Donna Noble

It is true what Pulaski says. The EEA and the EU do have the same ideals; free movement of persons, goods, services and capital within its member states (currently the EU states plus Norway, Liechtenstein and Iceland).

EU states are obliged join the EEA but EU membership is not necessary to join as long as your country is willing to fork out a very large sum of money.

Whether or not the UK stays part of the EEA would be a post Brexit decision on the part of the UK government and membership would still have to be negotiated with the EU, ratified and PAID for.

As a member of the EU the UK has both political and economic clout. As a member of the EEA, that would be only an economic benefit, with no political influence whatsoever.

Switzerland is not a member of the EEA. It has bilateral agreements with the EU allowing it access to its internal market.

So, I read that pro-Brexiters believe the UK is going to stronger than ever when it's made loads of trade agreements all round the world. Really? And where would those countries be exactly? Apart from renegotiating with the countries that already have agreements with the EU, where exactly are all these extra unexploited markets going to pop up from?

So many countries have protectionist policies regarding imported goods it really makes exporting to them a bureaucratic and costly nightmare and it's getting worse (I'm talking from personal professional experience here). Let alone the sheer cost of shipping.

There are currently many underdeveloped markets on the UK's doorstep within the EU and the UK should be looking to those for trade not some far flung ex-colonial staging post.

By the way, may I suggest reading something like the below link from a reputable journalist source rather than the previous link to marketoracle.co.uk which was frankly one of the worst pieces of writing I've ever read.

What Would `Brexit' Really Mean for Firms in London's City?: Q&A - Bloomberg Business

At the end of the day there are lots of questions and nobody knows what the answers are … as David Cameron said leaving the EU will be a leap into the dark.

Pulaski

The pro-EU crowd seem to think that the discussion begins and ends with the economics of Brexit. It doesn't.

They also seem to believe that the EU is stable if Britain leaves and that the EU will continue as if nothing had happened. I do not believe that would be the case.

The EU is undemocratic and unstable, and you can hardly blame Britain if Britain leaves and the whole edifice collapses when the architects built such a deeply flawed structure.

Donna Noble

Err, we were discussing the European Economic Area weren't we?

Pulaski

Yes, but the decision to stay or leave has other angles than just economics. I would vote to leave even if it reduced GDP.

Donna Noble

"the decision to stay or leave has other angles than just economics."

I think the majority of educated adults would agree with that.

GeorgeYoung

I would still take it all day long over the democracy and stability offered to us by Westminster or Rome.

Changing the subject slightly, can we all agree that "Brexit" is a horrible word than needs to be consigned to the bin asap?

Pica

Does it really matter Was there a backlash against the term Grexit

mmmmbuti

I personally don't find Bruxelles less democratic than any Western capital. Yes it is dominated by lobbies, but so is Westminster, so is Montecitorio, so is Capitol Hill. On the other hand, it is indeed possible for the people to influence the decisions made there. Many controversial treaties and directives have died in the European Parliament after campaigns have been organized by associations and movements in various parts of Europe. All it takes is to recognize that Europe as a whole can have a common political dimension, a demos. Normally the average Briton fails to acknowledge this, in part because British media is always focused on national politics, and reports very little of Europen politics, partially because of the well known sense of diversity from the "continent". What surprises me is that expats who have lived for decades on the "continent", still seem unable to acknowledge that an European demos is possibile.

Dick Dasterdly

At this moment the EU is in more trouble than ever before, a fact they openly admit.
The cracks are clearly showing as many countries now make their own decisions with regard to security and the refugee situation.

As a result of their loss of control, the Germans are very angry with almost everybody and have even fallen out with their closest allies.

I forecast ever more EU countries continuing to make their own decisions in their own best interests from now on and endless very costly trouble and strife as a result.

The UK is better off well out of it ASAP IMHO.

Pulaski

Let the house of cards collapse and then salvage anything worthwhile.

homeandgardens

In case of Brexit I don't think much is going to change for Brits in Italy. Much more worried of an economic shrinking onion and the muppets governing it.

modicasa

Presumably by onion and muppets you mean the UK and Osborne?

homeandgardens

Pulaski

Surely the European Onion.

Sancho

What would leaving the EU mean for expats?