dharan saudi arabia
Apr 16th 2005, 5:23 pm
#16
nurse
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: uk - the wold soon
Posts: 12
Re: dharan saudi arabia
[QUOTE=Frans Wind]
What can i say, apart from thank you. I spoke to a recruitment agency yesterday and aramco are doing all their own recruitment via the internet, and what used to take about 4 months could take considerably longer, so will wait it out. What did you do whilst out there? as your knowledge is excellent, I have spoken to some phillipino nurses who worked there and they felt that the European nurses were treated in a vastly different way to themselves, and had mentioned the religious police siting an incident where one of their collgues got into a taxi unescorted and ended up in jail. Scary. Do you have any idea what the wives on these compounds do if not work and turn themselves inside out with boredom because i think that would be my nightmare, that we eventually get accomodation but i have no job. I would imagine there are things to do, but again it must be restrictive. ??
Perhaps not so easy for you to answer however i do appreciate your insight and knowledge. Look forward to hearing from you slbj
Originally Posted by slbj1
Thank you frans, what a well informed answer, so many people have differing opinions its nice to hear a balanced view point. Ime having trouble getting any response from aramco, so will keep perseveering, as really dont want to work for other organisations that i have been told are non payers, or their organisation has dubeious history. Going out in july for a look, not an ideal time with the temperature, however not much choice, and its just a visit, hop the air cons good is all i will say, as uk is somewhat colder in july??????
Hi Slbj1,
I'll forgive you the insult of thinking I was German I was actually born in the USA so I'm 50/50 Dutch and American. Take your time with Aramco okay? They tend to hire only the best of the best they can get from Europe or the USA. What I would advise you to do is to drop by the human resources department of Aramco at Dharan. If you're well qualified? And they know your husband already works legally in the Kingdom? Well it could speed up the procedure at there UK offices. If they do create a "Possible employee file" on you? Ask for the file number as reference and proof you visited the head office Dharan. I know out of other experiences that the UK office is sensative in a possitive way to that. But getting into Aramco can be frustrating, I agree. But the full employee's package Aramco offers can be awesome and 100% for sure worth the effords.
And if you do want to live in a compound after all? Well the "Aramco Village" in Dharan isn't bad at all to say it mildly. If Aramco is interested in you? Ask them if they still have an immigration staff member inside Dharan Airport. These people will really speed up things getting you through customes at Dharan, which can take several hours otherwise. In most cases, your husband will have the official "Family Visa" in his passport. But be sure to double check at the Saudi embassy in the UK if everything is okay paperwise.
I would really avoid working for government hospitals in Saudi Arabia. They are well known for "delaying" payments to there (entire) staff for several months if needed. And the doctors? Well a experienced expat? Strongly doubts if they really are doctors. There are a few really good private medical clinics though, also all located in Al Khobar. You would have to do a bit of searching yourself though as it's been a while since I visited one. Aramco? You can fully trust. Saleries are paid normally and on time. Also the working hours are better, although they do work in shifts. A normal work week in Saudi is from Saterday until Thursday afternoon 12 PM. A one and a half day weekend is normal, some employers will grant the Thursday and Friday off, so you'll have to check on that.
As for prices in Saudi? It all depends on where you go and what you want. I used to avoid the five star shopping area's as prices are five star prices and hardly any discounts are given. Al Khobar is great for all kinds of shopping, and real fun to. Dammam is a bit on the lower side, and I would avoid buying food stuff there. Al Jubail is a real industrial City, and doesn't have the flair of Al Khobar. But in general? Saudi prices are about 50% of that what you pay in the UK. Whereby electronics are really dirt cheap. And if you want the really good exchange rates? Find the money market in Al Khobar or Dammam. Okay, it's a black market thing, but the exchange rates will be far better then the banks will give you. If in doubt? Just ask any Philippino where it is, these guys use them all the time. Well can't think of more, but please do fire away those questions you might have.
Frans
Hi Slbj1,
I'll forgive you the insult of thinking I was German
I was actually born in the USA so I'm 50/50 Dutch and American. Take your time with Aramco okay? They tend to hire only the best of the best they can get from Europe or the USA. What I would advise you to do is to drop by the human resources department of Aramco at Dharan. If you're well qualified? And they know your husband already works legally in the Kingdom? Well it could speed up the procedure at there UK offices. If they do create a "Possible employee file" on you? Ask for the file number as reference and proof you visited the head office Dharan. I know out of other experiences that the UK office is sensative in a possitive way to that. But getting into Aramco can be frustrating, I agree. But the full employee's package Aramco offers can be awesome and 100% for sure worth the effords. And if you do want to live in a compound after all? Well the "Aramco Village" in Dharan isn't bad at all to say it mildly. If Aramco is interested in you? Ask them if they still have an immigration staff member inside Dharan Airport. These people will really speed up things getting you through customes at Dharan, which can take several hours otherwise. In most cases, your husband will have the official "Family Visa" in his passport. But be sure to double check at the Saudi embassy in the UK if everything is okay paperwise.
I would really avoid working for government hospitals in Saudi Arabia. They are well known for "delaying" payments to there (entire) staff for several months if needed. And the doctors? Well a experienced expat? Strongly doubts if they really are doctors. There are a few really good private medical clinics though, also all located in Al Khobar. You would have to do a bit of searching yourself though as it's been a while since I visited one. Aramco? You can fully trust. Saleries are paid normally and on time. Also the working hours are better, although they do work in shifts. A normal work week in Saudi is from Saterday until Thursday afternoon 12 PM. A one and a half day weekend is normal, some employers will grant the Thursday and Friday off, so you'll have to check on that.
As for prices in Saudi? It all depends on where you go and what you want. I used to avoid the five star shopping area's as prices are five star prices and hardly any discounts are given. Al Khobar is great for all kinds of shopping, and real fun to. Dammam is a bit on the lower side, and I would avoid buying food stuff there. Al Jubail is a real industrial City, and doesn't have the flair of Al Khobar. But in general? Saudi prices are about 50% of that what you pay in the UK. Whereby electronics are really dirt cheap. And if you want the really good exchange rates? Find the money market in Al Khobar or Dammam. Okay, it's a black market thing, but the exchange rates will be far better then the banks will give you. If in doubt? Just ask any Philippino where it is, these guys use them all the time. Well can't think of more, but please do fire away those questions you might have.
