spelt out on the posting.

Call me cynical but do you really think that comments such as your own are actually helpful????

Mitzyboy

OK, you're cynical.
You shouldn't be suspicious of anyone that asks a question here. I lived in the UK for over 50 years, but there are plenty of beaurocratic matters I still know nothing about

guest5234

I apologise, as you do seem genuine, there are a lot of WUM on the Africa threads that anything out of the ordinary sets alarm bells ringing.