What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Jun 13th 2012, 4:07 pm
#91
I have a comma problem
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Fox Lake, IL (from Carrickfergus NI)
Posts: 49,598
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Me neither. And that reminds me, to answer this thread....one of my least favorite things in the US - rabid mentalist Republican offshoots, such as that 
I've thought long and hard about the whole "Freedom" concept here in the US...I can't for the life of me think of one single thing where it is "free-er" than the UK....in fact I can think of more aspects which makes the the US less free (tying of health insurance to work and "trapping" people in jobs being a big one).
The whole Freedom concept appears to based solely and utterly around the fact you can own guns here without any hassle....which is what these tea party lunatics exploit for their own ends.
I've thought long and hard about the whole "Freedom" concept here in the US...I can't for the life of me think of one single thing where it is "free-er" than the UK....in fact I can think of more aspects which makes the the US less free (tying of health insurance to work and "trapping" people in jobs being a big one).
The whole Freedom concept appears to based solely and utterly around the fact you can own guns here without any hassle....which is what these tea party lunatics exploit for their own ends.
You daren't point out they're being silly though, not unless you want an earful of poorly thought out rhetoric that'll make your brain vomit.
Jun 13th 2012, 4:16 pm
#92
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,518
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Me neither. And that reminds me, to answer this thread....one of my least favorite things in the US - rabid mentalist Republican offshoots, such as that
I've thought long and hard about the whole "Freedom" concept here in the US...I can't for the life of me think of one single thing where it is "free-er" than the UK....in fact I can think of more aspects which makes the the US less free (tying of health insurance to work and "trapping" people in jobs being a big one).
The whole Freedom concept appears to based solely and utterly around the fact you can own guns here without any hassle....which is what these tea party lunatics exploit for their own ends.
I've thought long and hard about the whole "Freedom" concept here in the US...I can't for the life of me think of one single thing where it is "free-er" than the UK....in fact I can think of more aspects which makes the the US less free (tying of health insurance to work and "trapping" people in jobs being a big one).
The whole Freedom concept appears to based solely and utterly around the fact you can own guns here without any hassle....which is what these tea party lunatics exploit for their own ends.
I also don't understand the 'true American success story' ie someone runs a totally ordinary business.
Jun 13th 2012, 4:17 pm
#93
Forum Regular
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 157
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Ooh, have we done (some) Irish-American's attitude to the IRA yet?
Jun 13th 2012, 4:20 pm
#94
I have a comma problem
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Fox Lake, IL (from Carrickfergus NI)
Posts: 49,598
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Not yet but I've actually had first hand experience of that. That's why I don't correct people who think I'm English or Scottish, so I don't have to deal with it.
Jun 13th 2012, 4:23 pm
#96
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Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Jun 13th 2012, 4:54 pm
#100
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Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
SultanOfSwing
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
Jun 13th 2012, 4:59 pm
#101
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Joined: Aug 2004
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 3,338
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
That one gets me as well, as if the US is the only free country in the world. Makes me think of all those poor, oppressed Frenchmen, Germans, Canadians, Italians ...
You daren't point out they're being silly though, not unless you want an earful of poorly thought out rhetoric that'll make your brain vomit.
You daren't point out they're being silly though, not unless you want an earful of poorly thought out rhetoric that'll make your brain vomit.
And like Sally said, "Free to rip you off" is quite a big one....in the US the difference in earnings of an average CEO vs the average employee is of several orders of magnitude greater than it is in Europe. And those deluded tea party nutjobs are basically saying to give the rich and powerful even more money, so they can make jobs for the "peasants"....the whole concept disgusts me, really does.
Jun 13th 2012, 5:06 pm
#102
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,518
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
SultanOfSwing
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
Personally, it spoils my enjoyment of a place in the same way it does for you, last time I went to San Francisco I was asking myself exactly the same questions.
Jun 13th 2012, 5:12 pm
#103
SUPER MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 88,022
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
SultanOfSwing
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
I read your initial post, and I was nodding my head in agreement with everything you said.
Now, I'm currently in one of the most beautiful cities in the US - San Diego. I walked through the excellent Horton Plaza last night, went to a concert at SD Balboa (Mozart, conductor David Atherton if you're interested....) and my hotel is costing me a small fortune. The food is great, the weather gorgeous, etc.
But what is SO wrong is that while I sit and enjoy the finery, I am surrounded by tramps, drunks, broken-down houses, schools in need of repair, a transport system that doesn't work, and over militarisation everywhere. Conspicuous and excessive wealth shoulder-to-shoulder with abject poverty.
The PRIMARY role of the state should be to provide a balance so that basic needs are met - no-one too rich, no-one too poor.