Frans
What can i say, apart from thank you. I spoke to a recruitment agency yesterday and aramco are doing all their own recruitment via the internet, and what used to take about 4 months could take considerably longer, so will wait it out. What did you do whilst out there? as your knowledge is excellent, I have spoken to some phillipino nurses who worked there and they felt that the European nurses were treated in a vastly different way to themselves, and had mentioned the religious police siting an incident where one of their collgues got into a taxi unescorted and ended up in jail. Scary. Do you have any idea what the wives on these compounds do if not work and turn themselves inside out with boredom because i think that would be my nightmare, that we eventually get accomodation but i have no job. I would imagine there are things to do, but again it must be restrictive. ??
Perhaps not so easy for you to answer however i do appreciate your insight and knowledge. Look forward to hearing from you slbj
Apr 17th 2005, 7:39 am
#17
UAE Expat
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 3,393
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Hi Slbj,
I warned you, Aramco is extremely picky in whom they hire. I know the UK Aramco office does most of the work themselves. And there is a reason for the 4+ month wait on a recruitment procedure. But how do I explain this without insulting a hell of a lot of UK nationals? I might be creating WWIII on this subject, but will give it a try anyhow. Attesting a degree as it’s called in the UK actually means nothing, because once attested by the UK government some of them afterwards are tampered with. (Names and / or data is changed) Also a UK national can have more then one of the same degree, all of them being “originals” which in most other countries is highly illegal. I know in Holland a certificate and / or degree isn't ones personal property and can be demanded back by the government.
That is why more and more countries are using the “Certificate / Degree registration and confirmation system” as the Americans call it, yes even Saudi Arabia. How does the procedure work? What I did is contacted them myself. By post I sent “Copy Confirmed” copies to them. What they do? Is double check with the school or organisation that issued them. Once they have confirmation that all data on the certificate(s) and / or degree(s) is confirmed and matches that of the school or organisation records? They will add your certificate(s) and degree(s) into there database. If, anywhere in the world a potential employer has doubts? Within minutes he or she can check via them as every document is given a unique serial code, which is valid for life. Also the “A and O level” system the UK uses might seem nice, but it isn’t a true international standard anymore, actually an outdated system of grading to be honest.
The “Office of Professions” as its called will, if requested by an employer will also translate these “O and A levels” into the more commonly used equivalent of the metric system. I know they charge a flat fee of US$100 per certificate or degree offered to them. If you want to contact them? It’s as follows:
New York State Education Department
Office of the Professions
Albany, New York
This is the same organisation that handles all the State Board Exams in the USA. I know they recently moved their offices, so you’ll have to look them up on the Internet. It might, no, I know it’s a useful tool in applying for jobs with Aramco. American nationals, or people that have studied at an American School or University, as well as people that have a true BS, MS or PhD? Are automatically entered into this database. That is why Americans are forbidden to have there degrees “attested” by other countries as it’s seen as tampering with original documents. But I guess it’s your choice right?
As for your remark about European Nurses being treated differently? You are right Slbj. In the Middle East? Where one comes from in most cases determines the height of ones salary, and yes, the prestige involved with working. European and American nurses are highly appreciated in the Middle East as there knowledge by far exceeds that of Far East Nurses. It’s a difference between day and night to be honest with you. Do keep in mind that Americans are normally paid the highest salaries within Aramco. Even if you and an your American counterpart, both having the same certificates and knowledge / experience levels? Most likely the American nurse will earn more. Racist behaviour? I agree, but that’s Aramco. And if you keep in mind that 20 years ago Aramco was nearly 100% American? Well I guess it explains it all. “Made in the USA” still is seen as an absolute quality standard in Saudi Arabia which only Switzerland can compete against with it’s watches, or Germany with it’s cars.
As for wives being allowed to work in Saudi Arabia? Well it all depends on the sponsor / employer of your husband Slbj. In most cases? The wife isn’t allowed to work, and yes, it means boredom. But in your case? I think a dual approval to work will be easily given. But don’t be surprised if your husband is required to (co) sign your employment contract okay? He is the one the Saudi’s will hold responsible if you where to misbehave in any way or manner. But ending up in jail for unescorted travelling? Never heard of that unless the women in question exceeded the normal limits of travelling. In Saudi Arabia if you travel beyond 250 kilometres from your employer / sponsors residence? You need what is called a travel letter, maybe that happened? But once you have a travel letter? It's okay. I put nearly 680.000 kilometres on various cars so I think that entittles me to say "I know Saudi Arabia". Okay, the camels are a bit scary at night time. (They tend to sleep on the roads)
In most compounds? The driver that drives you will act as an escort (in theory). But most Philippino’s don’t care less and will let you do what ever you want. Hell most of them are scared shitless of European / American women anyhow. I wouldn’t trust an Indian driver though, but that’s personal as most of them tend to run if the “smell” trouble coming. As for closing during prayer time? It normal that a shopkeeper will say “Please Ma’m it’s only 5 minutes to prayer time, please hurry”.
What I did over there? The first 4 years a Project Manager / General Manager for a Horticultural Company. Later on? Hade my own company in Dammam. Went bankrupt on the first Gulf War (Dessert Storm) but I could write a book on that if I wanted to. Lost close to 600.000 in UK currency, went back to Holland with US$ 318 in my pocket and two suitcases of clothes. That’s all I hade leftover on planet earth. And now? Like you trying to get back into the Middle East again. They say that all good things come with the third approach right?
Frans
I warned you, Aramco is extremely picky in whom they hire. I know the UK Aramco office does most of the work themselves. And there is a reason for the 4+ month wait on a recruitment procedure. But how do I explain this without insulting a hell of a lot of UK nationals? I might be creating WWIII on this subject, but will give it a try anyhow. Attesting a degree as it’s called in the UK actually means nothing, because once attested by the UK government some of them afterwards are tampered with. (Names and / or data is changed) Also a UK national can have more then one of the same degree, all of them being “originals” which in most other countries is highly illegal. I know in Holland a certificate and / or degree isn't ones personal property and can be demanded back by the government.
That is why more and more countries are using the “Certificate / Degree registration and confirmation system” as the Americans call it, yes even Saudi Arabia. How does the procedure work? What I did is contacted them myself. By post I sent “Copy Confirmed” copies to them. What they do? Is double check with the school or organisation that issued them. Once they have confirmation that all data on the certificate(s) and / or degree(s) is confirmed and matches that of the school or organisation records? They will add your certificate(s) and degree(s) into there database. If, anywhere in the world a potential employer has doubts? Within minutes he or she can check via them as every document is given a unique serial code, which is valid for life. Also the “A and O level” system the UK uses might seem nice, but it isn’t a true international standard anymore, actually an outdated system of grading to be honest.
The “Office of Professions” as its called will, if requested by an employer will also translate these “O and A levels” into the more commonly used equivalent of the metric system. I know they charge a flat fee of US$100 per certificate or degree offered to them. If you want to contact them? It’s as follows:
New York State Education Department
Office of the Professions
Albany, New York
This is the same organisation that handles all the State Board Exams in the USA. I know they recently moved their offices, so you’ll have to look them up on the Internet. It might, no, I know it’s a useful tool in applying for jobs with Aramco. American nationals, or people that have studied at an American School or University, as well as people that have a true BS, MS or PhD? Are automatically entered into this database. That is why Americans are forbidden to have there degrees “attested” by other countries as it’s seen as tampering with original documents. But I guess it’s your choice right?
As for your remark about European Nurses being treated differently? You are right Slbj. In the Middle East? Where one comes from in most cases determines the height of ones salary, and yes, the prestige involved with working. European and American nurses are highly appreciated in the Middle East as there knowledge by far exceeds that of Far East Nurses. It’s a difference between day and night to be honest with you. Do keep in mind that Americans are normally paid the highest salaries within Aramco. Even if you and an your American counterpart, both having the same certificates and knowledge / experience levels? Most likely the American nurse will earn more. Racist behaviour? I agree, but that’s Aramco. And if you keep in mind that 20 years ago Aramco was nearly 100% American? Well I guess it explains it all. “Made in the USA” still is seen as an absolute quality standard in Saudi Arabia which only Switzerland can compete against with it’s watches, or Germany with it’s cars.
As for wives being allowed to work in Saudi Arabia? Well it all depends on the sponsor / employer of your husband Slbj. In most cases? The wife isn’t allowed to work, and yes, it means boredom. But in your case? I think a dual approval to work will be easily given. But don’t be surprised if your husband is required to (co) sign your employment contract okay? He is the one the Saudi’s will hold responsible if you where to misbehave in any way or manner. But ending up in jail for unescorted travelling? Never heard of that unless the women in question exceeded the normal limits of travelling. In Saudi Arabia if you travel beyond 250 kilometres from your employer / sponsors residence? You need what is called a travel letter, maybe that happened? But once you have a travel letter? It's okay. I put nearly 680.000 kilometres on various cars so I think that entittles me to say "I know Saudi Arabia". Okay, the camels are a bit scary at night time. (They tend to sleep on the roads)
In most compounds? The driver that drives you will act as an escort (in theory). But most Philippino’s don’t care less and will let you do what ever you want. Hell most of them are scared shitless of European / American women anyhow. I wouldn’t trust an Indian driver though, but that’s personal as most of them tend to run if the “smell” trouble coming. As for closing during prayer time? It normal that a shopkeeper will say “Please Ma’m it’s only 5 minutes to prayer time, please hurry”.
What I did over there? The first 4 years a Project Manager / General Manager for a Horticultural Company. Later on? Hade my own company in Dammam. Went bankrupt on the first Gulf War (Dessert Storm) but I could write a book on that if I wanted to. Lost close to 600.000 in UK currency, went back to Holland with US$ 318 in my pocket and two suitcases of clothes. That’s all I hade leftover on planet earth. And now? Like you trying to get back into the Middle East again. They say that all good things come with the third approach right?
Frans
Last edited by Frans Wind; Apr 17th 2005 at 7:54 am.
Apr 17th 2005, 9:27 am
#18
nurse
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: uk - the wold soon
Posts: 12
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Originally Posted by Frans Wind
Hi Slbj,
I warned you, Aramco is extremely picky in whom they hire. I know the UK Aramco office does most of the work themselves. And there is a reason for the 4+ month wait on a recruitment procedure. But how do I explain this without insulting a hell of a lot of UK nationals? I might be creating WWIII on this subject, but will give it a try anyhow. Attesting a degree as it’s called in the UK actually means nothing, because once attested by the UK government some of them afterwards are tampered with. (Names and / or data is changed) Also a UK national can have more then one of the same degree, all of them being “originals” which in most other countries is highly illegal. I know in Holland a certificate and / or degree isn't ones personal property and can be demanded back by the government.
That is why more and more countries are using the “Certificate / Degree registration and confirmation system” as the Americans call it, yes even Saudi Arabia. How does the procedure work? What I did is contacted them myself. By post I sent “Copy Confirmed” copies to them. What they do? Is double check with the school or organisation that issued them. Once they have confirmation that all data on the certificate(s) and / or degree(s) is confirmed and matches that of the school or organisation records? They will add your certificate(s) and degree(s) into there database. If, anywhere in the world a potential employer has doubts? Within minutes he or she can check via them as every document is given a unique serial code, which is valid for life. Also the “A and O level” system the UK uses might seem nice, but it isn’t a true international standard anymore, actually an outdated system of grading to be honest.
The “Office of Professions” as its called will, if requested by an employer will also translate these “O and A levels” into the more commonly used equivalent of the metric system. I know they charge a flat fee of US$100 per certificate or degree offered to them. If you want to contact them? It’s as follows:
New York State Education Department
Office of the Professions
Albany, New York
This is the same organisation that handles all the State Board Exams in the USA. I know they recently moved their offices, so you’ll have to look them up on the Internet. It might, no, I know it’s a useful tool in applying for jobs with Aramco. American nationals, or people that have studied at an American School or University, as well as people that have a true BS, MS or PhD? Are automatically entered into this database. That is why Americans are forbidden to have there degrees “attested” by other countries as it’s seen as tampering with original documents. But I guess it’s your choice right?