So much of the core infrastructure here is broken, old, under-invested. Even in Backward Britain we've rebuilt the rail network in the last 10 years to a point where passenger numbers are increasing rapidly and people are finally moving out of their polluting cars. And that has been driven not just by investment but by changing social attitudes to public transport driven by government policy. And the UK is 20+ years behind the rest of the EU.
How can people that purport to be far more "religious" that anyone in Western Europe not be more socially minded ? How can the whole basic tenet of the Christianity that I get rammed down my throat here be so ignored - that we are all in this together and that we must care for others as we would wish to be cared for ? What the hell is wrong in paying taxes to ensure that your fellow citizen is cared for in a way that you'd like to be cared for if/when you fall on hard times ? As one of the 90%+ of the populous that are agnostic/atheists in Europe, I don't have a problem with that....
Now I know that there are down-and-outs in every city of the world, but the contrasts here are just that much more stark. This is not in pockets - this is a failure of society to provide basic human rights over decades. - healthcare, housing, social welfare, equality of opportunity, etc. It is disgusting, and every American should be ashamed of it.
Instead, I hear total crap being spouted about "socialised" services, and how wrong France was to elect Hollande because he is a "socialist" and how he will wreck the country.
Maybe people have looked at the US, realised that the same yard-sticks that have been used by the Americans to measure the US are being applied to Europe, and drawing the conclusion that it is not Europe that is wrong, but the US with it's obsession with money. Maybe life is about MORE than simply turning a profit.... Maybe the rich need to be a little poorer and that has to be forced by government action. Maybe we all need to be a little less selfish and have less stuff.
One issue appears to be that our American cousins worked bloody hard to BUILD the country in the early 20th Century, and are now in their "rest" period. They put the kettle on in about 1972, and are still dunking the custard creams. And by build, I mean infrastructure (roads, rail, schools, houses) and attitudes (religion, the military, the responsibility of society, equality, the role of the state, free-trade, globalisation).
Europe has changed much in the last 15 years; grown up a lot. We've broadened our attitudes in many areas compared to the US which seems stuck in the past.
Jun 13th 2012, 5:13 pm
#104
I have a comma problem
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Fox Lake, IL (from Carrickfergus NI)
Posts: 49,598
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
I know....communist socialist Britain/Canada/Europe, if some of them are to be believed. I'm sure some of them really do believe that in Western Europe you can't move without say so.
And like Sally said, "Free to rip you off" is quite a big one....in the US the difference in earnings of an average CEO vs the average employee is of several orders of magnitude greater than it is in Europe. And those deluded tea party nutjobs are basically saying to give the rich and powerful even more money, so they can make jobs for the "peasants"....the whole concept disgusts me, really does.
And like Sally said, "Free to rip you off" is quite a big one....in the US the difference in earnings of an average CEO vs the average employee is of several orders of magnitude greater than it is in Europe. And those deluded tea party nutjobs are basically saying to give the rich and powerful even more money, so they can make jobs for the "peasants"....the whole concept disgusts me, really does.
Honestly, we're not far from feudalism here, when you think about it.
dlake02: Looks like you got it there. There really is a lot that one can like out here. Stunning natural beauty, great architecture, all the rest but it's as if nobody cares to bolster that with upping the standard of living for as many people as can possibly be done for. Instead all we get is rhetoric about 'communism', 'un-Americanism' or they hide behind the old classic of illegal immigration and blame it all on the Mexicans.
The religious thing is all for show. If one was to truly live one's life as a Christian they'd be bending over backwards to help people. That's all Jesus ever talked about was helping people, selfless acts, that kind of thing. Honestly, the only people I see who live their lives in such a way are usually atheists, agnostics or those people of faith who aren't a 'wear it like a badge' type.
Infrastructure (in Illinois, anyway) is a frickin' joke. There are pothoes on State Road 137 that are half the size of your car. Potholes in the middle of the road that seem to come out of nowhere. I'd never in my life popped a bead on a tyre until moving here and I've actually just had to have a wheel replaced due to damage from potholes. You always know when you've crossed into Illinois from Wisconsin, even if you miss the signs. That's when the road starts to shake your fillings loose
It's quite sad, though because America should be seeking to be great again - a world leader but it seems to not want to. We should be pioneering and embracing affordable hydrogen fuel technology; reclaiming the top spot in the tech world, raising the standard of living for all Americans as if to say 'look, world - this is how you do it'. No, it's all about having a big scary army and throwing your weight about, isn't it? I guess 'talk soft and carry a big stick' is still relevant 100 years on
Jun 13th 2012, 5:13 pm
#105
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Joined: Jan 2011
Location: West Sussex - did 3 years in the US...
Posts: 577
Re: What's your LEAST favorite thing about the US?
Personally, it spoils my enjoyment of a place in the same way it does for you, last time I went to San Francisco I was asking myself exactly the same questions.
Thoroughly depressing in 2012.