As for your remark about European Nurses being treated differently? You are right Slbj. In the Middle East? Where one comes from in most cases determines the height of ones salary, and yes, the prestige involved with working. European and American nurses are highly appreciated in the Middle East as there knowledge by far exceeds that of Far East Nurses. It’s a difference between day and night to be honest with you. Do keep in mind that Americans are normally paid the highest salaries within Aramco. Even if you and an your American counterpart, both having the same certificates and knowledge / experience levels? Most likely the American nurse will earn more. Racist behaviour? I agree, but that’s Aramco. And if you keep in mind that 20 years ago Aramco was nearly 100% American? Well I guess it explains it all. “Made in the USA” still is seen as an absolute quality standard in Saudi Arabia which only Switzerland can compete against with it’s watches, or Germany with it’s cars.
As for wives being allowed to work in Saudi Arabia? Well it all depends on the sponsor / employer of your husband Slbj. In most cases? The wife isn’t allowed to work, and yes, it means boredom. But in your case? I think a dual approval to work will be easily given. But don’t be surprised if your husband is required to (co) sign your employment contract okay? He is the one the Saudi’s will hold responsible if you where to misbehave in any way or manner. But ending up in jail for unescorted travelling? Never heard of that unless the women in question exceeded the normal limits of travelling. In Saudi Arabia if you travel beyond 250 kilometres from your employer / sponsors residence? You need what is called a travel letter, maybe that happened? But once you have a travel letter? It's okay. I put nearly 680.000 kilometres on various cars so I think that entittles me to say "I know Saudi Arabia". Okay, the camels are a bit scary at night time. (They tend to sleep on the roads)
In most compounds? The driver that drives you will act as an escort (in theory). But most Philippino’s don’t care less and will let you do what ever you want. Hell most of them are scared shitless of European / American women anyhow. I wouldn’t trust an Indian driver though, but that’s personal as most of them tend to run if the “smell” trouble coming. As for closing during prayer time? It normal that a shopkeeper will say “Please Ma’m it’s only 5 minutes to prayer time, please hurry”.
What I did over there? The first 4 years a Project Manager / General Manager for a Horticultural Company. Later on? Hade my own company in Dammam. Went bankrupt on the first Gulf War (Dessert Storm) but I could write a book on that if I wanted to. Lost close to 600.000 in UK currency, went back to Holland with US$ 318 in my pocket and two suitcases of clothes. That’s all I hade leftover on planet earth. And now? Like you trying to get back into the Middle East again. They say that all good things come with the third approach right?
Frans
I warned you, Aramco is extremely picky in whom they hire. I know the UK Aramco office does most of the work themselves. And there is a reason for the 4+ month wait on a recruitment procedure. But how do I explain this without insulting a hell of a lot of UK nationals? I might be creating WWIII on this subject, but will give it a try anyhow. Attesting a degree as it’s called in the UK actually means nothing, because once attested by the UK government some of them afterwards are tampered with. (Names and / or data is changed) Also a UK national can have more then one of the same degree, all of them being “originals” which in most other countries is highly illegal. I know in Holland a certificate and / or degree isn't ones personal property and can be demanded back by the government.
That is why more and more countries are using the “Certificate / Degree registration and confirmation system” as the Americans call it, yes even Saudi Arabia. How does the procedure work? What I did is contacted them myself. By post I sent “Copy Confirmed” copies to them. What they do? Is double check with the school or organisation that issued them. Once they have confirmation that all data on the certificate(s) and / or degree(s) is confirmed and matches that of the school or organisation records? They will add your certificate(s) and degree(s) into there database. If, anywhere in the world a potential employer has doubts? Within minutes he or she can check via them as every document is given a unique serial code, which is valid for life. Also the “A and O level” system the UK uses might seem nice, but it isn’t a true international standard anymore, actually an outdated system of grading to be honest.
The “Office of Professions” as its called will, if requested by an employer will also translate these “O and A levels” into the more commonly used equivalent of the metric system. I know they charge a flat fee of US$100 per certificate or degree offered to them. If you want to contact them? It’s as follows:
New York State Education Department
Office of the Professions
Albany, New York
This is the same organisation that handles all the State Board Exams in the USA. I know they recently moved their offices, so you’ll have to look them up on the Internet. It might, no, I know it’s a useful tool in applying for jobs with Aramco. American nationals, or people that have studied at an American School or University, as well as people that have a true BS, MS or PhD? Are automatically entered into this database. That is why Americans are forbidden to have there degrees “attested” by other countries as it’s seen as tampering with original documents. But I guess it’s your choice right?
As for your remark about European Nurses being treated differently? You are right Slbj. In the Middle East? Where one comes from in most cases determines the height of ones salary, and yes, the prestige involved with working. European and American nurses are highly appreciated in the Middle East as there knowledge by far exceeds that of Far East Nurses. It’s a difference between day and night to be honest with you. Do keep in mind that Americans are normally paid the highest salaries within Aramco. Even if you and an your American counterpart, both having the same certificates and knowledge / experience levels? Most likely the American nurse will earn more. Racist behaviour? I agree, but that’s Aramco. And if you keep in mind that 20 years ago Aramco was nearly 100% American? Well I guess it explains it all. “Made in the USA” still is seen as an absolute quality standard in Saudi Arabia which only Switzerland can compete against with it’s watches, or Germany with it’s cars.
As for wives being allowed to work in Saudi Arabia? Well it all depends on the sponsor / employer of your husband Slbj. In most cases? The wife isn’t allowed to work, and yes, it means boredom. But in your case? I think a dual approval to work will be easily given. But don’t be surprised if your husband is required to (co) sign your employment contract okay? He is the one the Saudi’s will hold responsible if you where to misbehave in any way or manner. But ending up in jail for unescorted travelling? Never heard of that unless the women in question exceeded the normal limits of travelling. In Saudi Arabia if you travel beyond 250 kilometres from your employer / sponsors residence? You need what is called a travel letter, maybe that happened? But once you have a travel letter? It's okay. I put nearly 680.000 kilometres on various cars so I think that entittles me to say "I know Saudi Arabia". Okay, the camels are a bit scary at night time. (They tend to sleep on the roads)
In most compounds? The driver that drives you will act as an escort (in theory). But most Philippino’s don’t care less and will let you do what ever you want. Hell most of them are scared shitless of European / American women anyhow. I wouldn’t trust an Indian driver though, but that’s personal as most of them tend to run if the “smell” trouble coming. As for closing during prayer time? It normal that a shopkeeper will say “Please Ma’m it’s only 5 minutes to prayer time, please hurry”.
What I did over there? The first 4 years a Project Manager / General Manager for a Horticultural Company. Later on? Hade my own company in Dammam. Went bankrupt on the first Gulf War (Dessert Storm) but I could write a book on that if I wanted to. Lost close to 600.000 in UK currency, went back to Holland with US$ 318 in my pocket and two suitcases of clothes. That’s all I hade leftover on planet earth. And now? Like you trying to get back into the Middle East again. They say that all good things come with the third approach right?
Frans
ime ok with the qualification thing, and hey a job would be fab, but really just want to get out there. Have you considered Dubai or Bahrain, would they be easier to set up in or not so profitable, and yes dont ever stop trying, ime a firm beleiver that you are your own success story, and wont be put off if i think something is worth pursueing - hence aramco. The driving thing is a real pain as when you have that independence its hard to relinquish it, but it has to be when in rome, dharan, do as they say or else, id be too scared not to. I have heard that its about networking, and will take on your advice, whilst out there if i ever leave the air conditioned accomodation as i think its about 50 whilst there. When we lived in germany we were on the border so every opportunity was spent shopping or sightseeing in holland and germany. Most weekends were spent in venlo, maastricht or roermond as i loved the markets and picturesque area and every where was clean and freindly. We actually came back for a holiday to near maastricht to near i think its called tribundenpunt - where 3 countries meet, beautifull. Ime amazed that in the tempereratures in saudi that anyone in horticulture would be able to find work certainly very specialised, particulaly since i think they use desalinated water that must play havoc. There is clearly some socialising going on, do you know anything about clubs ect, trying to consider what to take with me to releive the boredom, and although readings good, book wheigh heavy.
Thanks again, speak soon. slbj
Apr 17th 2005, 10:07 am
#19
UAE Expat
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 3,393
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Hi Slbj,
Do you actually have a first name? Just teasing of course, I can understand a woman wants to keep her privacy on the internet. You for sure have the right attitude for a job seeker in the Middle East. Just don’t give up so easily okay? Yes, woman and car driving? Forget it okay? I can remember way back in 1988 a few Saudi women actually did it. I mean stepped in a car and drove through Riyadh, which became a major issue back then. The real laughs came when the American Army moved in to Saudi Arabia in the pre Dessert Storm days. Woman in cars? Scared the average Saudi. But woman driving ten tonne trucks? Or even A1M1 battle tanks? That was unheard of. And yes, I agree a woman is a mans equal in every aspect of life. And it was time the Saudi’s learned that lesson. And the incidents? I guess you heard the famous story of the female American soldier and the Mutawa? (Religious Police) The poor fellow hade the “luck” to bump into a female special forces unit. It’s true what happened in the middle of Al Khobar.
He actually hit her with one of those famous little bamboe sticks they carry when you don’t leave a shop fast enough during prayer time as he thought she was a man. And yes, I saw it with my own eye’s!!! She actually smiled at the guy, pulled her gun and held it against his head “Choose habibi… (Arabic for friend) Let Allah call you when he thinks the time is right? Or… Keep on bothering me and you’ll see him in a few seconds from now. Your choice…” I’ve never, ever, in my entire life seen a street empty that fast, or a Mutawa turn white like he did. Don’t want to scare you Slbj, those days are long gone, but a lot of expats still see it as “War humor”. Since then? Even a Mutawa in the Eastern Province knows you don’t foul around with Europeans or Americans. So you like my little cheese country huh? I used to visit Maastricht a lot. Just walking around, or sitting at one of the many outdoor café’s to have a beer? Awesome city. But your Dutch made me really laugh reading it “Tribundenpunt” I think you actually discovered an unknown European language? Its “Drie Landen Punt”. Hahahaha… Not bad for a Brit though
) Never been to Amsterdam yet? If not? WOW you have an experience waiting for you!!!
Horticulture is a major headache in Saudi Arabia, the climate is the worst factor. But hey, I wouldn’t be Dutch if I wouldn’t have figured out ways to bypass that. I used to buy what they call “sweet water” (Drinkable water) by the 100.000 litres per month. Actually by mistake created the biggest swimming pool in Saudi Arabia back then as American and European kids discovered it. Sealed off from the rest of the Garden Centre? Women and children used to ask “Do you mind if…” Well I just let it grow out to a fun area. Even let my guys build a “Baby Pool”. My sponsor / friend? It drove him crazy, but what the heck? The water was still good for the plants and flowers. Ask any old Expat if they remember Saudi Green Nurseries. I think the company is sold now and nearly closed down.
As for clubs? Sure, in the big compounds you have the “unofficial” versions of that. It’s relatively safe in there. I know Aramco used to have them. Hell, even hade a fake pass to get into the compound and supermarket area. But most probably your hubby will know where to go by now. There are some really sleazy places in Al Khobar. Not the ideal spot for a Lady to go to though, and I really wouldn’t trust the drinks being served in those places. I’d forget about bringing in magazines from the UK. Books? If the title doesn’t hint to anything “Anti Muslim… Or made in Israel” it’s okay. Customs will check Laptops, CD’s, Video’s and floppy disks.
Frans
Do you actually have a first name? Just teasing of course, I can understand a woman wants to keep her privacy on the internet. You for sure have the right attitude for a job seeker in the Middle East. Just don’t give up so easily okay? Yes, woman and car driving? Forget it okay? I can remember way back in 1988 a few Saudi women actually did it. I mean stepped in a car and drove through Riyadh, which became a major issue back then. The real laughs came when the American Army moved in to Saudi Arabia in the pre Dessert Storm days. Woman in cars? Scared the average Saudi. But woman driving ten tonne trucks? Or even A1M1 battle tanks? That was unheard of. And yes, I agree a woman is a mans equal in every aspect of life. And it was time the Saudi’s learned that lesson. And the incidents? I guess you heard the famous story of the female American soldier and the Mutawa? (Religious Police) The poor fellow hade the “luck” to bump into a female special forces unit. It’s true what happened in the middle of Al Khobar.
He actually hit her with one of those famous little bamboe sticks they carry when you don’t leave a shop fast enough during prayer time as he thought she was a man. And yes, I saw it with my own eye’s!!! She actually smiled at the guy, pulled her gun and held it against his head “Choose habibi… (Arabic for friend) Let Allah call you when he thinks the time is right? Or… Keep on bothering me and you’ll see him in a few seconds from now. Your choice…” I’ve never, ever, in my entire life seen a street empty that fast, or a Mutawa turn white like he did. Don’t want to scare you Slbj, those days are long gone, but a lot of expats still see it as “War humor”. Since then? Even a Mutawa in the Eastern Province knows you don’t foul around with Europeans or Americans. So you like my little cheese country huh? I used to visit Maastricht a lot. Just walking around, or sitting at one of the many outdoor café’s to have a beer? Awesome city. But your Dutch made me really laugh reading it “Tribundenpunt” I think you actually discovered an unknown European language? Its “Drie Landen Punt”. Hahahaha… Not bad for a Brit though
) Never been to Amsterdam yet? If not? WOW you have an experience waiting for you!!!Horticulture is a major headache in Saudi Arabia, the climate is the worst factor. But hey, I wouldn’t be Dutch if I wouldn’t have figured out ways to bypass that. I used to buy what they call “sweet water” (Drinkable water) by the 100.000 litres per month. Actually by mistake created the biggest swimming pool in Saudi Arabia back then as American and European kids discovered it. Sealed off from the rest of the Garden Centre? Women and children used to ask “Do you mind if…” Well I just let it grow out to a fun area. Even let my guys build a “Baby Pool”. My sponsor / friend? It drove him crazy, but what the heck? The water was still good for the plants and flowers. Ask any old Expat if they remember Saudi Green Nurseries. I think the company is sold now and nearly closed down.
As for clubs? Sure, in the big compounds you have the “unofficial” versions of that. It’s relatively safe in there. I know Aramco used to have them. Hell, even hade a fake pass to get into the compound and supermarket area. But most probably your hubby will know where to go by now. There are some really sleazy places in Al Khobar. Not the ideal spot for a Lady to go to though, and I really wouldn’t trust the drinks being served in those places. I’d forget about bringing in magazines from the UK. Books? If the title doesn’t hint to anything “Anti Muslim… Or made in Israel” it’s okay. Customs will check Laptops, CD’s, Video’s and floppy disks.
Frans
Last edited by Frans Wind; Apr 17th 2005 at 10:17 am.
Apr 17th 2005, 4:09 pm
#20
nurse
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: uk - the wold soon
Posts: 12
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Originally Posted by Frans Wind
Hi Slbj,
Do you actually have a first name? Just teasing of course, I can understand a woman wants to keep her privacy on the internet. You for sure have the right attitude for a job seeker in the Middle East. Just don’t give up so easily okay? Yes, woman and car driving? Forget it okay? I can remember way back in 1988 a few Saudi women actually did it. I mean stepped in a car and drove through Riyadh, which became a major issue back then. The real laughs came when the American Army moved in to Saudi Arabia in the pre Dessert Storm days. Woman in cars? Scared the average Saudi. But woman driving ten tonne trucks? Or even A1M1 battle tanks? That was unheard of. And yes, I agree a woman is a mans equal in every aspect of life. And it was time the Saudi’s learned that lesson. And the incidents? I guess you heard the famous story of the female American soldier and the Mutawa? (Religious Police) The poor fellow hade the “luck” to bump into a female special forces unit. It’s true what happened in the middle of Al Khobar.
He actually hit her with one of those famous little bamboe sticks they carry when you don’t leave a shop fast enough during prayer time as he thought she was a man. And yes, I saw it with my own eye’s!!! She actually smiled at the guy, pulled her gun and held it against his head “Choose habibi… (Arabic for friend) Let Allah call you when he thinks the time is right? Or… Keep on bothering me and you’ll see him in a few seconds from now. Your choice…” I’ve never, ever, in my entire life seen a street empty that fast, or a Mutawa turn white like he did. Don’t want to scare you Slbj, those days are long gone, but a lot of expats still see it as “War humor”. Since then? Even a Mutawa in the Eastern Province knows you don’t foul around with Europeans or Americans. So you like my little cheese country huh? I used to visit Maastricht a lot. Just walking around, or sitting at one of the many outdoor café’s to have a beer? Awesome city. But your Dutch made me really laugh reading it “Tribundenpunt” I think you actually discovered an unknown European language? Its “Drie Landen Punt”. Hahahaha… Not bad for a Brit though) Never been to Amsterdam yet? If not? WOW you have an experience waiting for you!!!
Horticulture is a major headache in Saudi Arabia, the climate is the worst factor. But hey, I wouldn’t be Dutch if I wouldn’t have figured out ways to bypass that. I used to buy what they call “sweet water” (Drinkable water) by the 100.000 litres per month. Actually by mistake created the biggest swimming pool in Saudi Arabia back then as American and European kids discovered it. Sealed off from the rest of the Garden Centre? Women and children used to ask “Do you mind if…” Well I just let it grow out to a fun area. Even let my guys build a “Baby Pool”. My sponsor / friend? It drove him crazy, but what the heck? The water was still good for the plants and flowers. Ask any old Expat if they remember Saudi Green Nurseries. I think the company is sold now and nearly closed down.
As for clubs? Sure, in the big compounds you have the “unofficial” versions of that. It’s relatively safe in there. I know Aramco used to have them. Hell, even hade a fake pass to get into the compound and supermarket area. But most probably your hubby will know where to go by now. There are some really sleazy places in Al Khobar. Not the ideal spot for a Lady to go to though, and I really wouldn’t trust the drinks being served in those places. I’d forget about bringing in magazines from the UK. Books? If the title doesn’t hint to anything “Anti Muslim… Or made in Israel” it’s okay. Customs will check Laptops, CD’s, Video’s and floppy disks.
Frans
Do you actually have a first name? Just teasing of course, I can understand a woman wants to keep her privacy on the internet. You for sure have the right attitude for a job seeker in the Middle East. Just don’t give up so easily okay? Yes, woman and car driving? Forget it okay? I can remember way back in 1988 a few Saudi women actually did it. I mean stepped in a car and drove through Riyadh, which became a major issue back then. The real laughs came when the American Army moved in to Saudi Arabia in the pre Dessert Storm days. Woman in cars? Scared the average Saudi. But woman driving ten tonne trucks? Or even A1M1 battle tanks? That was unheard of. And yes, I agree a woman is a mans equal in every aspect of life. And it was time the Saudi’s learned that lesson. And the incidents? I guess you heard the famous story of the female American soldier and the Mutawa? (Religious Police) The poor fellow hade the “luck” to bump into a female special forces unit. It’s true what happened in the middle of Al Khobar.
He actually hit her with one of those famous little bamboe sticks they carry when you don’t leave a shop fast enough during prayer time as he thought she was a man. And yes, I saw it with my own eye’s!!! She actually smiled at the guy, pulled her gun and held it against his head “Choose habibi… (Arabic for friend) Let Allah call you when he thinks the time is right? Or… Keep on bothering me and you’ll see him in a few seconds from now. Your choice…” I’ve never, ever, in my entire life seen a street empty that fast, or a Mutawa turn white like he did. Don’t want to scare you Slbj, those days are long gone, but a lot of expats still see it as “War humor”. Since then? Even a Mutawa in the Eastern Province knows you don’t foul around with Europeans or Americans. So you like my little cheese country huh? I used to visit Maastricht a lot. Just walking around, or sitting at one of the many outdoor café’s to have a beer? Awesome city. But your Dutch made me really laugh reading it “Tribundenpunt” I think you actually discovered an unknown European language? Its “Drie Landen Punt”. Hahahaha… Not bad for a Brit though
) Never been to Amsterdam yet? If not? WOW you have an experience waiting for you!!!Horticulture is a major headache in Saudi Arabia, the climate is the worst factor. But hey, I wouldn’t be Dutch if I wouldn’t have figured out ways to bypass that. I used to buy what they call “sweet water” (Drinkable water) by the 100.000 litres per month. Actually by mistake created the biggest swimming pool in Saudi Arabia back then as American and European kids discovered it. Sealed off from the rest of the Garden Centre? Women and children used to ask “Do you mind if…” Well I just let it grow out to a fun area. Even let my guys build a “Baby Pool”. My sponsor / friend? It drove him crazy, but what the heck? The water was still good for the plants and flowers. Ask any old Expat if they remember Saudi Green Nurseries. I think the company is sold now and nearly closed down.
As for clubs? Sure, in the big compounds you have the “unofficial” versions of that. It’s relatively safe in there. I know Aramco used to have them. Hell, even hade a fake pass to get into the compound and supermarket area. But most probably your hubby will know where to go by now. There are some really sleazy places in Al Khobar. Not the ideal spot for a Lady to go to though, and I really wouldn’t trust the drinks being served in those places. I’d forget about bringing in magazines from the UK. Books? If the title doesn’t hint to anything “Anti Muslim… Or made in Israel” it’s okay. Customs will check Laptops, CD’s, Video’s and floppy disks.
Frans
I happened to notice at the airport the other day that any non saudi residents had to adhere strictly to the baggage allowance, but the saudis had masses and masses of luggage, my husband mentioned how they start the trip westernised but get changed near destination, not suprising i suppose. Do western women have to wear head scarves, or is it something done for respect of the culture, or generally not, wearing an abaya in that climate is going to be hard enough without haveing a bad hair day as well, and how do women shop for shoes because they cant show anything of themselves, do they use cubicles again? Not sure what shoes to take because the temperature is so hot, not sure being a bloke you can appreciate the complexity of this statement, joke, but ime presuming sandals are out and plastic would be torture. I have read that when out women virtually have to be mute, and let the man do all the talking, but i would be allowed to talk to my husband whilst shopping wouldnt i ?, just not other men.
That in itself is going to be hard, my phillipino collegues in uk have described how they had to be so careful and circumspect when they were out, however they were all single and those that werent aquired american boyfreinds, i mean that in the nicest possible sense, although i do think their ulteria motive was protection and who can blame them. Yes i had heard about the gun incident but not in quite so much detail, no not put off, but a bit wiser. Thanks for the chat once again, look forward to more from you.
s
Apr 17th 2005, 5:56 pm
#21
UAE Expat
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 3,393
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Hi there Misses X,
Just teasing, won’t ask for a first name again okay? I think I know the spa you’re talking about, although there are several of them in Limburg bordering the German border. It’s not really my cup of tea. Yes, when been to one with a girlfriend years ago. Never really did get any further then a steamy hot Jacuzzi but I guess that’s a guy thing right? But next time you’re in Amsterdam? On the way out pass through Leiden. They have what’s called the “Pancake Palace” there with a menu of about 1600 different kinds. My favourite? The hot Ginger Pancakes. Hmmm…. Be careful with Venlo though, not for nothing it’s called the ghetto of Holland. Crime rates are way up in that city. They like the Germans as they tend to spend a lot of money there in the sleazy bars and clubs, but other foreigners aren’t really considered welcome.
You’re right about the baggage thing Misses X, and I would avoid flying with Saudia. It’s crap to say it mildly, and service? An often unknown word to most Saudia employee’s. I think in tourist class you’re allowed 25 kilo’s as a none Saudi. But Saudi’s themselves? God I’ve seen 10 suitcases being loaded per person. What these people buy in Europe? Never could imagine that as most things are far more cheaper in Saudi Arabia then in Europe. The Saudi’s don't like the European gold as it’s not what they call “Red Gold” (With more copper in it). They do tend to buy masses of Diamonds tough. I don’t know how you’ll be flying into Dharan? Direct flight via the UK? Or via Amsterdam? You do know that once you live in Saudi Arabia you can acquire a “Tax free” stamp in your passport? It means that anything you buy in Europe? Just save the bills, at most major airports there’s a tax office that will pay you the tax money back in cash.
God I laughed when I read your remark about shoes? I never really stood still at that. Can’t really remember looking at a women’s shoes while in Saudi Arabia either. Yes it’s common, even for western women to put on the black robes while going out. Although they don’t need to cover up completely like Saudi women, just hang it loosely around the shoulders. Talking to other men? Yes, it’s allowed (I think) I always did anyhow. But mostly to people I already knew from my social life. With or without the husband present. It’s only being polite if you ask me, never saw the harm in it either. And talking to your husband? Even in public? Is always allowed. Family status? Is something of an honour among Saudi Arabian expats, something I really never understood, but that’s me I guess.
I know what you’re trying to say about the Phillipina’s in Saudi Arabia. Don’t forget that a European / American males often do represent a one way ticket to the good life. If it’s the men that are always the ones to be blamed for misbehaving? I reserve the right to doubt that. Life can be hard for some bachelor males in Saudi Arabia, although I never really hade trouble with it. I used to be the Project manager on the Saudi Arabian – Bahrain causeway, the big bridge and two islands between Saudi Arabia and Bahrain? And as such spent most of my weekends in Bahrain anyhow. In 45+ degrees heat? A real cool beer does taste rather good. Just keep in mind if you ever do visit Bahrain by car? (A) The petrol prices are a rip off there. (B) You’re required to turn the engine off when they fill the gas tank. Fines for cars with Saudi number plates are rather on the extreme high side. (C) You don’t try to bribe a cop like in Saudi Arabia is normally the case. Just a tip. And yes, the Bahraini’s just seem to love roundabouts, there traffic lights? Need getting used to as well. And Bahrain does have maximum speeds. The Saudi’s actually call it “Little England” because there is so much “Old” English money there. I mean fourth or even fifth generation Brits. But that’s all for now as I have guest coming. Just keep on firing away your questions okay?
Bye for now,
Frans
Just teasing, won’t ask for a first name again okay? I think I know the spa you’re talking about, although there are several of them in Limburg bordering the German border. It’s not really my cup of tea. Yes, when been to one with a girlfriend years ago. Never really did get any further then a steamy hot Jacuzzi but I guess that’s a guy thing right? But next time you’re in Amsterdam? On the way out pass through Leiden. They have what’s called the “Pancake Palace” there with a menu of about 1600 different kinds. My favourite? The hot Ginger Pancakes. Hmmm…. Be careful with Venlo though, not for nothing it’s called the ghetto of Holland. Crime rates are way up in that city. They like the Germans as they tend to spend a lot of money there in the sleazy bars and clubs, but other foreigners aren’t really considered welcome.
You’re right about the baggage thing Misses X, and I would avoid flying with Saudia. It’s crap to say it mildly, and service? An often unknown word to most Saudia employee’s. I think in tourist class you’re allowed 25 kilo’s as a none Saudi. But Saudi’s themselves? God I’ve seen 10 suitcases being loaded per person. What these people buy in Europe? Never could imagine that as most things are far more cheaper in Saudi Arabia then in Europe. The Saudi’s don't like the European gold as it’s not what they call “Red Gold” (With more copper in it). They do tend to buy masses of Diamonds tough. I don’t know how you’ll be flying into Dharan? Direct flight via the UK? Or via Amsterdam? You do know that once you live in Saudi Arabia you can acquire a “Tax free” stamp in your passport? It means that anything you buy in Europe? Just save the bills, at most major airports there’s a tax office that will pay you the tax money back in cash.
God I laughed when I read your remark about shoes? I never really stood still at that. Can’t really remember looking at a women’s shoes while in Saudi Arabia either. Yes it’s common, even for western women to put on the black robes while going out. Although they don’t need to cover up completely like Saudi women, just hang it loosely around the shoulders. Talking to other men? Yes, it’s allowed (I think) I always did anyhow. But mostly to people I already knew from my social life. With or without the husband present. It’s only being polite if you ask me, never saw the harm in it either. And talking to your husband? Even in public? Is always allowed. Family status? Is something of an honour among Saudi Arabian expats, something I really never understood, but that’s me I guess.
I know what you’re trying to say about the Phillipina’s in Saudi Arabia. Don’t forget that a European / American males often do represent a one way ticket to the good life. If it’s the men that are always the ones to be blamed for misbehaving? I reserve the right to doubt that. Life can be hard for some bachelor males in Saudi Arabia, although I never really hade trouble with it. I used to be the Project manager on the Saudi Arabian – Bahrain causeway, the big bridge and two islands between Saudi Arabia and Bahrain? And as such spent most of my weekends in Bahrain anyhow. In 45+ degrees heat? A real cool beer does taste rather good. Just keep in mind if you ever do visit Bahrain by car? (A) The petrol prices are a rip off there. (B) You’re required to turn the engine off when they fill the gas tank. Fines for cars with Saudi number plates are rather on the extreme high side. (C) You don’t try to bribe a cop like in Saudi Arabia is normally the case. Just a tip. And yes, the Bahraini’s just seem to love roundabouts, there traffic lights? Need getting used to as well. And Bahrain does have maximum speeds. The Saudi’s actually call it “Little England” because there is so much “Old” English money there. I mean fourth or even fifth generation Brits. But that’s all for now as I have guest coming. Just keep on firing away your questions okay?
Bye for now,
Frans
Jun 28th 2006, 10:39 pm
#22
nurse
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: uk - the wold soon
Posts: 12
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Originally Posted by Frans Wind
And don't be shy overthere, build up a good circle of friends. The "connection game" also applies in Saudi Arabia, even more actually and expats tend to help eachother out a lot. I'll approche this subject a bit carefully? If you do buy alcohol on the black markets? Check for what is called "Vampire marks" on the bottom of the bottle. The real crooks tend to drill two holes and pump out the good stuff, then re-fill the bottle with god knows what else. A lot of "Newbies" get in trouble not knowing this. Even if it's just plain wine? Always check...
Frans
Frans
Jun 28th 2006, 10:51 pm
#23
nurse
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: uk - the wold soon
Posts: 12
Re: dharan saudi arabia
Originally Posted by slbj1
I dont do this very often, can you tell. lol I had heard about the military hosps. been looking at the faisal spec hosp., anything you may know would be usefull. Also been offered uae, which pay not so good but working and socialising may be easier. Whats the safety issues if any ? and thank you once again for you hep
Ime a life watcher, and watch body language which was really difficult with women wearing abayas and veils, all darting eyes and perfume. The causway is spectacular, but can take an age, and bahrain it has to be said is interesting, night life good, Al Bustan hotel ect, or the country club contrast. Did i enjoy my time there, yes, but cleary apprehensive about going back on my own to saudi or uae.
